Can you be a good catholic and a democrat and support the democrat party?

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Well I don’t think as Catholics we should be democrat or republican. We should vote in who ever is in align with our views. But at the moment there is almost no democrat that I believe a Catholic can support. While on the other hand the republican part seems to be pretty good.
 
Mr_Antonio said:
But at the moment there is almost no democrat that I believe a Catholic can support.
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I agree. Hardly any pro-life Democrats. And Democratic politicians suppress religious freedom:
Joe Biden said he will rescind the conscience protection exemption of the Little Sisters of the Poor and he supports using tax dollars to pay for abortion.

In addition, Joe Biden was able to recalibrate “discrimination” as anything that openly espoused traditional marriage or insisted that a person actually is his or her biological sex. Biden said that he will pass the Equality Act in his first 100 days, if elected. Democrats in the House of Representatives overwhelmingly voted in favor of the Equality Act, which would be a lack of compassion towards women.

In the “me-too” era, one would think that they would want to prevent boys from accessing girls’ showers, bathrooms, etc. Under the Equality Act, girls would be prevented from having a private and safe place to go without having to deal with that nonsense.

The Equality Act, which was sponsored by Kamala Harris, would also force the acceptance of biological males participating in female sports.

The average woman is more intelligent than the average man in many cases (for example, watch Jim Acosta get destroyed repeatedly by Kayleigh McEnany). However, the average man is bigger, stronger, and faster than the AVERAGE woman. While Katie Ledecky (an exception) would destroy me and most other men in a swimming race, there are no women who are skilled enough to participate in the NFL, NBA, or Major League Baseball. In addition, Olympic World Records (running, jumping, weight lifting,…) of men are almost always much better than women’s records.
 
Hey guys great discussion!

I have a different angle here I wanted to run by you:

The voting guides and the papal encyclicals of the 20th century that focus the voter on a few key social issues to consider above everything else may be better suited for a European parliamentary system rather than the American system.

Here is what I mean

In Europe, voters sit down with party manifestos and vote based on the issue positions of a half dozen major parties. Then the representatives of each party get together and form a governing coalition that equals 50% or more of the total. The dirty work of compromise and candidate vetting is done by the parties rather than the voters and the voters only need to focus on issues.

In America, the governing coalitions and the leadership are presented to the voter fully formed. We do have to consider their issue stances, but the American voter has the added responsibility of vetting candidates for pragmatic reasons of administrative competence and character. i.e. Does a given leader have the competence or the goodwill to protect America’s interests even when they conflict with his own?

I know I am oversimplifying both systems to some extent, but I think it is very imprudent to vote for someone solely based on their issue stances. We need to keep in mind that in voting we are not only giving witness, we are governing too.

How many years will it take for consecutive bad administrations to destroy this country? I would wager it will take fewer years for leaders like Donald Trump to destroy the country than it would ever take for the court to get around to reversing Roe V Wade. The maintenance of peace and order is the #1 goal of every government.
 
The good thing is that we can all weigh the pros and cons. For those who don’t like President Trump’s tweets or manner of speaking, we can decide whether that is enough to stop us from voting to protect the future of our children and grandchildren.

We already know that if the Democrats win the 2020 Elections, there will be:
  • the elimination of pro-life doctors and other pro-life businesses, as doctors and their assistants will be forced to participate in abortion, and so Christian bakers and others are forced to participate in un-Christian-like activity
  • Federal Judges who suppress the right for Christians to LIVE our faith and who invent their own laws from the bench
  • forcing Catholic organizations to hire those who publicly live lives in contradiction of the faith
  • reduction in charter school, and eventually reduced homeschooling
  • making Middle America irrelevant in Presidential Elections, as the Electoral College is eliminated. Campaigning and policy-setting would then mostly occur for NY, LA, Chicago, and other big cities.
  • eliminate your Blue Cross, Independent Health, and other private health insurance
  • rationing of healthcare, decreased quality in healthcare, and longer wait times
  • an increase in poverty with unnecessary business regulations crushing businesses
  • crushing regulations that force rationing of heat/air conditioning and water, reduction in airplanes and farm animals.
  • increased taxes, as the Biden/AOC/Harris “Green New Deal” has been estimated to cost $94 trillion over the next 10 years, which would be $60,000 per year per household, including adjustments you’d have to make to your house, office buildings, etc.
 
