Cardinal Dolan Congratulates President Obama On Re-Election

[Prodigal_Son1]

Everyone here made an opinion, and quite frankly its healthy to question. The Church took a stand during the Crusades, there was a physical response to an evil. It was necessary. Im certain the church did not congratulate the muslims when they took Sicily and Spain.

I thought earlier it was odd that you had no idea what God would do. Someone who has over 9000 comments has no idea what God would do. The Holy Spirit speaks to us, its that quiet yet firm voice within us that say, wait a minute, would Christ do what he did?

I think some hear the shepherds voice and some don’t.

In the spirit of Christ YES we are to forgive we get it, but that doesn’t mean we should hand the keys of our house to a thief!!!

This is the end for me.

The number of posts a person has does not give them the mind of the Lord. God will do His will, and I pray to accept it. It’s called faith. Scriptures says, ‘who knows the mind of the Lord?’ I am not so self righteous as to imagine I can know without a doubt what exactly He would do in any situation. Yes there are gifts of the Holy Spirit, and those gifts tell me that the Cardinal and Pope have acted according to Christian principles, for spiritual reason. The reactions being voiced are for partisan, and therefore secular reasons. It’s that simple in my mind.

The quiet voice inside us speaks to our conscience, and no one can assume to know another person’s conscience to be correct, or incorrect. A person must act on their conscience or face condemnation. Show me anywhere that the Church states a person can tell another person their conscience is wrong.

I have used scriptures to give you teachings/instructions from Christ. No where does He teach to ostracize another person.

The resentment of the current administration is clear, however you are overlooking that the government will still continue to work with private charities in other areas. Also, it’s noticed that some refuse to address the fact that the Cardinal addressed some very important issues along with the congratulations. It was not just praise and glory, it was recognition of an accomplishment and prayers for distinct Catholic beliefs.

Christ drank and dined with sinners. As the Cardinal said, if he excluded all sinners from his table, he would be eating alone.

What would Christ do? What did Christ do when the Centurion approached Him to request healing for his servant? Did Christ tell him he was a part of the Roman army who committed many travesties against other human being? Did He send him away?

Now, we’ve given thought to what Christ would do, but none of us can assume to be totally as Christ. He is by far more righteous than any person on this earth today.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

I had an after thought for those who claim a right to voice their opinion to the authoritative men of the Church. You’re expressing your opinion, anonymously, on a public forum; how is this reaching the Cardinal and Pope?

 

[iloveangels]

…
The resentment of the current administration is clear, however you are overlooking that the government will still continue to work with private charities in other areas. Also, it’s noticed that some refuse to address the fact that the Cardinal addressed some very important issues along with the congratulations. It was not just praise and glory, it was recognition of an accomplishment and prayers for distinct Catholic beliefs…

So when the HHS mandate hits, how are you going to take it? It’ll be interesting, no?

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

So when the HHS mandate hits, how are you going to take it?

Different topic? That’s ok, I will render unto Caesar’s that which is Caesar’s, and place all my faith in Him. I will pray that all programs and decisions by our leaders will be according to His will, and not mine. I will ask for help to change the things that I can, and for help to accept the things I cannot. Most of all, I will be praying hard for the unification of the body of Christ and that people cease trying to divide it, according to His will of course.

 

[iloveangels]

Different topic? That’s ok, I will render unto Caesar’s that which is Caesar’s, and place all my faith in Him. I will pray that all programs and decisions by our leaders will be according to His will, and not mine. I will ask for help to change the things that I can, and for help to accept the things I cannot. Most of all, I will be praying hard for the unification of the body of Christ and that people cease trying to divide it, according to His will of course.

That’s not what I asked you. I asked you what your take on the HHS mandate will be when it hits. But I guess I can just wait and see, huh? It’s going to happen soon now.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

That’s not what I asked you. I asked you what your take on the HHS mandate will be when it hits. But I guess I can just wait and see, huh? It’s going to happen soon now.

