Can we be over zealous in protecting tradition?

[JReducation]

Before I tell the anecdote, you have to know the context. Traditionalist Franciscans do not use the Internet unless you’re a superior or you need it as tool. For the most part, those friars never see forums, blogs, or other forms of communication on the internet.

Today, I was reviewing some things on here and one of the brothers came in and asked me what I was up to. You know, the kind of greeting that we often give to another person. “What ya’ doing?”

I said, “You want to see? Come and look.”

Actually I was in Cath News, I wanted to know if the press had guessed correctly who the new Secretary of State at Vatican City would be. As I navigated from one thread to another, Brother was reading along quietly. I showed him a few other forums: TC, L & S, Scripture and I believe it was NC Religions.

He got up to leave and then turned and looked at me with a rather quizzical look on his face. He said something that made me think. Here is what he asked?

“Father, why do these folks care about all of these things? Most of this has nothing to do with our daily lives.”

I asked him to give me an example.

He pointed out to something that someone had posted on the Holy Father’s visit with the Jordanian king and queen. He said, “I could care less if the pope genuflected to them. I don’t live with the pope. These things are interesting, as is any other article in the society column, but they have nothing to do with my life. It would not be something that I would concern myself with. Besides, I’m not the pope’s guardian.”

I went about my business. Of course, CAF is one of my apostolic assignments. So what people post is my business. I started to read threads with Brother’s question in mind. As I did I though to myself, "Brother B is right. There are so many concerns here that have nothing to do with the lives of these folks. The answers will not make them holier husbands, mothers, fathers, sons, daughters or members of the Church. Their life of prayer, penance and charity does not ride on the answer to some of these questions, such as who should wear a biretta or what happens if the priest goes to the supermarket in his jeans instead of his collar. If I took my cue from the next guy, I would be in trouble. God does not make us to be like the next guy. He makes us to be the persons we are and to try to succeed in our given roles in life.

Maybe, we do pay too much attention to things that are not going to change our lives in any way and at the end of the day, we end up getting upset because things are not perfect or because someone was mean to us or simply because no one will hear what we have to say. Are we really doing something good for our souls by taking on concerns that have nothing to do with who we are and what God has called us to do?

That’s not protecting tradition. That’s just giving ourselves an ulcer. To be over zealous is not a good thing. In fact, it can be detrimental to our spiritual life, because it takes away interior silence and peace.

 

[Country_Gal]

Very good point. I also feel the same way about secular events. Most of the things on the news don’t impact my daily life, except for the weather report.

 

[JustaServant]

:clapping::clapping::clapping::clapping:
Thank you Brother.
I learned this while still across the Tiber. Endless divisions over Calvinism, Contemporary Christian music, Bible versions, dress standards, end times theology.
As if God is going to quiz us on Judgement Day to see if we pass the test for eternal life. Faith, hope, love, and charity are found in the Heart of God, not the smells and bells of “correct liturgical process”.

 

[Domnall]

I totally get where you’re coming from, Brother. Lots of these things are far less important than our prayer lives, our relationship to others and with God. However, I think people feel that, though they may not be impacted directly, these things have an impact.

You’ve read the thread on the bowing, so you know many people think that the Holy Father’s actions will negatively impact peoples’ impressions of the Church.

Or, people think that priests should be in a collar (or that you should be in your tunic at all times ) because, to them, it makes the church move visible and sets a good example.

Plus, think back to your pre-Franciscan life. Were you more willing to have opinions on things that didn’t really concern you? If you didn’t really, my apologize! However, those of us who aren’t religious work under the perceived need to have opinions about everything.

Overall, I think people who make these comments want what they think is best for the Church. However, others like to just complain.

 

[jimmy]

Good post Fr. I noticed it on the moral theology forum, and on the others to some extent when people ask ‘is this a sin’. It is usually some abstract situation that has nothing to do with daily life. I didn’t think about it in relation to the rest of the threads. But it does seem to be true. Almost every discussion we have is irrelevant to our real life.

