Catholic Apologists and the Greek Word Trogo (“Eat my flesh” John 6)

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Catholic Apologists and the Greek Word Trogo (“Eat my flesh” John 6)“Catholic Answers” says the following about the Greek word trogo :”The Greek word used for “eats” trogon is very blunt and has the sense of “chewing” or “gnawing. This is not language of metaphor. Bob Sungenis says “There is simply no logical reason to switch form the more generic phago (eat) to the more praphic trogo (chew). Apparently, Rome’s apologists believe the word “chew” cannot be the language of metaphor because it is simply too graphic or vivid to be anything other than the literal truth. Not so the more mundane “eat,” which as Sugnenis points out, can be used metaphorically. Keating himself simply asserts—without proof—that such is “not the language of metaphor.” But why not? Is there something intrinsically literal about the word “chew” in English or in Greek? If you think it through, virtually any word in any language can be used metaphorically no matter how graphic or vivid it may be. In fact, the more vivid and evocative the word, the more it lends itself to being used as a metaphor. Apparently they don’t know well what a metaphor is. Metaphor: “A picture is a thousand words”. In a metaphor real objects or physical events represent something else. A metaphor is a colorful expression used for literary effect which may be a word or phrase that departs from literal language. The purpose of metaphors is: add color and vividness, attract attention and make abstract or intellectual ideas more concrete. All things being equal, one could just as easily make the case that Jesus chose the more vivid “chew” precisely because it was more conducive to metaphor. “Chew” may simply be a more graphic metaphor than “eat.” Some say contextual rather than non-contextual usage is the primary criterion for determining whether or not trogo is metaphorical in John 6.
 
My dear friends Cathlics I am waiting to read your answers.
 
That still doesn’t explain why Jesus never told anyone it was a metaphor. Why would he just let all those disciples walk away because they thought he was talking literally?
 
That still doesn’t explain why Jesus never told anyone it was a metaphor. Why would he just let all those disciples walk away because they thought he was talking literally?
Because these people werent willing to believe no matter what. They werent willing to believe even before Jesus starts talking about the debatable “eating” and “drinking”(figurative) v.35,36. They were following for the wrong motives, eating and drinking physical food :“Jesus answered them and said, “Truly, truly, I say to you, you seek Me, not because you saw signs, but because you ate of the loaves and were filled.” v.26. To say that if Jesus would have explained it was literal, they would have believed, is false.
 
Marcos, whether or not your argument is right, that Jesus’ word was a metaphor, whatever words He used made the crowd of disciples turn and leave. It seems to me the translation, or even the meaning of the word is less important than the impact and the consequences. So, the Real Presence in the Eucharist is left unaffected by the argument about the word, and is consumed by whatever metaphor anyone would like to make of it.
Peace to you, brother.
 
My dear friends Cathlics I am waiting to read your answers.
What about the word for flesh: Sarx.

Catholics believe the literal meaning depends on the intent of the inspired writer. The psalms are intended to be poetry. The gospels in relating the the last supper and words of Jesus are meant to be taken as historical fact. The spiritual meaning is in addition to the literal meaning. It’s not an either or issue.
 
Because these people werent willing to believe no matter what. They werent willing to believe even before Jesus starts talking about the debatable “eating” and “drinking”(figurative) v.35,36. They were following for the wrong motives, eating and drinking physical food :“Jesus answered them and said, “Truly, truly, I say to you, you seek Me, not because you saw signs, but because you ate of the loaves and were filled.” v.26. To say that if Jesus would have explained it was literal, they would have believed, is false.
I agree with the bolded part. I do think that is what happened.
 
What about the word for flesh: Sarx.

Catholics believe the literal meaning depends on the intent of the inspired writer. The psalms are intended to be poetry. The gospels in relating the the last supper and words of Jesus are meant to be taken as historical fact. The spiritual meaning is in addition to the literal meaning. It’s not an either or issue.
Blood, flesh (literal) = Jesus

Eat, drink (figurative) = Believe

Believe in Jesus.
 
I was always taught in all my theology courses that the word meant “gnaw”.
 
No doubt about it, Jesus was not speaking metaphorically.

And it was the communion ceremony that disgusted the Jews and the Romans and made the Christians targets and the object of persecutions in those first centuries. A devotee drank his blood and ate his body by drinking the wine and eating the bread.

It is a difficult concept to argue around even today.