I pray for His help to change the things I can, and His help to accept the things I cannot change. I will not despair, for my faith is in Him.

 

[JimG]

I pray for His help to change the things I can, and His help to accept the things I cannot change. I will not despair, for my faith is in Him.

We know what the bishops will do. They will sue the HHS. They have already done so, as have other Catholic institutions, Evangelical institutions, and private employers. Others have voted against the incumbent in the hope that the mandate could be overturned along with other bad policies. We are under no obligation to cooperate with evil policies.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

We know what the bishops will do. They will sue the HHS. They have already done so, as have other Catholic institutions, Evangelical institutions, and private employers. Others have voted against the incumbent in the hope that the mandate could be overturned along with other bad policies. We are under no obligation to cooperate with evil policies.

Cardinal Dolan was/is a part of a lawsuit filed against this administration, prior to the Catholic charities dinner, and the notice of congratulations.

 

[iloveangels]

We know what the bishops will do. They will sue the HHS. They have already done so, as have other Catholic institutions, Evangelical institutions, and private employers. Others have voted against the incumbent in the hope that the mandate could be overturned along with other bad policies. We are under no obligation to cooperate with evil policies.

A. It’s highly unlikely that the resolution of this lawsuit will come BEFORE the final date for implementation of the HHS mandate. And in fact, for employers who didn’t meet the 4 requirements for religious exemption, that date was LAST August 1st. We may already be in violation of the law, and we may ALREADY owe the IRS billions of dollars in FINES. There is no guarantee whatsoever that we won’t have to pay those fines. None.

"The exemption is only for a “religious employer,” defined as “one that (1) Has the inculcation of religious values as its purpose; (2) primarily employs persons who share its religious tenets; (3) primarily serves persons who share its religious tenets; and (4) is a non-profit organization under section 6033(a)(1) and section 6033(a)(3)(A)(i) or (iii) of the [Internal Revenue] Code.” HHS notes that these provisions of the Code refer to “churches, their integrated auxiliaries, and conventions or associations of churches, as well as to the exclusively religious activities of any religious order.”
cacatholic.org/index.php/issues2/religious-liberty/conscience-rights/190-background-mandated-contraceptive-and-sterilization-coverage

Many Catholic institutions and organizations, including many dioceses themselves have whole departments that probably do not qualify for a religious employer exemption based on these rules.

B. Those of us who live in the US are physically subject to US law. Are you claiming otherwise?

 

[frattura30]

The number of posts a person has does not give them the mind of the Lord. God will do His will, and I pray to accept it. It’s called faith. Scriptures says, ‘who knows the mind of the Lord?’ I am not so self righteous as to imagine I can know without a doubt what exactly He would do in any situation. Yes there are gifts of the Holy Spirit, and those gifts tell me that the Cardinal and Pope have acted according to Christian principles, for spiritual reason. The reactions being voiced are for partisan, and therefore secular reasons. It’s that simple in my mind.

…

The Word of God, tells us quite clearly the “mind of the Lord” in the ten commandments and His covenant with Abraham. For example we as true Believers know the Lord would disagree with Barack Obama when it comes to abortion. We hear the shepherds voice. John 10.27 “My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me”. I can’t tell you how joyful it is to hear that verse. Yes I read it with my eyes but I HEAR it with my soul!!! Amen!

*The quiet voice inside us speaks to our conscience, and no one can assume to know another person’s conscience to be correct, or incorrect. *A person must act on their conscience or face condemnation. *Show me anywhere that the Church states a person can tell another person their conscience is wrong. *

For true Believers, that quiet voice is the Holy Spirit. He speaks to our very soul. Barack Obama is now telling the Holy Spirit (within us) that He must provide abortifacients and soon abortions. Why is it, that you can not see this war is spiritual, played out in the physical? Do you not have eyes to see, and ears to hear? Can’t you see why so many true Believers are upset? John 14:16-17 “And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever–the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you”. Praise God, that he sent the Comforter.

