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WannabeSaint
Guest
I’ve heard it said by posters on here that one can never have absolute certainty they fully consented to a sin. Would this imply that we can never know if we have free will or not?
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Greenfields
Guest
We do have free will.
As to being unsure about sin …ask a priest.God bless .
As to being unsure about sin …ask a priest.God bless .
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CRV
Guest
Friend A. " That’s a lovely shade of red, is that your natural color?"
Friend B. “Yes, it is. Ever since I was a little girl, people have complimented me on the color of my hair”
Friend B is in no doubt that they lied.
Possible there are doubtful sins? Yes, but here you 're getting more into subjective compared to objective. A doubtful sin is one where is there is uncertainty in regard to its commission or its gravity.
Sin is any wilful action in thought, word, deed or omission which is contrary to the law of God. That’s why it is also said, you can’t sin by accident. You have to know it is wrong but still choose/decide to do it anyway - as in the example above. Everyone knows whether Catholic or not, that it is wrong to lie.
So if you know something is wrong, but do it without thinking about it - eg. the popular example of eating flesh meat on a day of abstinence when one didn’t realize it was a day of abstinence or didn’t think of the prohibition, yet ate meat. In this case there is no sin, because the person did not will to break the abstinence law. Objectively they ate the meat and so broke the law, but subjectively they didn’t incur guilt because it was not a willful breaking of the law. To sin we choose to do the wrong thing, it is a deliberate act of the will.
In a grave matter, full consent is necessary. Anything less than that ie partial consent, makes the sin venial.
We have free will to sin or not sin.
As this can be quite an indepth discussion it may be better to have this conversation with your priest.
Friend B. “Yes, it is. Ever since I was a little girl, people have complimented me on the color of my hair”
Friend B is in no doubt that they lied.
Possible there are doubtful sins? Yes, but here you 're getting more into subjective compared to objective. A doubtful sin is one where is there is uncertainty in regard to its commission or its gravity.
Sin is any wilful action in thought, word, deed or omission which is contrary to the law of God. That’s why it is also said, you can’t sin by accident. You have to know it is wrong but still choose/decide to do it anyway - as in the example above. Everyone knows whether Catholic or not, that it is wrong to lie.
So if you know something is wrong, but do it without thinking about it - eg. the popular example of eating flesh meat on a day of abstinence when one didn’t realize it was a day of abstinence or didn’t think of the prohibition, yet ate meat. In this case there is no sin, because the person did not will to break the abstinence law. Objectively they ate the meat and so broke the law, but subjectively they didn’t incur guilt because it was not a willful breaking of the law. To sin we choose to do the wrong thing, it is a deliberate act of the will.
In a grave matter, full consent is necessary. Anything less than that ie partial consent, makes the sin venial.
We have free will to sin or not sin.
As this can be quite an indepth discussion it may be better to have this conversation with your priest.
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PrisonerOfChrist
Guest
Keep it simple. When you hear your conscience saying “that is wrong” but you choose to ignore it and proceed with the sin. I would say that was exercising full consent of the will
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la_petit_fleur
Guest
Is this true in every case? If you accidentally take the Lord’s name in vain, you’ve still neglected to Revere God. If you accidentally kill someone with your car, that would be a sin, wouldn’t it?
And aren’t a lot if sins of ommision done accidentally? If I neglect to do works of mercy because I’m just not thinking of others, wouldn’t that be sin?
Not to hijack the thread, I agree with your basic premise, and I don’t know about anyone else, but I certainly know if I’ve chosen to sin on purpose! It’s pretty easy to see.
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LilyM
Guest
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Or were honestly mistaken orr unaware (e.g. sleeping through your alarm on Sunday morning and missing the only available Mass for the dag)
Or were honestly mistaken orr unaware (e.g. sleeping through your alarm on Sunday morning and missing the only available Mass for the dag)
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LilyM
Guest
Not if it is truly accidental.CRV:
Is this true in every case? If you accidentally take the Lord’s name in vain, you’ve still neglected to Revere God. If you accidentally kill someone with your car, that would be a sin, wouldn’t it?
And aren’t a lot if sins of ommision done accidentally? If I neglect to do works of mercy because I’m just not thinking of others, wouldn’t that be sin?
Not to hijack the thread, I agree with your basic premise, and I don’t know about anyone else, but I certainly know if I’ve chosen to sin on purpose! It’s pretty easy to see.
If that fatal car accident, for example, was caused by some defect in the car that I couldn’t possibly have been aware of, and not by anything I did or failed to do in terms of driving or mainrainingvthe vehicle, then it is a tragic accident but no sin of any kind on my part.
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francisca.chapter3
Guest
God’s enemy is the father of lies (John 8:44). We are constantly against bad spirits and principalities ( Ephesians 6:12). These spirits aren’t polite spirits who respect no humans. Our God respects our freewill. But the bad spirits would use all deceits to win souls. As we know deceits are made in the way they appear as if harmless.
But down in our heart we know.
We have to use “filter” in our heart. This is what I teach my son & my husband: when watch movies at the cinema: we do not watch Mature rated ones. Most of the times, these Mature movies are too bloody and there is always some gruesome or distasteful wierd twisted perverted logic in these mature rated movies.
Having said that, even No-Children16yrold rated movies sometimes contains bloody violence. This is what I do: I close my eyes.
Its not because I am scared. It’s because I refuse to harden my heart .
When we enjoy unnecessary violence in the movies, it is consent.
Similar to this, is porn. Jesus say when you look at women and want her in your heart, you have commited adultery. Well, porn do something more than merely look.
When you enjoy it, it is consent.
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CRV
Guest
Yes. Sin is a deliberate choice.
Objectively yes. Subjectively, no. You said it yourself “accidentally”. You can’t blaspheme by accident. You say the word, God’s name, deliberately. If said because you were shocked seeing a car accident (for example) happen in front of you, you still said it deliberately but there wasn’t full consent, therefore venial. Look up various examinations of conscience and it’ll be under venial as something like careless misuse of God’s name.
Again, as you say accidently. Did you deliberately aim your car at them with the intention to kill? The sin would not be murder because it wasn’t deliberate nor your intention to kill. But in this example there would be possibly other sins - careless driving, speeding etc which led to inadvertently killing another.
Possibly a sin of omission if at some point you remembered you should do them, but fail to make an effort to do them. Or if the neglect was a choice, then yes, because the focus is on self instead of neighbor. If it just doesn’t cross one’s mind, then greater effort needs to be made I would think.
I’m on my phone which makes it hard to reply properly, so I hope you’ll forgive any typos or lack of grammar etc.
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francisca.chapter3
Guest
I’d like to add about swearing:
swearing is also a consent. Here is the reasoning: you have all the whole dictionary of good words to choose from. Out of total freedom a person choose to swear. It is a definite consent.
Harmless but a definite free choice one make from his freewill. It may not immediately bring a person to hell, but it is an opening to the path where he choose to go away from all the good blessings of Gods presence in his life.
swearing is also a consent. Here is the reasoning: you have all the whole dictionary of good words to choose from. Out of total freedom a person choose to swear. It is a definite consent.
Harmless but a definite free choice one make from his freewill. It may not immediately bring a person to hell, but it is an opening to the path where he choose to go away from all the good blessings of Gods presence in his life.
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