Capitalism vs. Socialism

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EssentialBeing

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Has history shown us that:

CAPITALISM succumbs to minimization
SOCIALISM succumbs to maximization

Could it be that capitalism is about material function and socialism is about moral function or rather they are a mixture of each other just from totally opposing ends?
 
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By minimization and maximization do you mean the size of government?
 
All governments no matter where in the world, apply both Capitalism & Socialism and can be distinguished by how they apply them or better said to what balance.

Minimization - act or function for self hoping to extend to others
Maximization - act or function for others hoping to extend to self

I am just trying to understand the function of any political system and how the majority of people choose to interact with it.
 
EssentialBeing said:
Minimization - act or function for self hoping to extend to others
Maximization - act or function for others hoping to extend to self
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So if I understand it right, you’re saying minimization is like the invisible hand, while maximization is more of a managed economy?
 
StudentMI said:
So if I understand it right, you’re saying minimization is like the invisible hand, while maximization is more of a managed economy?
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More like a visible hand (for the greater) or invisible hand (for the least)
EssentialBeing said:
I am just trying to understand the function of any political system and how the majority of people choose to interact with it.
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How we lack balance and stray to one side or the other (capitalism or socialism). Is it so hard to stay centered? or what causes individuals to apply one over the other?
 
EssentialBeing said:
How we lack balance and stray to one side or the other (capitalism or socialism). Is it so hard to stay centered? or what causes individuals to apply one over the other?
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Gotcha. I think as far staying centred the problem is ideology, and the interests of powerful groups. Power can be political, or economic.
 
They are probably a mixture of each other, i.e., given the need for legal systems in capitalism, and socialism employing state capitalism. This might also partly explain why various economies are mixed.
 
EssentialBeing said:
Could it be that capitalism is about material function and socialism is about moral function or rather they are a mixture of each other just from totally opposing ends?
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they’re really akin to apples and oranges…

The Church Condemns Socialism… and UnBridled Capitalism.
 
The Church does condemn a version of capitalism as illustrated below. It does not condemn free markets.
If by “capitalism” is meant an economic system which recognizes the fundamental and positive role of business, the market, private property and the resulting responsibility for the means of production, as well as free human creativity in the economic sector, then the answer is certainly in the affirmative, even though it would perhaps be more appropriate to speak of a “business economy”, “market economy” or simply “free economy”. But if by “capitalism” is meant a system in which freedom in the economic sector is not circumscribed within a strong juridical framework which places it at the service of human freedom in its totality, and which sees it as a particular aspect of that freedom, the core of which is ethical and religious, then the reply is certainly negative.
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http://www.vatican.va/content/john-...s/hf_jp-ii_enc_01051991_centesimus-annus.html
 
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StudentMI said:
The Church does condemn a version of capitalism as illustrated below. It does not condemn free markets.
If by “capitalism” is meant an economic system which recognizes the fundamental and positive role of business, the market, private property and the resulting responsibility for the means of production, as well as free human creativity in the economic sector, then the answer is certainly in the affirmative, even though it would perhaps be more appropriate to speak of a “business economy”, “market economy” or simply “free economy”. But if by “capitalism” is meant a system in which freedom in the economic sector is not circumscribed within a strong juridical framework which places it at the service of human freedom in its totality, and which sees it as a particular aspect of that freedom, the core of which is ethical and religious, then the reply is certainly negative.
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It seems like this then would condemn anarcho-capitalist or corporatist states then? But not necessarily a free market.
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I think so. Anarchism definitely, given Catholic teaching on government and state intervention in the economy. Though condemn might be a strong word.

The Church definitely supports free markets.
 
You would have to define socialism; in most circumstances true socialism is about control, and has a long history of being enforced by people who appear to have no religious grounding.

The Northern European countries are often referred to as “socialist”, but that is incorrect as they have capitalistic economies with a good deal of social welfare. And to do so, they tax heavily not only the “rich”, but also the middle class.

Social welfare is not socialism. Socialism is a political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution and exchange should be owned and regulated by the community as a whole.

Except there is no socialist country which does so by “the community as a whole” it is done by cadre who make the decisions; no economy can run by voting every week to every day over economic/business decisions.

And the history of economics and business decisions being run by cadre has sufficient history to show that it does not work; whether the government is Communist or Socialist, it cannot run production, distribution and exchange effectively.

China figured this out after running the country into the hole, and has okayed private enterprise; it still has fingers in the matter but lets business run as long as it does not see the business as counter productive to long range plans. As to 'free speech", religion and political parties, there is no freedom whatsoever. As for publicly traded businesses there, questions concerning accounting standards and information is suspect.
 
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otjm said:
As for publicly traded businesses there, questions concerning accounting standards and information is suspect.
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Slightly related but I saw an interview, with an entrepreneur I believe, years ago who said if you invested capital in China you weren’t getting it back. They routinely will steal from businesses that try to cease production in the country.
 
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