I don’t know whether it is zealousness or boredom. Rather than doing something worthwhile we are doing sitting on the computer arguing about nothing essentially.

 

[JReducation]

First, please accept my humble thanks for not coming down on me or throwing rotten tomatoes my way. By the way, I’m allergic to tomatoes. There are some good points here.

I also feel the same way about secular events. Most of the things on the news don’t impact my daily life, except for the weather report.

This is such a good point. One of the things that I notice is that when we (include me in this too) we read something important in secular news, we get all upset for about 10 minutes and then we don’t do anything about it. We don’t write a letter to our senator or tell our neighbors about what the Church has to say regarding this possible military action against Syria or the moral obligation to respect the President, even when he does something dumb or wrong. We just sit there and let others say really ugly things.

Either things have nothing to do with us and we get upset or we get upset over those things that have something to do with us, but it goes no further than an rant.

I totally get where you’re coming from, Brother. Lots of these things are far less important than our prayer lives, our relationship to others and with God. However, I think people feel that, though they may not be impacted directly, these things have an impact.

Everything in life has impact. There is a theory in physics that if you move a blade of grass you change the course of history. The key is whether the impact is going to affect my relationship with God and neighbor.

You’ve read the thread on the bowing, so you know many people think that the Holy Father’s actions will negatively impact peoples’ impressions of the Church.

It’s funny, because this is the thread that Brother B said, “I don’t care if he genuflects to the queen.” In other words, people have already made up their minds about most things no matter what the pope does. And for those like Brother B, who has not made up his mind about anything regarding the pope, this is not important, because he does not live with the pope or with the world.

His reaction was to think that other people’s reactions were over the top and he was more concerned that he has to figure out where to put his next father’s class, because tomorrow is Labor Day. What an oxymoron that he can’t talk to fathers about labor and delivery on labor day. LOL He has to juggle his schedule and that does affect his life and the lives of the people he serves.

Or, people think that priests should be in a collar (or that you should be in your tunic at all times ) because, to them, it makes the church move visible and sets a good example.

I believe you when you say that people believe this. I’ve been told this many times. In fact, one woman at the local parish no longer speaks to me because of this. Long story very short. I was not wearing my habit for a reason. She thought I was setting a bad example. My response to her was, “Are you finished with your moral duties so that you now have time to monitor mine?” That didn’t go over too well.

Plus, think back to your pre-Franciscan life. Were you more willing to have opinions on things that didn’t really concern you?

No. I was raised by Franciscans. I attended Franciscan schools since grade 3. I was always taught to focus, keep it simple, obey no matter what, and when in doubt, read the admonitions of St. Francis. Many of us who went through that system, to this day follow those spiritual guidelines. Those who went through it and no longer follow these guidelines are never happy people.

However, those of us who aren’t religious work under the perceived need to have opinions about everything.

I’m fascinated by this part that I bolded. Can you say more? I would like to understand this better, because I do a lot of spiritual direction and one thing that often comes up is the difference between caring for my neighbor and being a busybody. You just may have hit on something that will help my ministry of spiritual guidance.

Overall, I think people who make these comments want what they think is best for the Church. However, others like to just complain.

I have no doubts about this. Some people love the Church and some people love to gripe. There are other people who want to get to heaven vicariously. The latter is not possible.

 

[Timothysis]

I don’t know whether it is zealousness or boredom. Rather than doing something worthwhile we are doing sitting on the computer arguing about nothing essentially.

That has been my impression here on CAF for the past couple of years. When I first joined, I learned so much about the faith but lately it seems that there are (in Brother’s own words) 15,000 theologians present here who think that they are the last judgement on any and all topics. It really does get tiresome.

 

[Bonnie]

But…but…my opinion is important! Without my wisdom your life will be incomplete!

This thread puts me in mind of what Thoreau said about the trans-Atlantic telegraph: "Perchance the first news that will leak through into the broad, flapping American ear will be that the Princess Adelaide has the whooping cough.”

Our collective American ear is still flapping wildly.