*I have used scriptures to give you teachings/instructions from Christ. No where does He teach to ostracize another person.
*
Why must you play with words? Ostracize? No one here is trying to exclude anyone from a society or group.

*The resentment of the current administration is clear, however you are overlooking that the government will still continue to work with private charities in other areas. *Also, it’s noticed that some refuse to address the fact that the Cardinal addressed some very important issues along with the congratulations. *It was not just praise and glory, it was recognition of an accomplishment and prayers for distinct Catholic beliefs. *

There is no evidence that supports your claim that the Obama administration will continue to work with private charities in other areas. The HHS mandate is a perfect example as to the government going in the opposite direction. John 15:18 “If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first.”

*Christ drank and dined with sinners. *As the Cardinal said, if he excluded all sinners from his table, he would be eating alone.
*
No one is excluding or ostracizing as you continue to claim. Its important to understand that people are expressing disappointment and legitimately so. Yes it is true Christ dined with sinners. He expressed to them an importance to repent and turn away from sin. If Barack Obama had dinner with Jesus Christ, we as true believer know “the mind of God” and He would say REPENT and why do you persecute my Bride and murder the innocent children. Acts 9:4 He fell to the ground and heard a voice say to him, “Saul, Saul, why do you persecute me?” We as true believer’s know the mind of God, its in the Word.

*What would Christ do? *What did Christ do when the Centurion approached Him to request healing for his servant? *Did Christ tell him he was a part of the Roman army who committed many travesties against other human being? *Did He send him away?
*
Of course He didn’t send him away, and I can’t stress this enough no one here is saying that. Matthew 8:13 Then Jesus said to the Roman officer, “Go back home. Because you believed, it has happened.” And the young servant was healed that same hour." One of the key word Christ emphasizes throughout his Ministry is believe!!! The thief on the cross in most likelihood was not baptized, or lived a righteous life, but in the end he turned and I can’t emphasize this more he turned to believing in Christ. Luke 23:42 "Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your Kingdom.” We are so blessed to hear this good news. Now you can certainly congratulate Barack Obama, you can certainly agree with Cardinal Dolan, while I do respect them both. I will say however Gods word tells us. Psalm 146:3 “Don’t put your confidence in powerful people; there is no help for you there.”

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

The Word of God, tells us quite clearly the “mind of the Lord” in the ten commandments and His covenant with Abraham. For example we as true Believers know the Lord would disagree with Barack Obama when it comes to abortion. We hear the shepherds voice. John 10.27 “My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me”. I can’t tell you how joyful it is to hear that verse. Yes I read it with my eyes but I HEAR it with my soul!!! Amen!

For true Believers, that quiet voice is the Holy Spirit. He speaks to our very soul. Barack Obama is now telling the Holy Spirit (within us) that He must provide abortifacients and soon abortions. Why is it, that you can not see this war is spiritual, played out in the physical? Do you not have eyes to see, and ears to hear? Can’t you see why so many true Believers are upset? John 14:16-17 “And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever–the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you”. Praise God, that he sent the Comforter.

Why must you play with words? Ostracize? No one here is trying to exclude anyone from a society or group.

There is no evidence that supports your claim that the Obama administration will continue to work with private charities in other areas. The HHS mandate is a perfect example as to the government going in the opposite direction. John 15:18 “If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first.”

No one is excluding or ostracizing as you continue to claim. Its important to understand that people are expressing disappointment and legitimately so. Yes it is true Christ dined with sinners. He expressed to them an importance to repent and turn away from sin. If Barack Obama had dinner with Jesus Christ, we as true believer know “the mind of God” and He would say REPENT and why do you persecute my Bride and murder the innocent children. Acts 9:4 He fell to the ground and heard a voice say to him, “Saul, Saul, why do you persecute me?” We as true believer’s know the mind of God, its in the Word.