stmax said:
How many years will it take for consecutive bad administrations to destroy this country? I would wager it will take fewer years for leaders like Donald Trump to destroy the country than it would ever take for the court to get around to reversing Roe V Wade. The maintenance of peace and order is the #1 goal of every government.
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There is truth to the axiom that a society willing to sacrifice its own children is doomed.
We shall see if America rids itself of abortion or falls apart.
 
That is quite an impressive and persuasive list!
I think you may be slightly misunderstanding my point. I take it as a given that the Republicans are better on the issues than are Democrats. I am trying to bring to this discussion the idea that issue positions are not the only axis by which we evaluate candidates.

I am worried the way we talk about politics in the Church makes us a rather cheap date for the Republican party. The fear is that if we give the thumbs up to corrupt leaders who have the correct public stances on life issues, we may pave the way over the long term for truly terrifying outcomes including but not limited to civil collapse.

I don’t need to rehearse the list of scandals perpetrated by our current leaders and ignored by Christian institutions in just the last year because everyone knows them. This can’t be allowed to be the new normal.
 
stmax said:
That is quite an impressive and persuasive list!
I think you may be slightly misunderstanding my point. I take it as a given that the Republicans are better on the issues than are Democrats. I am trying to bring to this discussion the idea that issue positions are not the only axis by which we evaluate candidates.

I am worried the way we talk about politics in the Church makes us a rather cheap date for the Republican party. The fear is that if we give the thumbs up to corrupt leaders who have the correct public stances on life issues, we may pave the way over the long term for truly terrifying outcomes including but not limited to civil collapse.

I don’t need to rehearse the list of scandals perpetrated by our current leaders and ignored by Christian institutions in just the last year because everyone knows them. This can’t be allowed to be the new normal.
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I also think we are beyond particular stated position on issues. We are in deranged territory. Did anyone catch Mr. President of Fox News interview this morning? As Bad as the Democratic candidates might seem on some issues, they are not chaos. They do not put is un the brink of catastrophy.
 
stmax said:
list of scandals
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President Trump wins the character issue in a landslide, in my opinion, as 12 enthusiastic lawyers (who were Democrat donors) could not find anything illegal that Trump did during the Mueller probe, and they had almost unlimited access. And, what exactly is President Trump supposed to do when the media spent 3 years on the “Russia Hoax”, Democrat-partisan impeachment hoax, calling Trump “Hitler” and a racist when the opposite is true? I’m glad that President Trump fights back. Strong character.

Joe Biden, on the other hand, used shady China connections, Russia, and the Ukraine to enrich his family. The Obama/Biden was involved in spying on the Trump campaign. Biden accused President Trump’s early travel band on China & Europe as “fearmongering” & “xenophobic”. Biden was no help & did absolutely nothing positive.

Biden lies a lot, too, like about being arrested in South Africa helping Mandela, graduating at the top of his college class (he was near the bottom), or being a professor at Pennsylvania. Biden said all blacks think the same, that Obama was the first clean & articulate black man, & wanting to fight those with tough questions on the campaign trail.

 
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If that is the way you see it, you should follow your conscience and vote for Trump. I just want to make sure that the church is not erecting obstacles for people whose consciences put them on the other side. You are right to focus on character and competence as well as issue positions. That level of analysis is for what I am pushing for too.
My only point is that the USCCBs voter guide does not do this.
 
Shakuhachi said:
They do not put is un the brink of catastrophy.
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It appears that the Biden/Sanders 110 page Unity Platform promotes socialism, which would destroy the United States as we know it.


No one can be at the same time a good Catholic and a true socialist (Pius XI’s Q uadragesimo Anno , 120).
The Church has rejected the totalitarian and atheistic ideologies associated in modem times with “communism” or “socialism” ( Catechism , 2425).
Pope Leo XIII’s Rerum Novarum explicitly rejects several main tenants of socialism.
 
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