 

[Country_Gal]

That has been my impression here on CAF for the past couple of years. When I first joined, I learned so much about the faith but lately it seems that there are (in Brother’s own words) 15,000 theologians present here who think that they are the last judgement on any and all topics. It really does get tiresome.

Good description.

The only threads that get a lot of (name removed by moderator)ut are the controversial ones. I posted a positive news one and maybe 4 people responded.

For me coming here is a diversion from my busy life. Also, I’ve been toying with returning to the Church. But it’s not an encouraging site for that. It’s a good place to get discouraged because a few people will make rude remarks, or go for the jugular if you show any weakness that they can pounce on.

 

[Sirach2]

JReducation:

I believe you when you say that people believe this. I’ve been told this many times. In fact, one woman at the local parish no longer speaks to me because of this. Long story very short. I was not wearing my habit for a reason. She thought I was setting a bad example. My response to her was, “Are you finished with your moral duties so that you now have time to monitor mine?” That didn’t go over too well.

You have a very pertinent way of handling a busy-body, especially asking a question. It makes a person think.

I’m fascinated by this part that I bolded. Can you say more? I would like to understand this better, because I do a lot of spiritual direction and one thing that often comes up is the difference between caring for my neighbor and being a busybody. You just may have hit on something that will help my ministry of spiritual guidance.

If you can accept some wisdom from an underling, Brother, I believe our Carmelite Doctor, St. John of the Cross, gives sound and wise instruction on this. He describes many of these imperfections that belong to “beginners” under the various “spiritual” capital vices. For instance, the one the most fall into is spiritual pride. The beginning of this chapter explains it well, I believe, but other examples of spiritual pride are explained throughout the chapter. He p(name removed by moderator)oints many imperfections in the other spiritual vices, also.

Certainly, many of these folks would never agree that they are beginners, and in truth, they have received many gifts and consolations from God. They are well beyond the state of someone newly getting serious about their relationship with Him by frequenting the sacraments and avoiding sin.

1. These beginners feel so fervent and diligent in their spiritual exercises and undertakings that a certain kind of secret pride is generated in them that begets a complacency with themselves and their accomplishments, even though holy works do of their very nature cause humility. Then they develop a somewhat vain - at times very vain - desire to speak of spiritual things in others’ presence, and sometimes even to instruct rather than be instructed; in their hearts they condemn others who do not seem to have the kind of devotion they would like them to have, and sometimes they give expression to this criticism like the pharisee who despised the publican while he boasted and praised God for the good deeds he himself accomplished

These imperfections, he notes, are practiced by those who are very devout, but for the most part, they are hidden from themselves and buried deep within their subconsciouness. It is for this reason that God leads them into various trials of the Dark Night to purify them and humble them. Had I not recognized many of these imperfections in myself, it would deprive me of all patience with others who are in the same situation. I see the cause, but until I am totally purified in the Night, I don’t know the answer, since it is God alone who will accomplish the work of perfection, as He best knows each of us.

But it will be painful, and perhaps the lashings they receive from others that offends so many of their proud sensitivities is a trial in itself that will serve to purify. When devotion is hard, when prayer becomes difficult, and the relish for things spiritual wanes due to God’s action, that is when they will learn who they are before Him. I doubt that our words will accomplish very much other than to rile them in the meanwhile.

The beauty is that they ARE pleasing to God, although very much a beginner, spiritually. It helps to remember that.

 

[Petaro]

Br. JR Your posts that I have seen are full of wisdom. You are correct in that a great deal of what is discussed on Catholic Answers are irrelevant to our lives; of academic interest only; or none of our business. But is this not a mere product of Man’s inquiring mind. Most physics is outside the import of my daily life, but without it we are in trouble. I find a worrying form of scrupulosity in many of the posts and wonder if it is a cultural malaise in the American psyche; but I also see the failure of the Church’s approach to the Sacrament of Reconciliation. You are lucky you do not have to worry about finding a priest who has the time, much less the wisdom to give good advice along with the forgiveness of God. The Franciscan life must be so peaceful in its simplicity. It is not that way out here. Competing issues of family; work and the stresses of daily life make debate on the meaning and worth of the Pope bowing to some Queen meaningless ofcourse; yet a lot of people feel so powerless in their lives that they seek to make comment on the issue . It is like women around the well. But surely it is harmless and so human. If people are drawn to talk of their faith, surely they will be more drawn to the good. Considering the dangers of the internet Catholic Answers does not rate high on that scale. Better these theologians than the sophistry of some of the modern Jesuits that fall so far below their heritage. Rejoice in our simplicity as in Francis grabbing the nearest rock to rebuild the Church. Rejoice in our Pharisaic pilpuls as we look to the best way to love God. AMDG