Of course He didn’t send him away, and I can’t stress this enough no one here is saying that. Matthew 8:13 Then Jesus said to the Roman officer, “Go back home. Because you believed, it has happened.” And the young servant was healed that same hour." One of the key word Christ emphasizes throughout his Ministry is believe!!! The thief on the cross in most likelihood was not baptized, or lived a righteous life, but in the end he turned and I can’t emphasize this more he turned to believing in Christ. Luke 23:42 "Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your Kingdom.” We are so blessed to hear this good news. Now you can certainly congratulate Barack Obama, you can certainly agree with Cardinal Dolan, while I do respect them both. I will say however Gods word tells us. Psalm 146:3 “Don’t put your confidence in powerful people; there is no help for you there.”

I am not going to argue knowing, or claims to know, the mind of the Lord and how He thinks, or how His will works. I believe we grow through life, but will never be as complete as He is. Even though He speaks to our souls, we cannot fully comprehend all that He knows.

Ostracize is very much what is being supported on most of the political discussions on these forums. People do not want to see this president receive any communication, of good will, from our Church leaders, even when those messages include prayers of Catholic intentions. People did not want the president invited to a Catholic charities dinner. There was an exclusion. The exclusion goes deeper, if one reads around these forums, and is evident in suggestions of some leaving the Church because they disagreed politically.

On John 14, turn back until you identify the specific audience Christ addressed. It was the men He chose and appointed over His Church. Once you go back through John you will see that preceding the addressing of those authoritative men, He did address the multitude. He never gave the same instructions to each, the multitude and the men He appointed over His Church. Scriptures even speaks about Him using parables to the people, but explaining everything to the disciples. This is not an exclusion of all people, but a suggestion of caution when trying to apply everything to individual. We can take great comfort in knowing what the Church is instructed to teach us, and where the Church receives confidence to do so.

The problem with individual application should be apparent through the Protestant reformation. We cannot tell our brothers and sisters their consciences are wrong.

The only evidence of Obama working with private charities is my faith in the Church that includes government assistance, as an obligation, in addition to the private charities. We have bishops, and the Pope, that have said this.

Where in scriptures was it taught, or by our Church, to evangelize by avoiding non believers? It won’t work. Our men of the Church are following, and giving example, to the teachings of Christ.

 

[iloveangels]

I am not going to argue knowing, or claims to know, the mind of the Lord and how He thinks, or how His will works. I believe we grow through life, but will never be as complete as He is. Even though He speaks to our souls, we cannot fully comprehend all that He knows.

Ostracize is very much what is being supported on most of the political discussions on these forums. People do not want to see this president receive any communication, of good will, from our Church leaders, even when those messages include prayers of Catholic intentions. People did not want the president invited to a Catholic charities dinner. There was an exclusion. The exclusion goes deeper, if one reads around these forums, and is evident in suggestions of some leaving the Church because they disagreed politically.

On John 14, turn back until you identify the specific audience Christ addressed. It was the men He chose and appointed over His Church. Once you go back through John you will see that preceding the addressing of those authoritative men, He did address the multitude. He never gave the same instructions to each, the multitude and the men He appointed over His Church. Scriptures even speaks about Him using parables to the people, but explaining everything to the disciples. This is not an exclusion of all people, but a suggestion of caution when trying to apply everything to individual. We can take great comfort in knowing what the Church is instructed to teach us, and where the Church receives confidence to do so.

The problem with individual application should be apparent through the Protestant reformation. We cannot tell our brothers and sisters their consciences are wrong.

The only evidence of Obama working with private charities is my faith in the Church that includes government assistance, as an obligation, in addition to the private charities. We have bishops, and the Pope, that have said this.

Where in scriptures was it taught, or by our Church, to evangelize by avoiding non believers? It won’t work. Our men of the Church are following, and giving example, to the teachings of Christ.

There is a very real difference between judging the soul of a person, and evaluating an act as more or less good morally.

What’s implicit in your account is the hidden notion that people are required to do the things they do. They are NOT. People choose the acts in which they engage. Some acts are objectively evil, no matter who might perform them.

