Can one be a gay or lesbian Catholic and still have a chaste romantic relationship?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Holly3278
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
H

Holly3278

Guest
Hey everyone. I was just wondering, if someone is a gay or lesbian Catholic, can they still have a romantic relationship with someone of the same sex so long as it is chaste? Personally, I lean towards no since homosexuality is objectively disordered. But what does the Church actually teach on this?
 
Good question. I would reason that even if they are choosing and willing and able to be chaste, the old saying still is true (of hetero and homosexuals alike) " the spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak." In other words, while I think it is possible such a relationship could (note I say could, not should) work, the occasion for sin would always be there and because acting on the need for physical romance is/would be border lining grave/mortal sin, it should not be pursued any further, for that reason (among others). It’s better if they remain very close friends, if they can manage this. Of course, it also depends on what exactly you mean by “romantic”. Flirtatious behavior that leads nowhere is still an occasion of sin, just as it is for men and women. They should be guarding each others virtues, regardless of sexual orientation. For them not to be doing that would be contradicting the ‘chaste’ element the relationship supposedly had.
 
Good question. I would reason that even if they are choosing and willing and able to be chaste, the old saying still is true (of hetero and homosexuals alike) " the spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak." In other words, while I think it is possible such a relationship could (note I say could, not should) work, the occasion for sin would always be there and because acting on the need for physical romance is/would be border lining grave/mortal sin, it should not be pursued any further, for that reason (among others). It’s better if they remain very close friends, if they can manage this. Of course, it also depends on what exactly you mean by “romantic”. Flirtatious behavior that leads nowhere is still an occasion of sin, just as it is for men and women.
Well, what I mean by “romantic” is the same as what I would mean for a heterosexual “romantic” couple. In other words, they love each other like as though they are meant to be life partners or whatever but yet they refrain from physically showing their love for each other.
 
I’m sure they can, there is nothing immoral, in being homosexual in itself.
 
A better way to state that:

Can a celibate same sex attracted Catholic have a chaste romantic relationship?

In our society, the terms “gay” and “lesbian” generally means an attitude and behaviorial shift has already occured toward the homosexual lifestyle and the acceptance of gay marriage.

A celibate person - with practice - can have chaste relationships with persons they otherwise would be sexually attracted too.

It’s not different than a single chaste heterosexual male who lives or works around females that he otherwise finds sexually attractive.

Or, a single chaste heterosexual female who lives or works around males …

The main decision is toward the protection of chastity and not to be influenced by “romantic” needs.
 
Hey everyone. I was just wondering, if someone is a gay or lesbian Catholic, can they still have a romantic relationship with someone of the same sex so long as it is chaste? Personally, I lean towards no since homosexuality is objectively disordered. But what does the Church actually teach on this?
No.
 
Well, what I mean by “romantic” is the same as what I would mean for a heterosexual “romantic” couple. In other words, they love each other like as though they are meant to be life partners or whatever but yet they refrain from physically showing their love for each other.
You responded shortly after I edited and updated my original post to you. I added a final two sentences which read:

"They should be guarding each others virtues, regardless of sexual orientation. For them not to be doing that would be contradicting the ‘chaste’ element the relationship supposedly had. "

I believe this answers your question, at least from my perspective. To further supplement my answer, the answer is still no. The key thing you said is ‘meant’, as in ‘meant to be together’. I would argue that they are not meant to be together, not by the moral law. What they are feeling would seem to transcend the law, as it does with any couple madly in love, but we know what the moral law is on this issue, so no. I find it hard to imagine how a gay couple can be romantic, and have that be ok, yet refrain from the physical element which is where the grave sin lies. My issue is whether they should even allow the relationship to develop to such a point that their chastity is challenged as the love grows, and compromises are made. Like I said, the occasion of sin has alot to do with this. If they want to be that close to each other that a physical relationship could, at any time, be fostered, then they are both playing with fire in terms of how they’re exposing themselves to each others physical desires, in what can only end (if developed any further) into a morally inappropriate relationship, both in the eyes of God and the Church.

Your scenario implies they could perfectly maintain the relationship from going any further, and I would question their ability to do so indefinitely as their love for each other would grow. Because they are only human and temptation is everywhere, I doubt their ability to maintain a strictly emotional attachment indefinitely, and the further along these lines they tread, the more moral obstacles they would run into. If they are truly invested in maintaining a chaste relationship and guarding each others virtues, especially if from a religious/spiritual perspective, then they would more than likely realize they should stop at very close best friends whom share an emotional bond without allowing the possibility for any advancement in the relationship. I’m sure it would be asking a lot of each other, but if they truly love each other, beyond the physical definition, they would be willing to learn to cope with and eventually settle on ‘just friends’ for the sake of their own and each others soul and spiritual health. True love, in this instance, would be willing to make that self-sacrifice for the other, and I’m sure, in His own way, God would bless this decision and bless them and give them happiness by another means, in accordance with His Holy Will.
 
