Cardinal Cupich launches Amoris Laetitia seminars for US bishops

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If Spadaro tries to take on EWTN it will end badly for his image. At Mass this morning I could easily say that 100% of the attendees (approximately 50 people) are huge EWTN fans. Our parish has a very well attended pilgrimage to EWTN every 5 years or so.

EWTN has millions of faithful followers and likely 10s of millions of faithful listeners. Any attack on the network would result in a negative light. Sensus Fidelium and all.
 
I would like to see the focus back on the actual thread: in other words, a theologian has been chosen for a prominent platform, who dissents drastically from the Catholic Faith. As one example, she is co editor of a book which applauds role models for Catholic young adults. One Catholic role model is an abortion clinic escort, someone who helps steer women through the prolifers outside the clinic. She is outraged that prolifers dare to hold up, not assault rifles, but the dangerous image of the Blessed Virgin.

Someone who honors this “deathscort” is asked to lecture Catholics about religion. The prudence of this is questioned, in this thread.
 
Might I request that anyone that wants to hold Fr. Spadaro out as authoritative provide the document that makes him so?
 
Someone who honors this “deathscort” is asked to lecture Catholics about religion. The prudence of this is questioned, in this thread.
That I get. The best of leaders can still make a bad decision, and the decision might undermine the most noble of efforts.
 
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commenter:
Someone who honors this “deathscort” is asked to lecture Catholics about religion. The prudence of this is questioned, in this thread.
That I get. The best of leaders can still make a bad decision, and the decision might undermine the most noble of efforts.
True. Nobody is saying that there is an intention to oppose prolife here. It is what they call acceptable collateral damage. It would be comparable to inviting someone to a very prominent platform who has publicly admired an activist for the KKK - then asking them to provide wisdom on subjects other than race.
 
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Luke6_37:
Spadaro is more than just an advisor to Pope Francis. The way I understand it, as editor of La Civilta Cattolica, Spadaro is the unofficial voice of the Papacy. His job is to reflect what Pope Francis thinks, which is why all the articles printed in the magazine are vetted and revised by the Secretariat of State of the Holy See and must receive his approval before being published.
Father Spadaro has ZERO authority in the Church, and frankly Catholics owe no assent to anything he says.
Strawman. Nobody made any such claim. But if he is tasked by the Pope to push a certain agenda, then you’d be foolish to ignore him.
 
I figured the day would come when EWTN is maligned. A television network that hasn’t changed in orthodoxy since it’s inception and was once never maligned but now so because of the apparent era of dissent from anything truthful. The same network (EWTN) whose founder was praised by Pope Francis himself.

What is this NCR your speak of? The same NCR that has been intervened by a bishop of the Church and recently condemned again (bishop finn of Kansas city in 2013) and proclaimed by the bishop of the diocese in which its (tiny) headquarters are located as not affiliated with the Church in any way shape or form. (national catholic reporter)

Or are you talking about the NCR that is owned by EWTN and has episcopal approval from their local ordinary? Nation Catholic Register. (note I used a capital C in this one)
Already answered that…
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Cardinal Cupich launches Amoris Laetitia seminars for US bishops Catholic News
If NCR is not approved, I did not know they weren’t, then they are in serious violation of Canon Law, represting themselves as a Catholic apostolate when they are not. While I cannot say they are a wolf in sheep’s clothing, I can say as a point of fact they are something other than a sheep in sheep’s clothing. Who would trust an organization that lies in their very name? (as in “Catholic” in NCR and “Life” in LSN) The full name of NCR is “National Catholic Reporter | The Independent News S…
My point is that today they seem to be giving Pope Francis better press than EWTN.
 
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If Spadaro tries to take on EWTN it will end badly for his image. At Mass this morning I could easily say that 100% of the attendees (approximately 50 people) are huge EWTN fans. Our parish has a very well attended pilgrimage to EWTN every 5 years or so.