 

[zab]

Maybe this is the wrong thread for me to express my thoughts of recent days but this seems to be as good of place as any. The good brother was probably better off not sticking around to read the rest of the stuff that came across the computer screen. But it is good to have people like Brother Jay assigned to CAF as an apostolate to guide people where needed. I have participated on these forums for several years now but have only donated to Catholic Answers on a few rare occasions. Lately I have read a few nasty articles and watched one video attacking Catholic Answers that does not deserve repeating. Despite my several little disputes, feeling like I was being treated unfairly here, my over-all impression of Catholic Answers is a good one. There will always be a few bad apples to make things bad for others at times, but we just have to learn to communicate with each other in a way that shows respect while at times maintaining differences of opinion. It can be an opportunity to grow in virtue if we let it. And sometimes we may need to take a break or limit our time on the forums. I finally clicked on that donation button. Hope more will too.

 

[Domnall]

I’m fascinated by this part that I bolded. Can you say more? I would like to understand this better, because I do a lot of spiritual direction and one thing that often comes up is the difference between caring for my neighbor and being a busybody. You just may have hit on something that will help my ministry of spiritual guidance.

I’ll see what I can put together. When I talk about the perceived need, I mean that many people think they have a need to comment when in fact they do not.

Possibly the oldest version of this is gossip. When we gossip, we’re making statements about other people, and we often value-judge them to others. Obviously we have no place in saying this, but we do so anyway.

However, I think the modern world makes giving your opinion so much easier. Mind you. I’m speaking from the perspective of a 21 year old college student. For example, Catholic Answers Forum, any blog, Facebook, Twitter, and Tumblr give us a platform to state our opinion or comment on others’. We’ve turned into a culture where individual opinions matter more than the collective opinion. No, I don’t mean “the opinion of the masses.” There’s a problem when news networks comment on what the blogosphere is up to.

But, with rugged individuality on the rise, with people valuing their own intellect and with relativism on the rise, people feel entitled to opinions.

I study history. When I want to make a claim about any particular event in history and write a paper on it, I need evidence to back it up. Not just any evidence will do. I have to apply the art of historiography to my sources to value judge their merits. Sociological journals and my grandmother tell very different stories on forced busing in Boston during the 70s. Actually, they really do. Point aside, if I didn’t critically look at those sources through tried-and-true historical reasoning, I could present a skewed and forced opinion of a historical event rather than what actually happened.

This comes 'round to individuality. We see here on the forum a lot of the time that people can provide all sorts of documentation, excerpts from Papal Bulls, Trent, Crossing the Threshold of Hope or what have you to make their argument. However, they aren’t trying to come to discover the truth, but to merely filter what’s out there to support their notions.

In short, that may be why people have a perceived need to comment. 1) Because the beliefs on rugged individualism are there and 2) There is information, when not properly explained, that helps back up sometimes false opinions. And, in a world of relativism, you’re not allowed to call someone’s opinion wrong.

/rant.

Sorry about the length, Brother.

 

[Timothysis]

Good description.
Also, I’ve been toying with returning to the Church. But it’s not an encouraging site for that. It’s a good place to get discouraged because a few people will make rude remarks, or go for the jugular if you show any weakness that they can pounce on.

Aw, Country Gal, don’t let a few big mouths here discourage you from returning to the Church. The thing to do is filter through most of the nonsense here to find the things that are interesting to you and the questions you have. Idiots are a dime a dozen and they can be found everywhere. Just ignore them and keep your sites set on the final goal. Know that Jesus wants you back.