If both persons agree to the chaste relationship agreement (partners yet as “brothers or as sisters”) I’d say in theory, yes.

Heterosexuals couples and heterosexual singles practice chastity of body and mind.

It’s an interesting question that you should ask of Courage:

couragerc.net/FAQs.html

Another good page of material:

couragerc.net/chastity.html
 
I have to agree. Why do Catholics (who are concerned with things like chastity) enter in to romantic relationships? To discern if this person could some day be their spouse. What would be the purpose of two people starting a romantic relationship that could never lead to marriage?

It’s analogous to asking if a married man can have a romantic relationship with another woman provided it is “chaste”. If it ought not to lead anywhere further, it would be dangerous to attempt.
 
If both persons agree to the chaste relationship agreement (partners yet as “brothers or as sisters”) I’d say in theory, yes.]
No.

Not in theory or practice.

We are not talking about a friendship…but a “romantic relationship”.

Such is for chaste relationships of a man and woman only…
 
Shall I (a man) have a chaste romantic relationship with my sister?

Of course not…
 
Holly redefined “romantic”.

“Well, what I mean by “romantic” is the same as what I would mean for a heterosexual “romantic” couple. In other words, they love each other like as though they are meant to be life partners or whatever but yet they refrain from physically showing their love for each other.”
 
If both persons agree to the chaste relationship agreement (partners yet as “brothers or as sisters”) I’d say in theory, yes.

Heterosexuals couples and heterosexual singles practice chastity of body and mind.

It’s an interesting question that you should ask of Courage:

couragerc.net/FAQs.html

Another good page of material:

couragerc.net/chastity.html
Hello, it use to be a sin by the church back years ago that if you lived with a person out of wedlock it was cohabitation. Since the laws have changed and they were good laws you could not even take your shoes off in a woman’s house if you were a man and it would be cohabitation against moral laws. Think of that and it was only in the 60’s that was still in effect but as usual California starts all the garbage off in the USA and other states follow.
 
Holly redefined “romantic”.

“Well, what I mean by “romantic” is the same as what I would mean for a heterosexual “romantic” couple. In other words, they love each other like as though they are meant to be life partners or whatever but yet they refrain from physically showing their love for each other.”
and so again the answer is no.

Just as I can not have a romantic relationship with my sister…as noted above.
 
The OP and some replies seem to indicate that as long as a relationship is non-sexual it is not trespassing on sinful territory. There are other factors such as nature to consider in that God created man male and female. When one in a same sex relationship takes on the characteristics contrary to their natural sex, then this would be a problem prior to anything sexual.

It is contrary, also, to the complementarity of the sexes as God made us to give oneself to another of the same sex, even without a sexual relationship, in that this may keep one from being open to a complimentary, opposite sex, relationship, which would fulfill the nature of such a complimentary design by being open to new life.

There are natural law considerations in take into account and the hypothetical nature of the question must speak of generalities since it does not apply to a specific case or question. It is up to us to take Church teachings and apply them in the order that applies to us that is directly relatable in our journey to eternal beatitude.
 
“It is contrary, also, to the complementarity of the sexes as God made us to give oneself to another of the same sex, even without a sexual relationship, in that this may keep one from being open to a complimentary, opposite sex, relationship, which would fulfill the nature of such a complimentary design by being open to new life.”

That’s a good point.
 
My point is that through the practice of chastity, people can change sexual love desires into agape love (the inclusive type of love that Jesus showed to all people).
 
  1. The temptation would be too great.
  2. It would cause scandal since people would believe they are sleeping together. It’s bad enough that heterosexual dating couples are assumed to be sleeping together, let’s not add to the problem.
  3. Gays and lesbians need to get help. Most of them have grown up in broken homes or have a bad relationship with a parent. Gay men often don’t have fathers or their fathers weren’t good to them. Lesbians often had a bad relationship with a man so they are turned off from men. Our GLBT brothers and sisters need friendship and mentorship, not to be romantically dating a person of the same sex.
 
Reading this thread, it’s little wonder that I, as a person cursed with same-sex attractions, hate myself for the curse. 😦

No, homosexual people can’t be trusted and have to live alone.

Better yet, how about this. Homosexual people only get a bed, a week’s worth of clothes (all marked with a prominent red “H” for homosexual), a Bible, a Missal, a Rosary and a candle and have to live in caves the mountains only coming down to do menial labor for their betters.
 
LCMS,

Are you familiar with the Courage Apostolate? If so, have they been helpful with SSA issues?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top