EWTN has millions of faithful followers and likely 10s of millions of faithful listeners. Any attack on the network would result in a negative light. Sensus Fidelium and all.
The more likely scenario is to go through the local bishop and get him to fix the problem. If he won’t, then maybe he will get assigned elsewhere and a new bishop will take his place. If EWTN defies the new guy, they lose the endorsement of the Church and become independant like NCR.
 
The more likely scenario? Sounds like a sensationalistic fantasy. Msgr Spadaro, is that you? EWTN being independent would be a disaster for the Church. EWTN as an independent and off the rails would cause far more damage than the REPORTER has based on the fact that the reporter is a fringe organization with a tiny readership compared to the largest religious media outlet in the world with 1000 radio stations worldwide and a cable/satellite contract that takes their programming to 90 million homes in the US alone. Its combined broadcasting reaches 250,000,000 people worldwide and streaming content has 1 million active participants. Their influence over John and Mary Catholic far outweighs that of Spadaro so I’m hoping you wouldn’t wish that EWTN would end up with the same status as the NCR. It would not be a good thing.
 
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Archbishop Chaput has summed up the hazards of listening to Father Spadaro very nicely:

http://catholicherald.co.uk/news/20...lica-article-was-an-exercise-in-dumbing-down/
You should always read the primary sources if you want to be honest and avoid mischaracterizing what someone says, like you did here with both Fr. Spadaro and Archbiship Chaput.

So if you are going to make a comment at least read the original article in La Civilta Cattolica:


And then read the Archbishop’s actual response to it:


Having read both myself, I would say that the Archbishop’s objections make me wonder whether he gave any thought at all to the central issues raised by Spadaro and Figueroa in their article. My reason for saying this is that he doesn’t actually address any their concerns or explains why he thinks they are unfounded. Instead, he just doubles down in defense of the agenda he has been pursuing and dismisses the article by taking a few phrases out of context and applying them in a misleading way.

The Civiltà Cattolica article takes issue with what the authors see as three troubling developments in American Catholic thought that they would like to push back against, because they run counter to the direction Pope Francis would like to take the Church. These are: 1) Manichaeism, 2) the Prosperity Gospel, and 3) a theopolitical agenda under the guise of a defense of Religious Liberty.

Of these three, the only one Archbishop Chaput addresses in any way is the last - the concern that a theopolitical agenda is what is really driving the Religious Liberty defense. Unfortunately, he offers a very weak argument to contradict this claim.

Chaput writes, “As an evangelical friend once said, the whole idea of Baptist faith cuts against the integration of Church and state. Foreign observers who want to criticize the United States and its religious landscape – and yes, there’s always plenty to criticize — should note that fact. It’s rather basic.”

Given what I know about the Southern Baptism Convention, this statement makes me scratch my head. If he were talking about an Anabaptist friend, I would wholeheartedly agree with him. Baptists, however, have strayed far from their Anabaptist roots and many today adopt a Calvinistic world view. Among them are those who see it as their duty, as members of the elect, to shape society through the political process. The Southern Baptist Convention specifically calls to its members to be politically engaged.
http://www.sbc.net/resolutions/1188/on-political-engagement

That’s why I think Archbishop Chaput really missed the forest for the trees on this one.
 
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I’ll stick with the Archbishop on this one. Father Spadaro, in any case, has ZERO authority in the Church.
 
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Cardinal Cupich launches Amoris Laetitia seminars for US bishops Catholic News
The more likely scenario is to go through the local bishop and get him to fix the problem. If he won’t, then maybe he will get assigned elsewhere and a new bishop will take his place. If EWTN defies the new guy, they lose the endorsement of the Church and become independant like NCR.
The more likely scenario? Sounds like a sensationalistic fantasy. Msgr Spadaro, is that you? EWTN being independent would be a disaster for the Church. EWTN as an independent and off the rails would cause far more damage than the REPORTER has based on the fact that the reporter is a fringe organization with a tiny readership compared to the largest religious media outlet in the world with 1000 radio stations worldwide and a cable/satellite contract that takes their programming to 90 million homes in the US alone. Its combined broadcasting reaches 250,000,000 people worldwide and streaming content has 1 million active participants. Their influence over John and Mary Catholic far outweighs that of Spadaro so I’m hoping you wouldn’t wish that EWTN would end up with the same status as the NCR. It would not be a good thing.
Asking the local bishop to address a problem in his diocese is a highly probable scenario, because that’s exactly how the Church operates. Replacing an uncooperative bishop also happens all the time. The Pope will just assign him to a harmless position out of the way somewhere and replace him with a man who is more supportive of his agenda.