 

[thistle]

Before I tell the anecdote, you have to know the context. Traditionalist Franciscans do not use the Internet unless you’re a superior or you need it as tool. For the most part, those friars never see forums, blogs, or other forms of communication on the internet.

Today, I was reviewing some things on here and one of the brothers came in and asked me what I was up to. You know, the kind of greeting that we often give to another person. “What ya’ doing?”

I said, “You want to see? Come and look.”

Actually I was in Cath News, I wanted to know if the press had guessed correctly who the new Secretary of State at Vatican City would be. As I navigated from one thread to another, Brother was reading along quietly. I showed him a few other forums: TC, L & S, Scripture and I believe it was NC Religions.

He got up to leave and then turned and looked at me with a rather quizzical look on his face. He said something that made me think. Here is what he asked?

“Father, why do these folks care about all of these things? Most of this has nothing to do with our daily lives.”

I asked him to give me an example.

He pointed out to something that someone had posted on the Holy Father’s visit with the Jordanian king and queen. He said, “I could care less if the pope genuflected to them. I don’t live with the pope. These things are interesting, as is any other article in the society column, but they have nothing to do with my life. It would not be something that I would concern myself with. Besides, I’m not the pope’s guardian.”

I went about my business. Of course, CAF is one of my apostolic assignments. So what people post is my business. I started to read threads with Brother’s question in mind. As I did I though to myself, "Brother B is right. There are so many concerns here that have nothing to do with the lives of these folks. The answers will not make them holier husbands, mothers, fathers, sons, daughters or members of the Church. Their life of prayer, penance and charity does not ride on the answer to some of these questions, such as who should wear a biretta or what happens if the priest goes to the supermarket in his jeans instead of his collar. If I took my cue from the next guy, I would be in trouble. God does not make us to be like the next guy. He makes us to be the persons we are and to try to succeed in our given roles in life.

Maybe, we do pay too much attention to things that are not going to change our lives in any way and at the end of the day, we end up getting upset because things are not perfect or because someone was mean to us or simply because no one will hear what we have to say. Are we really doing something good for our souls by taking on concerns that have nothing to do with who we are and what God has called us to do?

That’s not protecting tradition. That’s just giving ourselves an ulcer. To be over zealous is not a good thing. In fact, it can be detrimental to our spiritual life, because it takes away interior silence and peace.

I agree with you and I am reminded of something St John of the Cross said.

“Some souls suffer from another kind of spiritual anger. They watch over others with a kind of restless fervor, perpetually annoyed by the transgressions they perceive. The impulse arises to reprove the other souls in an angry way. Sometimes they even indulge this nasty urge, elevating themselves as masters of virtue. This is all contrary to spiritual meekness.”

 

[JReducation]

There is so much wisdom in these few posts. Where to start? OK, let me begin this way. Without your knowing it or me planning it, we seem to have engaged in a colloquy, which is a very old custom in Catholic tradition. I wish we have more of it everywhere.

Back in the day of the great reformers like Francis and Dominic, the two of them would just sit around a shoot the breeze with whomever they met. They were both very friendly chaps, very personable and both has a great sense of humor, which we should seek to emulate. We always look to emulate the blood and guts penances that they did and forget that they were well known for their laughter, singing and pranks. These conversations were called a colloquy. Today, they are only had in Franciscan and Dominican houses. But for a very long time, they happened on the street corners. It’s the Mendicant version of the old lyceums and academies. A lot of wisdom came out of there. This is a cyber colloquy.

But…but…my opinion is important! Without my wisdom your life will be incomplete!

Augustine warned about this. Check out his rule.

Our collective American ear is still flapping wildly.

Maybe this is the wrong thread for me to express my thoughts of recent days but this seems to be as good of place as any. The good brother was probably better off not sticking around to read the rest of the stuff that came across the computer screen.

I rarely blush, but there have been a few times where I must admit that I have been embarrassed for someone else. Did you ever have that experience?

my over-all impression of Catholic Answers is a good one.

