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pnewton
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I do not know if this is indicative of the underlying reason why he was not renewed in his position, or whether the arrest and scandal within his congregation played a role. Maybe it was a combination of the two. We surely will never know why the Pope did what he did, nor should we judge the Pope. I do not blame Cardinal Muller for his feeling though.
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PluniaZ
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Fake news. Cardinal Mueller has already publicly stated that he fully supports Pope Francis’s decision to implement term limits, which is all that happened here.
heraldextra.com/news/world/ousted-vatican-doctrine-chief-denies-clashing-with-pope/article_c2624cb5-1bdb-5197-8572-c383261fb672.html
heraldextra.com/news/world/ousted-vatican-doctrine-chief-denies-clashing-with-pope/article_c2624cb5-1bdb-5197-8572-c383261fb672.html
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MaryT777
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It’s always difficult when things like this happen as there are two sides to every story and albeit we have Cardinal Muller’s comments we don’t have any comments from the Vatican who noted this was handled with a private meeting with the Pope.
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JPUSC
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twf
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It may be fake news that he publicly complained about the Pope’s dismissal of him…and it may be true that the Pope intends to enforce Curia term limits to prevent “careerism” in the Church… BUT it is still quite odd that he is effectively being “retired” at age 69. You would expect him to be reassigned. That appears not to be the case.
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pianistclare
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I don’t know what he did that caused this…(surely it was something) but I find it amazing that he quotes Social Justice as something the Church should espouse with regard to their employees.
As a lifelong employee of the church, I have been denied overtime, lost vacation pay, lost personal days, been doing 3 jobs in the same location and told that they were three different positions and therefore not qualifying for overtime, worked 12 hour shifts, and NO ONE CARED. They were happy for me to not be aware of the regulations and after the fact? Too bad, so sad.
soooooooooo
Good luck with that, Cardinal.
As a lifelong employee of the church, I have been denied overtime, lost vacation pay, lost personal days, been doing 3 jobs in the same location and told that they were three different positions and therefore not qualifying for overtime, worked 12 hour shifts, and NO ONE CARED. They were happy for me to not be aware of the regulations and after the fact? Too bad, so sad.
soooooooooo
Good luck with that, Cardinal.
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M-Dent
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I do believe the comment on Social Justice is apropos.
The topic of Social Justice has been one enthusiastically espoused by the Church (a large increase over the last 50 years) via the many Dioceses world-wide. Yet, when one looks at how many of these Dioceses fail to offer a living wage to their employees - it can make one scratch their head. The Church isn’t always a beacon for how to treat the worker.
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pianistclare
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Exactly, which is why I don’t think he’ll find “satisfaction there”.
I don’t know anyone who really has.
In fact, I remember telling one of my pastors (n jest of course) that if he ever preached on Social Justice he would see a green hymnal come flying out of the choir loft at a high rate of speed toward his noggin.
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Tantum_ergo
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While I know a bit of German, I don’t know enough to translate the interview, and I hesitate to accept a translation when there have been reports through the Vatican’s Greg Burke that the articles provided on what Cardinal Mueller has stated regarding questions, etc., are not accurate.
Personally, I find it rather amazing that in forums where people have been admonished, very properly, to give respect to the Pope, not to jump in criticizing him, etc., seem to have no problems whatsoever speaking ill of priests, bishops, or cardinals.
Personally, I find it rather amazing that in forums where people have been admonished, very properly, to give respect to the Pope, not to jump in criticizing him, etc., seem to have no problems whatsoever speaking ill of priests, bishops, or cardinals.
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pianistclare
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Who criticized him?
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twf
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I’ve seen people harshly condemn Cardinals based on a brief snippet in the secular media…its amazing. Every bishop is a successor of the apostles and a (not the, but a) vicar of Christ. If the Pope is owed Level 10 respect, a cardinal is owed Level 9 respect… no matter what you think he may have done. And as canon law clearly states, only the Pope, no one else on this planet, can judge a cardinal…
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twf
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I think he was referring to previous threads on this topic.
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tafan
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This would actually be a good thread else where on this forum. The Church’s social justice teachings are important, and it is also my experience that the parishes and diocese often seems to ignore those teachings with regards to local employees. Its worth discussing.
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johnnykins
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Frankly, the actions, and in-actions, of many, many bishops and cardinals as well as priests, brothers and sisters in the last 17 years (try Cardinals O’Brien, Law and Goer for a starter…I can give a bunch more names of bishops, priests, brothers and sisters if that’s helpful for you) have led to a substantial loss of trust for all clerics and vowed religious. A terrible, terrible shame. Yes, I blame those people who did so many terrible, criminal and harmful things, or covered them up illegally and immorally. While the position or status of the person deserves respect, it’s pretty darn clear the individual is - well - an individual. That many people are now skeptical that Catholic clergy and vowed religious are, as a group, due that respect that heretofore for many years they enjoyed, can only be attributed to the horrors of the scandal that continues to this day, even to the Vatican. The recent indictment of Cardinal Pell and the orgy by clergy at a suite owned by the CDF are a constant trial for any thinking Catholic.
As to Canon law and judgment reserved to the Pope, that is simply an ecclesial statute. I assure you, it in no way limits private opinion or personal judgment. It certainly does not limit civil law.
Putting the clergy on a pedestal, as many here do, is itself an abomination that contributes in many ways to a clergy who too often think themselves above the law - moral, civil and ecclesial.
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