Some postulate that Jesus had been exposed to some of dark rituals of the cult groups that tended to base in the Mt. Carmel area. That could be the link between the two Greeks that came looking for Jesus at his last Passover.

What was Jesus hoping to accomplish by being executed? He could have easily evaded the High Priests if he wanted to.
 
Because these people werent willing to believe no matter what. They werent willing to believe even before Jesus starts talking about the debatable “eating” and “drinking”(figurative) v.35,36. They were following for the wrong motives, eating and drinking physical food :“Jesus answered them and said, “Truly, truly, I say to you, you seek Me, not because you saw signs, but because you ate of the loaves and were filled.” v.26. To say that if Jesus would have explained it was literal, they would have believed, is false.
Yeah I don’t believe that all who left were unbelievers. The bible actually tells us that they were disciples of Jesus and some did not believe. This is the only instance in the Gospels where such a large amount of his followers left him and stopped following. The reason many left was that they were struggling with accepting the words spoken to them and the Lord never stops them and says hey I’m only speaking symbolically, I didn’t mean it literally and as we know it was the will of him who sent him that, he should lose nothing of all that he had given him, as stated in 6:39. In your argument you also neglect the fact that the Greek word used for eating up to 6:54 is esthio, which was the common word for human eating. So there was a reason that a different word was used (trogo) which though in limited cases was used to describe human eating, was most often used to describe the feeding of animals.
 
Visualize, you are there and Jesus says “Look at me, I AM the bread of life” You look at Him and say “he is talking figuratively I ma not stupid I get it” Jesus was saying that is his present form He was the bread of life. No change of form mentioned. Some took it literally imagining eating literally his arm , legs , toes and other parts. These were the ones that wouldnt beleive no matter what.
 
Visualize, you are there and Jesus says “Look at me, I AM the bread of life” You look at Him and say “he is talking figuratively I ma not stupid I get it” Jesus was saying that is his present form He was the bread of life. No change of form mentioned. Some took it literally imagining eating literally his arm , legs , toes and other parts. These were the ones that wouldnt beleive no matter what.
For them to think to eat and drink his flesh was figuratively would have posed a huge problem because for the Jews at that time when the phrase, eat the flesh and drink the blood is used figuratively it means to inflict a serious injury by false accusation or slander. Just as it means to many Arabs today. So to say the Lord is using this phrase figuratively is to say that the Lord is promising eternal life to the person for slandering and hating him. See Micah 3:3.
 
I visualize every time I’m at Mass, Jesus saying, “Take and eat, this is my body”

I might not understand, but I see with eyes of faith. God’s words have power to create everything from nothing, change water to wine, and bread to His Body. I believe.
 
For them to think to eat and drink his flesh was figuratively would have posed a huge problem because for the Jews at that time when the phrase, eat the flesh and drink the blood is used figuratively it means to inflict a serious injury by false accusation or slander. Just as it means to many Arabs today. So to say the Lord is using this phrase figuratively is to say that the Lord is promising eternal life to the person for slandering and hating him. See Micah 3:3.
Somebody else already answr your objection a long time a ago , allow mw to share it with you.
Could “eating flesh” be a figure of something positive?

Catholic apologists argue that the figurative meaning of eating flesh and drinking blood as used by the Jews is always negative, implying inflicting injury, calumny or false accusation. Therefore in John 6 eating and drinking cannot be taken figuratively and must be understood literally.

There is no doubt that figurative “eating flesh” is used negatively, but the conclusion that it can never be used in a positive sense is absurd. Depending on the*** context***, the same figure is often used to express opposites.For things that signify now one thing and now another…They signify contraries, for example, when they are used metaphorically at one time in a good sense, at another in a bad…Bread is used in a good sense, ‘I am the living bread which came down from heaven;’ in a bad, ‘Bread eaten in secret is pleasant.’ And so in a great many other case” We know that eating flesh could mean a physical injury or a false accusation by looking at the context in which it is used. Similarly, if we examine the context of John 6, it is hard to miss Jesus’ explanation that eating flesh and drinking blood should be understood spiritually as coming and believing on Him.
 
I visualize every time I’m at Mass, Jesus saying, “Take and eat, this is my body”

I might not understand, but I see with eyes of faith. God’s words have power to create everything from nothing, change water to wine, and bread to His Body. I believe.
You are ignoring the context, the situation in which that teachings was given, if you ignore you wont get it
 
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