Several Franciscans have blogs, including me. The nasties that people leave as comments that we can’t publish would make a sailor look like an innocent child. Yes, Catholic Answers is a much safer place than many blogs and forums around. The one thing that always bothers me is when people gratuitously use vulgarity and insult. I had someone say to me once, “It’s only a venial sin.” Well guess what sweetie, venial sins that are committed counting on God’s forgiveness are not forgiven, because you have no contrition. Had you any contrition, you would be sorry the moment someone pointed it out.

There will always be a few bad apples to make things bad for others at times,

I grew up in central Virginia. Once upon a time, it was quite rural. If you know anything about farming, you know that in every harvest there are going to be some rotten fruits. Just throw them out.

I finally clicked on that donation button. Hope more will too.

I’m glad that you mentioned this. I’ve heard people say that they won’t donate to CA because they heard this or saw that. Here’s my take on it. If I order pizza, I’m embarrassed to let the delivery man go away without a tip, even though Domino’s is not NY Pizza. Yum Yum. The say for a waiter at a restaurant or some other person who provides a service. Stop and think. Dominos is not giving away it’s pizza. You’re paying for it. But you still tip the delivery man. CA gives away its service and it’s better than Dominos.

Br. JR Your posts that I have seen are full of wisdom.

You don’t read much do you?

I find a worrying form of scrupulosity in many of the posts

I believe that. And do you know that’s how the Protestant Reformation began. Calvin and Luther were the most scrupulous men around. Their faith was toxic. It was killing them and they in turn were killing those who followed them. You see a great many Luthers and Calvins in forums. "Should the priest have made five signs of the cross over the paten or are four enough for validity? " I almost want to shout through the screen, “DID HE SAY THE WORDS OF CONSECRATION OVER BREAD AND WINE???”

I love to share stories, in case you have not noticed.

We always have the EF on holy days except for the Franciscan ones and the Easter Triduum. The Franciscan holy days are not in the old Roman Missal and the Easter Triduum, we were prohibited from using the EF. We do as we’re told. End of story. But there was one fellow who attended one of our EF masses. At the end, he goes up to Brother C and said, “Brother, I don’t mean any disrespect, but I could hear you when you were praying the Canon.” We explained to him that the old way that Franciscans celebrated the EF was always dialogue. It was not the EF then. You were supposed to be heard. He was so relieved. That is scrupulous. Even if you don’t have permission to do it aloud, it is not a capital offense or if someone speaks louder than others, you’re going to hear him. I remember an older priest whom I think was hard of hearing. We were all bound to the silence of the confessional, if you get my meaning.

You are lucky you do not have to worry about finding a priest who has the time, much less the wisdom to give good advice

That’s because my spiritual director is a lay brother, not a priest.

 

[JReducation]

The Franciscan life must be so peaceful in its simplicity.

It’s a pain in the butt. Get a bunch of men under one roof or a bunch of women and you have a recipe for Excedrin. Human being are human no matter how you dress them. The difference may be that in our way of live, novelty is welcome. Francis was one of the most innovative religious superiors of his time. Novelty is part of the Franciscan tradition. That’s why we have so many branches of the one order.

We have one rule. As time passes things happen that Francis did not foresee. Statutes have to be written to address these new situations. So you write what is called a constitution to go along with the rule that St. Francis wrote. If a group cannot agree on how to address the new situation, no problem. You just create two new communities, both Franciscan, because they come from the say father. Each has a set of statutes that it can live with. So the Franciscan family is like a tree. There are the original Friars Minor Coventuals. They are the trunk. From there come all of the other branches. At some point or another, each was a novel idea. As time passes, no one remembers that it was novelty once upon a time. For us, the word novelty is not a dirty word. It’s part of our tradition. It’s how we cope with a changing world.

Competing issues of family; work and the stresses of daily life

When laymen come to me for spiritual direction and they tell me about the wife, kids, job, economy and the pope, I tell them this. "Son, you’re in the HOV Lane to heaven. Pray for me, because I’m in the far right lane and it’s damn slow."

