Cardinal's Clothing Budget $20,000! ?

[trickster]

CARDINAL’S CLOTHING BILL? The average set of cardinal’s clothes costs as much as $20,000. In October, Pope Francis urged officials to dress more modestly and to not squander such money. In the same month, he ordered a German bishop to explain how he had spent $3 million on a marble courtyard. Why does a cardinal need a budget of $20,000/year? He certainly could put that towards charity…

What’s up with that?

 

[George_Stegmeir]

In many parts of the world, such as Europe and the US, a Cardinal must “dress the part”. If a Prince of the Church does not dress like one, people at large will not respect him and donations which are necessary for the survival of the church will fall off.
The only Cardinal that does not dress the part, to my knowledge is the one in Boston, USA who is a Franciscan and still wears the Franciscan robe and sandles. He has brought a stark regimen to the Church in Boston, selling off the Bishops mansion and donating the money to the poor. He lives in humble quarters without servants.

 

[Lion_IRC]

CARDINAL’S CLOTHING BILL? The average set of cardinal’s clothes costs as much as $20,000. In October, Pope Francis urged officials to dress more modestly and to not squander such money. In the same month, he ordered a German bishop to explain how he had spent $3 million on a marble courtyard. Why does a cardinal need a budget of $20,000/year? He certainly could put that towards charity…

What’s up with that?

Are you agreeing with Pope Francis?
Who is the German bishop to whom your question is addressed?
Have you got contact details for him?
Why not send him an email?

 

[Irish_Cabbie]

Who is the German bishop to whom your question is addressed?

“The Bishop of Bling” is named is Franz-Peter Tebartz-van Elst. Are you telling us that you haven’t heard of him?

csmonitor.com/World/Europe/2013/1022/Pope-Francis-boots-Germany-s-Bishop-of-Bling-from-pricey-home

Have you got contact details for him? Why not send him an email?

His Excellency might be tough to reach at the moment. According to press reports, he is living in a monastery. Incidentally, what sort of Wi-fi connection do you think they have in a monastery, Lion IRC?

worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/11/01/21276285-germanys-embattled-bishop-bling-moves-to-monastery-for-recuperation?lite

 

[cguerber]

In many parts of the world, such as Europe and the US, a Cardinal must “dress the part”. If a Prince of the Church does not dress like one, people at large will not respect him and donations which are necessary for the survival of the church will fall off.
The only Cardinal that does not dress the part, to my knowledge is the one in Boston, USA who is a Franciscan and still wears the Franciscan robe and sandles. He has brought a stark regimen to the Church in Boston, selling off the Bishops mansion and donating the money to the poor. He lives in humble quarters without servants.

As per your first paragraph, I’m glad Jesus didn’t feel that way! If it’s about money… well then, so be it I guess.

Acts 3:6
Then Peter said, “Silver or gold I do not have, but what I do have I give you. In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, walk.”

 

[tbcrawford]

CARDINAL’S CLOTHING BILL? The average set of cardinal’s clothes costs as much as $20,000. In October, Pope Francis urged officials to dress more modestly and to not squander such money. In the same month, he ordered a German bishop to explain how he had spent $3 million on a marble courtyard. Why does a cardinal need a budget of $20,000/year? He certainly could put that towards charity…

What’s up with that?

Sadly it is these stories that turn people away from the church. Pope Francis has a huge job to do and he is doing it very well at present. There are things that are completely out of control within the members of the church.Corruption and abuse to name the top issues.

It should not surprise us that people criticize the church…they have every right and it is up to us the members of this church to not condone these terrible things and encourage the world to see that we understand things have gone wrong but we are striving to put them right.

I thank God for Pope Francis.

 

[weller2]

In many parts of the world, such as Europe and the US, a Cardinal must “dress the part”. If a Prince of the Church does not dress like one, people at large will not respect him and donations which are necessary for the survival of the church will fall off.

Oh please. The dress that a Catholic cardinal should wear looks like that:

http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/files/2009/10/bishops-elysee.jpg

That could be made by any competent tailor for $1000 and would last several years.

But certain princes of the Church think that they must wear golden robes. I could even swallow that – gold is expensive, but not that expensive. But for some reason, they insist on buying the most expensive items from the most expensive store in Rome which deals in such things (the very existence of this store means that someone must be buying those things, and the market is rather limited). And the result is this:

http://www.globalpost.com/sites/def...-with-caution_original/burke_vestments_v7.jpg

This is not a kind of dress which induces respect.

I mean, if someone really has to blow $4K on a golden chasube, fine. It’s justified to have one one for official liturgical use.

But $3K for a cope which is basically a piece of red cloth? What kind of pricing is that?

 

[aidanbradypop]

In many parts of the world, such as Europe and the US, a Cardinal must “dress the part”. If a Prince of the Church does not dress like one, people at large will not respect him and donations which are necessary for the survival of the church will fall off.

I’m glad the early Christians and followers of Christ, the Prince, didn’t hinge their respect of Him based on the clothing He wore.

The only Cardinal that does not dress the part, to my knowledge is the one in Boston, USA who is a Franciscan and still wears the Franciscan robe and sandles. He has brought a stark regimen to the Church in Boston, selling off the Bishops mansion and donating the money to the poor. He lives in humble quarters without servants.

Bishop Sean is a wonderful example, as well as Pope Francis, of how one should serve God and man.

 

[L_Marshall]

I’m guessing that $20,000 is a made up number.

