Cardinal Pell weighs legal action after harsh criticism by member of papal abuse commission [CC]
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weller2
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LongingSoul
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I watched that on Sunday night and was jarred to the core when Peter Saunders referred to Cardinal Pell using the word “sociopathic”. It was just vicious and targeted. I have shaken my head at the mess that Cardinal Pell made of the child sex abuse situation when it was brought to him, but have always believed he was operating from naivety and complete incompetence for the role thrust on him at the time.
When the evidence first started to emerge and people started to come forward publically, it was almost too bizarre and incredible to believe that monsters of the calibre of these pedophile priests, existed. I didn’t really even know that pedophilia was such a big thing in my naive, protected, innocent life. I lived in a small country town growing up and one of the girls I went to school with was acting as mother to her family after her mother had died. Eventually she disappeared without any explanation and it wasn’t till I grew up that Mum told me the general knowledge was that she had become pregnant to her father and was sent off to an unwed mothers home. She never returned to town again. Nothing was done. It was talked about in hushed terms but no action was taken against the father or anything. Sexual abuse in its many forms, wasn’t known for the horrendous crime that it is.
Cardinal Pell acted ignorantly and it is right that he shoulder the blame for his failures, but he isn’t a sociopath. He was unfortunate to be responsible for many sociopaths and that can be a confusing position to be in.
When the evidence first started to emerge and people started to come forward publically, it was almost too bizarre and incredible to believe that monsters of the calibre of these pedophile priests, existed. I didn’t really even know that pedophilia was such a big thing in my naive, protected, innocent life. I lived in a small country town growing up and one of the girls I went to school with was acting as mother to her family after her mother had died. Eventually she disappeared without any explanation and it wasn’t till I grew up that Mum told me the general knowledge was that she had become pregnant to her father and was sent off to an unwed mothers home. She never returned to town again. Nothing was done. It was talked about in hushed terms but no action was taken against the father or anything. Sexual abuse in its many forms, wasn’t known for the horrendous crime that it is.
Cardinal Pell acted ignorantly and it is right that he shoulder the blame for his failures, but he isn’t a sociopath. He was unfortunate to be responsible for many sociopaths and that can be a confusing position to be in.
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7_Sorrows
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Peter Saunders shouldn’t be labeling Pell as unchristian because his behavior during the interview is not the best either.
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Hans_W
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It is difficult to see Cardinal Pell as innocent after watching this: youtube.com/watch?v=ajWT4BERoHc
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Nael
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What kind of reporting is this? Cardinal Pell: “I’ve got a recollection that I’ve spoken to David a number of times on this incident…”, and then cardinal Pell is just simply cut off at 6:52.
I also don’t get why David Ridsdale didn’t tell the police about Cardinal Pell supposedly offering him a bribe to keep quiet, but waited ten years to do so?
And isn’t cardinal Pell supposed to assume that Gerald Ridsdale was innocent until proven guilty? So walking to court alongside Gerald Ridsdale could just simply mean that Cardinal Pell was taking a neutral approach.
At the end of the report at least they admitted that cardinal Pell began a process that lead the Catholic world in dealing with sexual abuse.
Sorry but it appears that this report is extremely biased and therefore cannot be relied on for information about such a sensitive topic.
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7_Sorrows
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I am not judging Pell as guilty or innocent because I haven’t been following the case, but it seems like another scandal is beginning - starting with these two.
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Petaro
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It is easy to judge a man based on biased and perfunctory pieces in various media with agenda. It is easy to listen to the strident accusations of a man wounded by the pedophiles of the Church. It is so easy to condemn these monsters and drag anyone in authority during these years down with them.
But first let us try to discern the character of a man such as Pell. A hard man , many would say. A man well chosen to cut through the financial fluff of the old Vatican departments, functioning for eons as the Italian public service always functioned. Hide it here; don’t disclose that. Build up a catacomb of chinese walls. This needed a straight man; hard, prepared to make enemies out of his loyalty to his Church and his pontiff.
Pell lacks the charisma and charm of the diplomat. Truculent but honestly aggressive in his response to accusation. Prepared to take his stand against what he undoubtedly considered ill-mannered and over the top condemnations from a man who hardly knows him. Like many Australians, not known for his tact or the soft words of diplomacy, Cardinal Pell has been a bulwark of the Church in his intransigent position against the modernism of the moment or the leftist zeitgeist of our society.
Cardinal Pell has already given evidence before the Royal Commission twice. Once in person and once on teleconference. He has agreed to appear again if asked by the Commission itself; not by leftist media or a layman who appears to have over-reached his authority given to him by the Vatican in now personal attacks using words such as sociopath to describe a good servant caught amongst vipers.
May we pray for Cardinal Pell and his accusers that the hysteria and venom is taken out of what must be an historically cathartic inquiry that is necessary to clean the House of the Lord.
But first let us try to discern the character of a man such as Pell. A hard man , many would say. A man well chosen to cut through the financial fluff of the old Vatican departments, functioning for eons as the Italian public service always functioned. Hide it here; don’t disclose that. Build up a catacomb of chinese walls. This needed a straight man; hard, prepared to make enemies out of his loyalty to his Church and his pontiff.
Pell lacks the charisma and charm of the diplomat. Truculent but honestly aggressive in his response to accusation. Prepared to take his stand against what he undoubtedly considered ill-mannered and over the top condemnations from a man who hardly knows him. Like many Australians, not known for his tact or the soft words of diplomacy, Cardinal Pell has been a bulwark of the Church in his intransigent position against the modernism of the moment or the leftist zeitgeist of our society.