As for the rest of your response, it is a fairly egregious reading of my comment. I’m not sure where you got the idea that I would wish EWTN to go the way of Martin Luther, and drag a load of America Catholics away from the church in a new Protestant Reformation. If you read my post carefully, I make a lot of “if” statements. If EWTN doesn’t defy Church authority, there is no crisis, which is why I hope EWTN would fall in line before it gets to that.
 
I’ll stick with the Archbishop on this one. Father Spadaro, in any case, has ZERO authority in the Church.
Already stated, already answered…
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Cardinal Cupich launches Amoris Laetitia seminars for US bishops Catholic News
Father Spadaro has ZERO authority in the Church, and frankly Catholics owe no assent to anything he says. Strawman. Nobody made any such claim. But if he is tasked by the Pope to push a certain agenda, then you’d be foolish to ignore him.
 
The only “agenda” any priest should be “pushing” is the perennial teaching of the Church. Not novelties like saying adulterers can receive Communion if they “discern” it’s ok.
 
The only “agenda” any priest should be “pushing” is the perennial teaching of the Church. Not novelties like saying adulterers can receive Communion if they “discern” it’s ok.
From what I understand, the theological foundation of Chp 8 in Amoris Laetitia are the words Jesus spoke to the Samaritan woman in John chp 4

“If you knew the gift of God and who is saying to you, ‘Give me a drink,’ you would have asked him and he would have given you living water.” - John 4:10

The living water is clearly a reference to the Eucharist and Jesus is saying he would have given it to the Samaritan woman had she asked - even though he knows she is living in a highly irregular marital situation.

Note, he doesn’t add …once you repent of your sins, at the end.

You may not find this convincing, but Pope Francis clearly does. This is the Jesus that gives me reason to hope, because while I am not living in an irregular marital situation, it is only by the mercy and love of Jesus that I too am saved.
 
Communion may not be received by adulterers. Pope Francis cannot change that perennial teaching of the Church.
 
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That’s a very strange interpretation of the account of Jesus and the woman at the well, considering that it was Jesus himself who prohibited divorce and said that one who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery. I also don’t think that the reference to living water means the Eucharist, which had not then even been instituted. More likely it refers to the grace of salvation or even the water of baptism. This interpretation is a real stretch.
 
That’s a very strange interpretation of the account of Jesus and the woman at the well, considering that it was Jesus himself who prohibited divorce and said that one who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery. I also don’t think that the reference to living water means the Eucharist, which had not then even been instituted. More likely it refers to the grace of salvation or even the water of baptism. This interpretation is a real stretch.
Hardly a stretch. Nobody drinks the water of baptism so that’s out.

Compare what Jesus says about living water in John 4:13-15…

“Everyone who drinks this water will be thirsty again; but whoever drinks the water I shall give will never thirst; the water I shall give will become in him a spring of water welling up to eternal life.” The woman said to him, “Sir, give me this water, so that I may not be thirsty or have to keep coming here to draw water.”

To what he says about the bread of life in John 6:32-34…

“Amen, amen, I say to you, it was not Moses who gave the bread from heaven; my Father gives you the true bread from heaven. For the bread of God is that which comes down from heaven and gives life to the world.” So they said to him, “Sir, give us this bread always.” Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life; whoever comes to me will never hunger, and whoever believes in me will never thirst.

It’s a direct parallel.

Was the Samaritan woman divorced? She was certainly living in an “irregular” situation that Jesus does not condone. Nevertheless, he says he would have given her living water had she asked - without any strings attached.

Its worth thinking about when trying to understand what Pope Francis is getting at in Chapter 8 of Amoris Laetitia.
 
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