Cardinal Pell weighs legal action after harsh criticism by member of papal abuse commission [CC]

[Lion_IRC]

Oh, by all means, I’d be very happy if Cdl Pell sued Saunders. Then the court will have to objectively evaluate whether Cardinal’s behavior fulfills criteria on the DSM-IV checklist for antisocial personality disorder:…

No, the court would not make that determination.

What it would do is decide whether Saunders is properly credentialed and qualified to make such a clinical diagnosis - and if not, then he ought not have falsely denigrated someone without a valid basis.

 

[Hans_W]

Yes.

Small town?

I dare you to specifically name which one of his superiors (you allege) knew
‘very well what was going on’.
…of course some of Ridsdales superiors are no longer alive. So I guess they are fair game if you want to take cheap pot-shots.

Put up a time line of dates showing the point at which (you allege) George Pell became aware of
(as yet unreported) criminal activity.

Be very careful what you say.

Concealing a crime and perverting the course of justice was and still is a criminal offence.
Accusing someone of doing this is a serious allegation.

What is your problem Lion IRC?
You make it sound like I was part of that conspiracy. I simply summarised the case for you in three lines.
Obviously you are still not aware of the facts when you talk about an “as yet unreported criminal activity”. As far as I know Gerald Ridsdale was in court more than once.

 

[weller2]

What it would do is decide whether Saunders is properly credentialed and qualified to make such a clinical diagnosis - and if not, then he ought not have falsely denigrated someone without a valid basis.

Falsely being the operative word here. The defense would probably call as witness Anthony Foster who first described Pell as exhibiting a "sociopathic lack of empathy" also under oath. Countering Foster’s testimony is going to be difficult, because Pell has been caught lying about his interaction with Foster on video. So even the dumbest lawyer will manage to competely destroy credibility of witness Pell in the first five minutes of the trial.

As I said, bring this on, because Saunders probably knows much more about the Cardinal then I do, and the trial will put all that on a public record.

 

[Lion_IRC]

What is your problem Lion IRC?
You make it sound like I was part of that conspiracy. I simply summarised the case for you in three lines.
Obviously you are still not aware of the facts when you talk about an “as yet unreported criminal activity”. As far as I know Gerald Ridsdale was in court more than once.

That is precisely what is at stake here - the police apparently didn’t have evidence of any criminal activity until May of 1993.

If they didn’t/couldn’t bring a single charge against Ridsdale what makes you think George Pell was sitting on unreported evidence not yet available to the police?

Had George Pell heard rumours? Yes.

But WHO was spreading those rumours? And why were THEY not reporting those (hearsay) allegations to police.

Remember, it is the official policy of the RCC in Australia that any accusations/allegations by victims or witnesses are to be made to the police in the first instance. So a person who knows something yet refuses to report it to the police can hardly accuse the church of a coverup.

 

[Hans_W]

Remember, it is the official policy of the RCC in Australia that any accusations/allegations by victims or witnesses are to be made to the police in the first instance. So a person who knows something yet refuses to report it to the police can hardly accuse the church of a coverup.

That may be now and in the last 20 years. But it wasn’t the case in the 60s and 70s.

 

[mikekle]

I read a few years back that the senior priest at the parish I went to school at when I was in the 1st thru 6th grade, had been reported as one of those pedophile priests, apparently there was more than a few people that made this claim about him, I was about the same age as many of these people, so I had the same level of contact with this particular priest, I vividly remember many enjoyable times with this priest, none of them were negative, in fact, he had the entire 3rd class out to his farm he owned in the next city over, teachers, and some parents went along, it was like a field trip.

He had a couple horses, cows, a goat, chickens, etc. It was a great day, I remember riding the horse, watching the goat do its thing. I remember being alone a few times with this priest, yet nothing happened.

After this came out about him, I saw on FB, a few friends who were classmates at the time, they also had no negative memories of this priest and thought maybe those people accusing him were out for money, taking advantage of this current problem, being they would have been in the ‘right place, right times, etc’

I have a feeling some people may be making up claims about priests, maybe they were upset at having to attend catholic school, maybe they just want money?

I just wanted to mention what great memories I have of this priest, IMO, he was a great man, who was very kind.

 

[abucs]

Are you familiar with the background of this case? The child abuse in that small Australian town, which was going on for two decades, involved a veritable paedophile ring and more than hundred children. One of the worst perpetrators was a Catholic priest, Gerald Ridsdale. He was moved from parish to parish and his superiors must have known very well what was going on. This thread deals with the question of whether Cardinal Pell, then a priest and later a bishop in the area, knew about the cover-up.

Archbishop Pell was at the time a young priest in the diocese of Ballarat and not in any real position of power. Years later he became the bishop of Melbourne which is a different diocese.