Better these theologians than the sophistry of some of the modern Jesuits that fall so far below their heritage.

Let’s be nice to the Jesuits. There are 20,000 of them. They do not have a monopoly on sophistry. They would like to, but the Dominicans and Franciscans won’t let them get one up on us.

Rejoice in our simplicity as in Francis grabbing the nearest rock to rebuild the Church. Rejoice in our Pharisaic pilpuls as we look to the best way to love God. AMDG

I rejoice in simplicity. I fail to find simplicity in stubbornness and obsessiveness. They’re not the same as simplicity.

If you can accept some wisdom from an underling, Brother

So where is the underling?

I believe our Carmelite Doctor, St. John of the Cross, gives sound and wise instruction on this. He describes many of these imperfections that belong to “beginners” under the various “spiritual” capital vices.

There is a lot of spiritual pride going around these days. It’s contagious. I’m not being cheeky. People actually compete to see who can be more orthodox on the right and on the left, who can be more compassionate.

Good description.

The only threads that get a lot of (name removed by moderator)ut are the controversial ones. I posted a positive news one and maybe 4 people responded.

CAF threads are often like the NYT

For me coming here is a diversion from my busy life. Also, I’ve been toying with returning to the Church. But it’s not an encouraging site for that. It’s a good place to get discouraged because a few people will make rude remarks, or go for the jugular if you show any weakness that they can pounce on.

Catholic forums are the worse place in the world for anyone who is looking to come into Catholicism or to revert. I can suggest some good blogs, books and TV programs on EWTN. Just PM me.

That has been my impression here on CAF for the past couple of years. When I first joined, I learned so much about the faith but lately it seems that there are (in Brother’s own words) 15,000 theologians present here who think that they are the last judgement on any and all topics. It really does get tiresome.

Tim, the issue is not that there are that many theologians. The issue is that all claim infallibility. It’s like the fundamentalist neighbor across the street from us where we live. He is a lovely person. He approached me one day to warn me about the dangers of what I was practicing. After listening politely for a few minutes I said, “Fortunately for me, I’m Catholic and we have infallibility to protect us.”

He said, “There is no such thing.”

“What do you mean,” I said.

“No man is infallible.” he said.

“How do you know this?” I asked.

“I read the word of God and the Holy Spirit guides me.” he answered.

So I said, “So I’m right. There is at least one infallible person on earth.” Then I pointed at him.

 

[Heliotropium]

Before I tell the anecdote, you have to know the context. Traditionalist Franciscans do not use the Internet unless you’re a superior or you need it as tool. For the most part, those friars never see forums, blogs, or other forms of communication on the internet.

Today, I was reviewing some things on here and one of the brothers came in and asked me what I was up to. You know, the kind of greeting that we often give to another person. “What ya’ doing?”

I said, “You want to see? Come and look.”

Actually I was in Cath News, I wanted to know if the press had guessed correctly who the new Secretary of State at Vatican City would be. As I navigated from one thread to another, Brother was reading along quietly. I showed him a few other forums: TC, L & S, Scripture and I believe it was NC Religions.

He got up to leave and then turned and looked at me with a rather quizzical look on his face. He said something that made me think. Here is what he asked?

“Father, why do these folks care about all of these things? Most of this has nothing to do with our daily lives.”

I asked him to give me an example.

He pointed out to something that someone had posted on the Holy Father’s visit with the Jordanian king and queen. He said, “I could care less if the pope genuflected to them. I don’t live with the pope. These things are interesting, as is any other article in the society column, but they have nothing to do with my life. It would not be something that I would concern myself with. Besides, I’m not the pope’s guardian.”

I went about my business. Of course, CAF is one of my apostolic assignments. So what people post is my business. I started to read threads with Brother’s question in mind. As I did I though to myself, "Brother B is right. There are so many concerns here that have nothing to do with the lives of these folks. The answers will not make them holier husbands, mothers, fathers, sons, daughters or members of the Church. Their life of prayer, penance and charity does not ride on the answer to some of these questions, such as who should wear a biretta or what happens if the priest goes to the supermarket in his jeans instead of his collar. If I took my cue from the next guy, I would be in trouble. God does not make us to be like the next guy. He makes us to be the persons we are and to try to succeed in our given roles in life.