A standard cassock from Gammarelli’s is about $800, but it’ll last 10-20 years
A choir cassock may run a bit more, maybe $900, but it’ll last just as long
Facie are about $60
Zuchetti are also about $60
A biretta is about $100-120
Cardinals usually use the same pectoral cross, rochet that they had when they were a bishop.

That puts a cardinal’s wardrobe (not including things like shirts, pants, shoes, et c.) under $2,000. If they wear these things daily, that means that they’re spending less than 40¢ a day on their garb (if everything lasts for 15 years). That’s less per day than what I’m wearing right now, and I’m not wearing anything special.

I think many of the ecclesiastical tailors are still very old-fashioned. They’ll cost a pretty penny, but the stuff could easily last you a lifetime, and if it gets worn out, you can repair it, not replace it.

 

[TEPO]

I want a crozier… The most expensive one I can find.

 

[jilly4ski]

Oh please. The dress that a Catholic cardinal should wear looks like that:

That could be made by any competent tailor for $1000 and would last several years.

But certain princes of the Church think that they must wear golden robes. I could even swallow that – gold is expensive, but not that expensive. But for some reason, they insist on buying the most expensive items from the most expensive store in Rome which deals in such things (the very existence of this store means that someone must be buying those things, and the market is rather limited). And the result is this:

This is not a kind of dress which induces respect.

I mean, if someone really has to blow $4K on a golden chasube, fine. It’s justified to have one one for official liturgical use.

But $3K for a cope which is basically a piece of red cloth? What kind of pricing is that?

What are you talking about. The first image is the cardinals “street dress.” He would need a few of these, for when one is being repaired or in the wash.

The second set of pictures are not “clothing” but vestments. Vestments worn during Mass for the glory of God. Bishops and Cardinals don’t go walking around town or meetings in their miters, copes, chasubles and crosier. By the way, the picture is not even correct. The white garment under the chasuble is an alb not a dalmatic, a dalmatic is the proper vestment for deacon.

Per the OP, where is your cite. You just threw $20,000 out there but gave no proof, and did not qualify anything. Is this the “bill” for all the cardinals street clothes (new reds) and all their liturgical clothes? A “budget” suggests yearly, but a cardinal would not have to purchase new vestments every year. Indeed they would not even have to purchase new vestments except for getting his reds. He could continue to wear the same vestments he wore as a bishop. (including miter, chasuble, albs, crosier, and pectoral cross.

And for everyone’s information vestments and liturgical clothing is expensive. Even the Franciscan habit of Cardinal Sean of Boston is expensive (ask BrJR) and he still needs vestments to say Mass.

All this griping over money is very unbecoming and starts to look like calamity when no proof is offered.

 

[jaimeleglise]

Yes, Boston’s Sean Cardinal O’Malley totally rocks. He is awesome. He lives the Gospel.

 

[Joe_5859]

What is the source for the claim in the OP?

 

[Peebo]

I don’t mind much of the pageantry that is part of the tradition of the Catholic Church…as long as it doesn’t become excessive…which unfortunately over the centuries it has become in some cases…Pope Francis…like his namesake Saint Francis appears to be rebuilding the church by his example…I’m sure there is opposition from within the hierarchy of the church worldwide from those who have enjoyed privileges beyond their role as “princes of the church”…God bless Pope Francis as he reforms our Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church with the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

 

[KrazyKat]

In many parts of the world, such as Europe and the US, a Cardinal must “dress the part”. If a Prince of the Church does not dress like one, people at large will not respect him and donations which are necessary for the survival of the church will fall off.
The only Cardinal that does not dress the part, to my knowledge is the one in Boston, USA who is a Franciscan and still wears the Franciscan robe and sandles. He has brought a stark regimen to the Church in Boston, selling off the Bishops mansion and donating the money to the poor. He lives in humble quarters without servants.

Blessed are the Franciscans.

 

[L_Marshall]

I think it’s also important to recognize that a bishop probably doesn’t own his own vestments. He may own a set or two, but they’re probably nothing fancy.

The vestments and vessels used at the cathedral of my diocese largely come from donation when the diocese was created — about 90 years ago, and they’re still in use today.

 

[tbcrawford]

I don’t mind much of the pageantry that is part of the tradition of the Catholic Church…as long as it doesn’t become excessive…which unfortunately over the centuries it has become in some cases…Pope Francis…like his namesake Saint Francis appears to be rebuilding the church by his example…I’m sure there is opposition from within the hierarchy of the church worldwide from those who have enjoyed privileges beyond their role as “princes of the church”…God bless Pope Francis as he reforms our Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church with the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

 

[weller2]

I’m guessing that $20,000 is a made up number.

No. It originated when someone took a photo of Card. Burke in liturgical vestments, then looked up prices of each item, added up, and arrived at $30K. You can find the PDF linked here: contemplativecatholicuk.blogspot.com/2010/11/cost-of-looking-good-in-magic-kingdom.html

Of course I understand the need for liturgical vestments, but Card. Burke’s apparent taste for items from the top shelf seems a bit… excessive.

That aside, I have an impression the vendors overcharge simply because they can.

 

[Convert2013]

I’d like to see a source for that claim as well.

Here’s a couple links for places that sell the articles…

slabbinck.be/en-ZA/homepage/index.html

And Barbiconi which was previously mentioned…
barbiconi.it/categoria.asp?idscat3=69

 

[OraLabora]

His Excellency might be tough to reach at the moment. According to press reports, he is living in a monastery. Incidentally, what sort of Wi-fi connection do you think they have in a monastery, Lion IRC?

Any monastery I’ve visited recently has pretty good Internet connectivity for the monks. All of them have e-mail.

Their Internet privileges are strictly monitored though.