Can we have a frank discussion about music in Mass?

[Gorgias]

There really are some parishes that really do mimic failed Tetris attempts. Our temples of worship should reflect the heavenly courts.

It’s wonderful when they do.

Even when they don’t, though, they still have an altar on which the Body and Blood of Christ is consecrated. That reflects the glory of the heavens more than paint and sculpture ever could.

 

[PeterT]

Again, I am going to an Eastern Catholic Liturgy this weekend and probably more often because I need raw Catholicism. Not Mid-Century Catholicism

Modernized West
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

For those who aren’t familiar with it, this is the interior of the new Propsteikirche St. Trinitatis (the Provost Church of the Holy Trinity) Catholic church in Leipzig Germany dedicated in 2015. Its exterior is even more stark and jarring than its interior:

Note: it’s an award-winning building. It won the “Religious Building of the Year” award at the 2016 World Architecture Festival that was held in Berlin that year.

 

[MiserereMei25]

 

[Ardent_Fire]

I work in art and design and there is an existing problem with designers, and in this case, architects – doing design for the sake of design in itself which leaves one cold. That is a classic example of this. People don’t easily reflect on Christ’s death on the cross with a plus symbol.

 

[exnihilo]

That looks more like a modern government building. Of course the word basilica comes from a Roman government building, but back then even the government had some taste.

 

[exnihilo]

Though ironically the plus symbol is not used in Israel for being too much like a cross.

 

[hcruz402]

If it’s a schmorgashbord of Haugen/Haas/Schutte, I must admit that I tend to not put as good amount of effort in the singing (Depending on the song, I may even choose to not sing it at all (For instance, “City of God”)).

 

[JimG]

Well, I don’t recognize the movie and have never seen it, but I certainly recall the music. The very last piece at the end is the choir singing the response to the “Ite Missa Est” (Go, the Mass is ended), and the congregation or choir responds by singing “Deo Gratias” (Thanks be to God.) The clip did not have the priest’s part, just the Deo Gratias. And yes, every kid in my elementary school could sing along with that, as well as most of t he congregation. Even the grade school children’s choir sang Gregorian chant.

Dominus Vobiscum.

 

[Peeps]

But it DID make it possible for us Protestant converts to sing hymns at Mass!

Yay!

 

[Start]

I feel like it was the only contestant. The building in the back looks more suitable for a church.

 

[DaveBj]

People don’t easily reflect on Christ’s death on the cross with a plus symbol.

Yeah, for real. I’d be looking around and wondering, where are -, *, /, and =?

D

 

[TexasLoneStar]

No you’re not alone. The music at my local church (Ordinary Mass) was not to my taste, so I left to go to the Traditional Latin Mass. I love the Gregorian chant. There is a church that sings Gregorian on Saturday Vigil in the Ordinary Form but it’s across town.

Not all of it was bad though, sometimes they’d sing Salve Regina.

I still like to attend daily Mass at my Ordinary Mass parish (since there’s no music in weekday Masses), but yeah… I don’t like the music at all. I realize church isn’t about music per se, like the Evangelicals want it to be, but there’s a difference between having your favorite music at Mass and actually feeling uncomfortable at Mass because the music, to you, is just so cringe.

 

[Spyridon]

When did music in mass become a thing? A

Music in religious services in the Judeo-Christian tradition goes back 3,000+ years.

It’s not going anywhere. It’s best to learn the history of it and embrace it.

I do wish that chants (Gregorian and Byzantine, etc.) as well as sacred polyphony were more widely practiced and utilized.

 

[Spyridon]

The only thing close to that which ever may be reality would be a list of songs which are forbidden. But in light of the fact that the Vatican got rid of its list even of forbidden books, I doubt it will ever put out a list of forbidden music.

There’s been a lot of momentum in recent years to decentralize the Church. It’s really in the Bishops’ hands now.

 

[DignumEtJustum]

I recall the movie was fair but included this excellent scene. Apparently De Niro went through the motions of the whole Mass and this was edited together from that.

 

[Loud-living-dogma]

Who allows (and even encourages) the dreadful music? That’s the question. They are the ones in charge.
The worst thing is, that there can be a parish with good solid music, then there’s a new priest assigned, and he may have a different preference in liturgical music. Then - bingo - you have what I call “liturgical whiplash”. You can go from chant-based high-quality music, to OCP-style Haugen, Haas, etc. The parishioners who sought out quality liturgy then may end up church-shopping to get away from the yuck.

 

[pnewton]

The parishioners who sought out quality liturgy then may end up church-shopping to get away from the yuck.

Or the reverse could occur if you went the opposite direction. That is the nature of church-shoppers, and people’s convictions that their taste in music is best.

 

[Loud-living-dogma]

Loud-living-dogma:

The parishioners who sought out quality liturgy then may end up church-shopping to get away from the yuck.

Or the reverse could occur if you went the opposite direction. That is the nature of church-shoppers, and people’s convictions that their taste in music is best.

Oh yes, I forgot it’s all about taste in music. Since the Church doesn’t have any written guidelines or anything…

 

[pnewton]

You use the word “all,” not I. However, I am not so blind as to see how people elevate their own tastes, like its dogma, and OCP “style,” whatever that means, is an heretical taste. I also think there is a blindness that if all music became chant and organ that all “real” Catholics would flock back, forgetting that priests will use music that they at least think is the best for their parish. A switch of music to a more traditional style is just as likely to have people look elsewhere as abandoning all traditional Catholic music.

There are guidelines, but the principle of music selection is based on subsidiarity. I choose a lot of the music at my parish, and I have to do it based on my parish, not on what people around the world think.

 

[andderson]

God uses the senses to bring closer to Himself. For those of us who experience God through the music we hear, we do have a preference in liturgical music. For those older Catholics, the Latin mass and hymns may be their preference. For those who grew up in the guitar mass era, such as myself, that style of music is preferred. That is not to say I do not enjoy hearing an organ in church. A song such as Glen Campbell’s “Try A Little Kindness” may have no liturgical value but does promote a positive message, on Sunday when we hear the story of the Good Samaritan, for instance. We would play that song, along with many other 'hippie songs" before and after mass in the hope people would be reminded of being in church the next time they heard them on the radio. How about imagining God singing to us “You’ve Got A Friend” or “Bridge Over Troubled Water”?
As I’ve said here before, it is up to the pastor of the parish who sets the rules for the music played. If one does not like the rules, they can shop for another parish… and we do. This phenomenon is nothing new for the Church. it began with the pagans as they were converted and has been the subject liturgical corrections many times since.