Cardinal Schonborn on 'Amoris Laetitia'

[Vico]

Like I mentioned above I won’t have much time to contribute to this thread in an in-depth way but I have two points. First, wouldn’t they need a dispensation in the first place, not after the fact? Second, if they can be led into the Sacrament of Matrimony then the civil marriage wasn’t valid initially, or else there would be no need for that.

Yes, they need a dispensation in the first place, except for the extraordinary circumstance allowed for in canon law.

Yes, per the canon law, the civil marriage, for a Catholic is invalid attempt due to lack of form, except in the the extraordinary circumstance allowed for in canon law.

H.H. Pope Francis was quoted as saying about those Catholics in north part of South America, the do not initially marry in the Church but merely a civil marriage:

“It’s a superstition, because marriage frightens the husband. It’s a superstition we have to overcome,” the Pope said. “I’ve seen a lot of fidelity in these cohabitations, and I am sure that this is a real marriage, they have the grace of a real marriage because of their fidelity, but there are local superstitions, etc.”

When he says “a real marriage” I believe he means the consent makes the marriage, in this situation. It seems that this is more along the line of the canon law from 1983 through 2010 that allowed a Catholic to marry without Catholic form, if formally defection occurred first. Of course that was changed by H.H. Pope Benedict XVI, back to the way it was.

 

[CrossofChrist]

My friend, that is totally unfair. If you don’t have time for this thread, then please don’t say something with terrible implications like that and then just disappear.

Nothing in my post deserved that; nor did I say he was insinuating anything. I gave you a thread-long, reasoned interpretation of what I and people much theologically smarter than I think. The fact that you insinuated it was something unjust is more than disappointing.

Anyway, God bless you for joining the Church and being protective of the Pope. May your tribe increase.

I’m sorry, I didn’t mean it that way. Please forgive me.

I do need to gradually bow out of the thread after tonight though as some other obligations in my life have arisen.

 

[CrossofChrist]

Yes, they need a dispensation in the first place, except for the extraordinary circumstance allowed for in canon law.

Yes, per the canon law, the civil marriage, for a Catholic is invalid attempt due to lack of form, except in the the extraordinary circumstance allowed for in canon law.

H.H. Pope Francis was quoted as saying about those Catholics in north part of South America, the do not initially marry in the Church but merely a civil marriage:

“It’s a superstition, because marriage frightens the husband. It’s a superstition we have to overcome,” the Pope said. “I’ve seen a lot of fidelity in these cohabitations, and I am sure that this is a real marriage, they have the grace of a real marriage because of their fidelity, but there are local superstitions, etc.”

When he says “a real marriage” I believe he means the consent makes the marriage, in this situation. It seems that this is more along the line of the canon law from 1983 through 2010 that allowed a Catholic to marry without Catholic form, if formally defection occurred first. Of course that was changed by H.H. Pope Benedict XVI, back to the way it was.

Where in canon law is that?

 

[KSU]

I do need to gradually bow out of the thread after tonight though as some other obligations in my life have arisen.

Understood, thanks.

 

[Vico]

Where in canon law is that?

Can. 1116 §1. If a person competent to assist according to the norm of law cannot be present or approached without grave inconvenience, those who intend to enter into a true marriage can contract it validly and licitly before witnesses only:

1/ in danger of death;

2/ outside the danger of death provided that it is prudently foreseen that the situation will continue for a month.

§2. In either case, if some other priest or deacon who can be present is available, he must be called and be present at the celebration of the marriage together with the witnesses, without prejudice to the validity of the marriage before witnesses only.