Some people, because of weaknesses of character or formation, regard their temptations as compelling, and that’s usually what’s behind this grave mistake of thinking that they are compulsory. But for people who are not gravely compromised, compelling is different from compulsory. People do have freedom of thought and decision. You really do believe that or you wouldn’t be in here trying to convince anyone of something. People can only change their minds if they have freedom of thought and decision.

 

[Lochias]

We know that “there is a time for everything under the sun”, and that includes righteous anger. Are we to let that anger control us, and use it to hurt others? No. But we have a duty to teach the Truth, both by example and by word, as well as to pray for others.

Jesus saw fit to overturn tables and strike out at the money-changers when it became necessary…I believe that, at some point, the Church will likely do the same. We can’t just sit in the pond and not make any waves.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

There is a very real difference between judging the soul of a person, and evaluating an act as more or less good morally.

What’s implicit in your account is the hidden notion that people are required to do the things they do. They are NOT. People choose the acts in which they engage. Some acts are objectively evil, no matter who might perform them.

Some people, because of weaknesses of character or formation, regard their temptations as compelling, and that’s usually what’s behind this grave mistake of thinking that they are compulsory. But for people who are not gravely compromised, compelling is different from compulsory. People do have freedom of thought and decision. You really do believe that or you wouldn’t be in here trying to convince anyone of something. People can only change their minds if they have freedom of thought and decision.

People cannot convert others to their side by avoiding them.

 

[iloveangels]

We know that “there is a time for everything under the sun”, and that includes righteous anger. Are we to let that anger control us, and use it to hurt others? No. But we have a duty to teach the Truth, both by example and by word, as well as to pray for others.

Jesus saw fit to overturn tables and strike out at the money-changers when it became necessary…I believe that, at some point, the Church will likely do the same. We can’t just sit in the pond and not make any waves.

Don’t hold your breath, Lochias.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

We know that “there is a time for everything under the sun”, and that includes righteous anger. Are we to let that anger control us, and use it to hurt others? No. But we have a duty to teach the Truth, both by example and by word, as well as to pray for others.

Isn’t this what the Cardinal and Pope did by sending messages of good will with specified Catholic intentions?

Jesus saw fit to overturn tables and strike out at the money-changers when it became necessary…I believe that, at some point, the Church will likely do the same. We can’t just sit in the pond and not make any waves.

I’d be interested in seeing Christ’s instructions for us to take actions against others, other than treating them like publicans and tax collectors.

 

[TrueLight]

Come on people. That’s what leaders do. They congratulate each other on their appts.

Cardinal Dolan is a leader and as a leader he congratulated the man who will be leading the United States for the next four years.

The same way Romney no doubt called Obama to congratulate him.

It doesn’t mean anyone is kissing up.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

Come on people. That’s what leaders do. They congratulate each other on their appts.

Cardinal Dolan is a leader and as a leader he congratulated the man who will be leading the United States for the next four years.

The same way Romney no doubt called Obama to congratulate him.

It doesn’t mean anyone is kissing up.

 

[Lucky7]

Lochias: *Jesus saw fit to overturn tables and strike out at the money-changers when it became necessary…I believe that, at some point, the Church will likely do the same. We can’t just sit in the pond and not make any waves. *

I’d be interested in seeing Christ’s instructions for us to take actions against others, other than treating them like publicans and tax collectors.

You are still ignoring Christ’s turning over the tables as if we weren’t supposed to learn how to imitate Christ from that, huh? So frustrating.

Lochias, I think you know I’m on board with your thinking. I, too, wonder when “some point” will be however.

 

[frattura30]

The only evidence of Obama working with private charities is my faith in the Church that includes government assistance, as an obligation, in addition to the private charities. We have bishops, and the Pope, that have said this.

Where in scriptures was it taught, or by our Church, to evangelize by avoiding non believers? It won’t work. Our men of the Church are following, and giving example, to the teachings of Christ.

How could you have voted for a man who promotes abortion?