It has been suggested that Ridsdale’s homosexuality was a reason for moving him to a different parish. I don’t think there has been any evidence presented that would show that the Church knew Ridsdale sodomised his nephew (in the 60 minutes show) or other young boys.

 

[weller2]

I don’t think there has been any evidence presented that would show that the Church knew Ridsdale sodomised his nephew (in the 60 minutes show) or other young boys.

A victim preyed on by a Christian brother who was part of a notorious pedophile ring involving the clergy in the Victorian town of Ballarat claimed George Pell, the former Archbishop of Sydney, ignored his pleas to stop the abuse, a court has heard.

Crown prosecutor Brett Sonnet told the County Court on Friday that the victim of pedophile brother Ted Dowlan, 65, alleged he was at a local Ballarat swimming pool in 1973 when he approached Dr Pell to try to discuss the abuse.

The victim claimed he told Dr Pell, who is now head of the Vatican’s finances, something had to be done to stop Dowlan abusing young boys at St Patrick’s College.

Dr Pell allegedly replied: “Don’t be ridiculous.”

Dr Pell has consistently denied knowing children were being abused in Ballarat during the time he was there.

Dowlan, who changed his name by deed poll to Bales in 2011, pleaded guilty on Friday to 33 counts of indecently assaulting boys under the age of 16 and one count of gross indecency between 1971-86 involving 20 victims.

thecourier.com.au/story/2866695/george-pell-ignored-pleas-of-ballarat-sex-abuse-victim-court-told/

Pell has repeatedly denied any knowledge of the systemic sexual abuse that occurred in the Ballarat area during his tenure at St Alipius Parish School between 1973 and 1983. During this time, Pell lived in the same presbytery house as vile sexual predator, and defrocked Christian Brother, Gerald Francis Ridsdale, who abused over 200 children across 20 years.

It is also unclear how much of a hand Pell had in transferring Ridsdale out of the Mortlake parish—the paedophile was repeatedly moved from church to church right across Australia, and re-offended at every location. Pell was present, according to the minutes of a September 1982 meeting of the Diocesan Consultors Committee, in which local clergy leaders decided to transfer Ridsdale, for reasons that it had become “necessary”. Many have argued that the Committee (including Pell) knew full well of Ridsdale’s transgressions and, in protecting the Church, abetted Ridsdale’s drive to rape and molest more and more Australian children.

Ridsdale testified via video link at the hearings last week, claiming Pell knew nothing about his crimes. However, several other survivors called out Pell in their testimonies, arguing it was “inconceivable” that he was oblivious to the abuse. Ridsdale’s nephew and victim, David Ridsdale, claimed he phoned Pell in February 1993 to inform him of his uncle’s abuses: “I want to know what it will take to keep you quiet,” Pell allegedly responded, a bribe he denies.

spookmagazine.com/heaven-or-pell-its-time-for-cardinal-george-to-answer-tough-questions/

 

[Lion_IRC]

thecourier.com.au/story/2866695/george-pell-ignored-pleas-of-ballarat-sex-abuse-victim-court-told/

“…victim of pedophile…alleged he was at a local Ballarat swimming pool in 1973 when he approached Dr Pell to try to discuss the abuse.”

1973 ?
How can people remember a conversation that long ago?

Allegedly tried to discuss events which allegedly took place BEFORE George Pell even came to Ballarat. ? How would he be able to do more than the police?

“…a Mildura detective, Denis Ryan, gathered 16 written statements from 14 boys and two girls detailing child abuse offences against Monsignor John Day. Day, Mildura parish priest from 1957 to 1971”

Very unfortunate for George Pell that, as many alleged perpetrators are suffering from dementia, and other perpetrators are long since dead and buried, their victims NOW have perfect recall of events which took place in secret 20, 30, 40 years ago.

And very unfortunate that the media reports those allegations as if they were rolled-gold facts.

 

[Hans_W]

**

… events which took place **in secret **20, 30, 40 years ago.

[my emphasis]

That’s easy to explain.

I never had any such experience, but I can vividly imagine my parent’s reaction if I told them in the 50s, 60s or even the 70s that a priest has touched me indecently!

Secondly, I would have been too ashamed to say anything.
Thirdly, I wouldn’t have known what has happened to me. That’s unimaginable today since nothing is hidden anymore on today’s TV and internet news.

 

[abucs]

Weller2,

your first quote doesn’t mention Ridsdale at all and your second quote can be summarised as speculation by some people that the young priest Pell should have known what was going on with Ridsdale.

Does the minutes of any of he meetings specifically refer to allegations of Ridsdale abusing young boys or is that speculation decades later?

Surely if the minutes refer to the abuse of young boys then you have the evidence. If they don’t refer to abuse then it becomes speculation and guesswork 40 years after the fact.

It seems like a pretty simple equation.