Cardinal Pell has already given evidence before the Royal Commission twice. Once in person and once on teleconference. He has agreed to appear again if asked by the Commission itself; not by leftist media or a layman who appears to have over-reached his authority given to him by the Vatican in now personal attacks using words such as sociopath to describe a good servant caught amongst vipers.
May we pray for Cardinal Pell and his accusers that the hysteria and venom is taken out of what must be an historically cathartic inquiry that is necessary to clean the House of the Lord.
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weller2
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That’s not the problematic part. This one is:
I think that it would be in public interest if ABC released entire, unedited footage of the 2002 interview.
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LongingSoul
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Cardinal Pell has been trusted in a genuinely heartfelt way around Australia in the Catholic heartland. By the heartland, I mean the bread and butter foot soldier types who walk the walk without being hardnosed traditionalists or the wishy washy liberal type.
Because of the scarcity of higher up clergy he has been put into a number of positions he wasn’t suited for and opened himself for ridicule and attack in defense of good and right. A couple of years ago he was pitted on TV against Peter Dawkins regarding religion and atheism and despite being both highly educated and devoted to the defense of the Church he was hopeless at proper debate rebuttal and naive about the obvious bias of the program. It was painful to watch.
He’s in a position of not only confronting the shocking ugliness of predatory abusers within his beloved ranks but also the true enemies of the Church hiding within the community of genuine victims seeking justice. It’s hard to distinguish at times the genuine dialogue from the sinister traps being set to bring down the Church.
I do feel confident that God has Cardinal Pell wrapped in His protection as he lives this necessary martyrdom for the healing of the victims and the cleansing of the Church.
Well said Petaro.
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Hans_W
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That was Richard Dawkins, the famous atheist. Yes, it was painful to watch. The good cardinal showed a complete lack of knowledge in matters of science. He should have prepared himself or, better, not entered into such a debate.
Judging him from the other videos relating to the abuse scandal, cardinal Pell gives the impression of a rather unemotional character, detached, almost uncaring. One would judge a younger person as probably shy, but with his experience, in his position? The way he denied having seen the photo of the girl with her wrists slashed, then he admits it, then has forgotten about it. That doesn’t seem normal.
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LongingSoul
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Oh sorry, Richard Dawkins, yes.
In every way shape and form, I diagnose Cardinal Pell with traits of Aspergers. I have a 24 year old son with that difficulty who also struggles with social etiquette issues, but is the sweetest and truest of people you could ever want to be associated with. He doesn’t handle agenda driven communication well at all and seems genuinely confused about what people are angling for. Yet he has put himself out there for the sake of getting the whole mess sorted. If you were to put a smooth, charismatic talker in the same role he is in, you’d be wondering if the Church was still in cover up mode. It can only be someone as authentic albiet fumbling, that will do in my opinion.
A letter has been issued today by some of the most prominent Arch’s and Bishops in Aus. to support him.
abc.net.au/news/2015-06-04/archbishops-write-letter-backing-cardinal-george-pell/6520188
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InigoMontoya
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I don’t know how else to respond!
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Robert_Bay
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MODERATOR WARNING
I know this is a controversial issue, but keep to the forum rules:
Don’t call people any names (such as liars)
Don’t make derogatory remarks against anyone including clergy
Stay charitable in your posts.
I know this is a controversial issue, but keep to the forum rules:
Don’t call people any names (such as liars)
Don’t make derogatory remarks against anyone including clergy
Stay charitable in your posts.
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Hans_W
Guest
This is a good point. You’re probably right and that would explain a lot. But is it going to get him off the hook in the current case(s)? How is the public going to react to either outcome?
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Lion_IRC
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What do you mean “off the hook”?
He isn’t accused of any crime whatsoever.
It’s amazing how gutless some people are in their slanderous attacks on George Pell.
Anyone who claims to have facts (as opposed to inuendo and fabricated, hearsay gossip) should go immediately to the nearest police station and make a formal SWORN statement to back up their allegations.
If I were George Pell I would take legal action against any defamatory public remarks and sue the person for as much money as possible then donate the awarded amount to charity.
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Hans_W
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Are you familiar with the background of this case? The child abuse in that small Australian town, which was going on for two decades, involved a veritable paedophile ring and more than hundred children. One of the worst perpetrators was a Catholic priest, Gerald Ridsdale. He was moved from parish to parish and his superiors must have known very well what was going on. This thread deals with the question of whether Cardinal Pell, then a priest and later a bishop in the area, knew about the cover-up.
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weller2
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Oh, by all means, I’d be very happy if Cdl Pell sued Saunders. Then the court will have to objectively evaluate whether Cardinal’s behavior fulfills criteria on the DSM-IV checklist for antisocial personality disorder:
That would be a very interesting trial.
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Dawnia
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Why do you think that? His mental state has nothing to do with the claims that Pell covered up for a pedophile. Which, is what any good attorney would stick with. The rest is just Saunders opinion.
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Lion_IRC
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Yes.
Small town?
I dare you to specifically name which one of his superiors (you allege) knew
‘very well what was going on’.
…of course some of Ridsdales superiors are no longer alive. So I guess they are fair game if you want to take cheap pot-shots.
Put up a time line of dates showing the point at which (you allege) George Pell became aware of
(as yet unreported) criminal activity.
Be very careful what you say.
Concealing a crime and perverting the course of justice was and still is a criminal offence.
Accusing someone of doing this is a serious allegation.
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