Maybe, we do pay too much attention to things that are not going to change our lives in any way and at the end of the day, we end up getting upset because things are not perfect or because someone was mean to us or simply because no one will hear what we have to say. Are we really doing something good for our souls by taking on concerns that have nothing to do with who we are and what God has called us to do?

That’s not protecting tradition. That’s just giving ourselves an ulcer. To be over zealous is not a good thing. In fact, it can be detrimental to our spiritual life, because it takes away interior silence and peace.

As my priest said to me, we should be wary of extremes. Loving the traditions of the Church is a good thing; however harping on the Pope over bowing is where we cross the line and have entered extremist territory. Yet holding an attitude which is indifferent to the traditions of the Church or whether they’re performed is another spirit in where we have crossed the lines and have entered extremist territory.

Some people have this incorrect notion that traditions do not allow us to be flexible. For example if I’m passing a Church I will practice the tradition of making the sign of the cross because Christ is present in the Blessed Sacrament. Yet if I’m walking by the Church and someone walking toward me slips and needs me to catch them, lest they fall on their face, then I’m going to forgo the tradition of crossing myself so I can help my neighbor.

 

[Cat]

I think many of come here because we don’t have a big jolly group of real people in our off-line lives that we can sit down and chat with about religious topics at 5:30 in the morning while enjoying our morning brew (which for me is a pop).

That’s why I come here. I like to talk, and I like to hear others talk. I personally wish we could all meet daily for an hour or so and chat in person, but since we can’t, I am perfectly happy to chat over the wires.

I agree with the good Brother that most of what we talk about here has nothing to do with our daily lives, but many of us just like to talk and hear talk whether or not it has anything to do with us. It’s the talk that we like, and the topic doesn’t really matter. Movie stars, politics, medicine, religion, holiday traditions, history, kids, ghosts…it’s all good to talk about.

My dad (RIP) was like that–he would talk to anyone about anything, and he would listen to anyone talk about anything. It was his greatest pleasure in life–a good sit-down session with black coffee and plenty of talk. He was so popular–everyone knew him and hailed him with joy whenever they saw him walk into a restaurant. I miss that so much.

He had plenty of silence–he was a farmer, so he spent hours in a tractor in the fields, or doing chores in a barn.

I, too, have plenty of silence. I like silence.

But I like talk, too.

As I become older, I hope that the day will come when I’ll meet all my friends and acquaintances at a McDonald’s or some other gathering place and sit for an hour or two of talk. That would be heaven to me.

 

[Heliotropium]

I think many of come here because we don’t have a big jolly group of real people in our off-line lives that we can sit down and chat with about religious topics at 5:30 in the morning while enjoying our morning brew (which for me is a pop).

That’s why I come here. I like to talk, and I like to hear others talk. I personally wish we could all meet daily for an hour or so and chat in person, but since we can’t, I am perfectly happy to chat over the wires.

I agree with the good Brother that most of what we talk about here has nothing to do with our daily lives, but many of us just like to talk and hear talk whether or not it has anything to do with us. It’s the talk that we like, and the topic doesn’t really matter. Movie stars, politics, medicine, religion, holiday traditions, history, kids, ghosts…it’s all good to talk about.

My dad (RIP) was like that–he would talk to anyone about anything, and he would listen to anyone talk about anything. It was his greatest pleasure in life–a good sit-down session with black coffee and plenty of talk. He was so popular–everyone knew him and hailed him with joy whenever they saw him walk into a restaurant. I miss that so much.

He had plenty of silence–he was a farmer, so he spent hours in a tractor in the fields, or doing chores in a barn.

I, too, have plenty of silence. I like silence.

But I like talk, too.

As I become older, I hope that the day will come when I’ll meet all my friends and acquaintances at a McDonald’s or some other gathering place and sit for an hour or two of talk. That would be heaven to me.

So true.