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Soutane
Guest
Off with his head.
Another Bishop who should be chained to a bedstead in the attic of the vatican.How DO some of these morons become Bishops?
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Eucharisted
Guest
May Jesus pardon him and correct him and protect him.
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nice2000
Guest
“Pope Benedict’s lifting of Mr Williamson’s ex-communication sparked outrage among Jewish groups and in Israel. The Vatican’s handling of the affair prompted criticism from German Chancellor Angela Merkel.”
I am totally floored on why Pope Benedict lifted the ex-communication.
I am totally floored on why Pope Benedict lifted the ex-communication.
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Eucharisted
Guest
Because he has in mind the whole Church, not just one bishop. Besides, Mother Church is merciful, she holds sinners to her bosom.“Pope Benedict’s lifting of Mr Williamson’s ex-communication sparked outrage among Jewish groups and in Israel. The Vatican’s handling of the affair prompted criticism from German Chancellor Angela Merkel.”
I am totally floored on why Pope Benedict lifted the ex-communication.
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Cider
Guest
welcome to 6 months ago.
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nice2000
Guest
Okay. I can agree with you on that. Did the Bishop state publicly that he was wrong in saying what he said? Doesn’t the Jewish community deserve an apology from this Bishop?
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nice2000
Guest
What happened six months ago?
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rkrispies
Guest
That is when all of this started up (I think it was actually closer to 9 months). This isn’t a new story. Just someone way behind in the news.
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Joe_5859
Guest
By being illicitly ordained in a “schismatic act” and promptly excommunicated.
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manualman
Guest
This is totally old news and this bishop was never ordained by the pope. IIRC, he was illicitly ordained by a bishop of the SSPX (in defiance of Vatican instructions not to do so.). Because of how apostolic succession works, he IS a bishop, just a rogue one from the moment of his ordination.
B16 HAS been working with this group to try to heal the schism, which has NOTHING to do with the Holocaust. The flap over this interview is unrelated to the Vatican / SSPX dialogue except that the Vatican should have done more vetting to see what ELSE had happened while these guys were away from the fold.
B16 HAS been working with this group to try to heal the schism, which has NOTHING to do with the Holocaust. The flap over this interview is unrelated to the Vatican / SSPX dialogue except that the Vatican should have done more vetting to see what ELSE had happened while these guys were away from the fold.
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Eucharisted
Guest
This.
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Joe_5859
Guest
Back in January, Pope Benedict XVI lifted the excommunications of Bishop Williamson and the three other excommunicated SSPX bishops as the next step in reconciling the rift and bringing them back into the fold. It was an act of mercy and love on Benedict’s part, not a concession to their doctrinal positions.
At that time, Benedict received a lot of flak because of Williamson’s position on the Holocaust (which Benedict was unaware of). The other three SSPX bishops do not appear to agree with Williamson on this point. At that time, Williamson seemed open reinvestigating the issue.
Of course, starting next week, the Vatican is starting its closed-door dialogue with the SSPX, so I guess it makes sense to start seeing this sort of stuff make it back into the news.
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mdzialo
Guest
The Bishop says he thinks 300,000 is an accurate count for the number of Jews that were murdered by the Nazi’s. He says there is real evidence for that count. Although 300,000 murdered people seems like a lot, according to a lot of people, saying 300,000 Jews were murdered by the Nazi’s means you are a holocaust denier.
The Pope made a speech in Spring saying “millions” of Jew were murdered by the Nazi’s. He also was immediately accused by a Jewish authority of being a holocaust denier. Millions of murdered people seems like a lot, but it’s not enought to say “millions”, either, unless you want to be called a holocaust denier, like the Pope was.
You have to say the words “6 million.” Fifty two million people died in World War II but saying 6 million Jews died in the holocaust is the important number to remember and alway say. The other 46 million dead are not so important and are hardly ever mentioned. If you say 48 million people died in WWII, nobody will call you a WWII denier.
Interestingly, the first time the figure 6 million was used was in an article in the NYT in 1923, yes 1923! A Jewish author reported that 6 million Jews had been killed in World War I (out of 17 million dead). Who knows where he came up with the 6 million figure.
I don’t know what’s up with the number 6, either, but it seems to be an important number for some reason that’s not clear. There is evidence for 3 million murdered, maybe - if you count ALLl the Jews claimed to be missing after WWII, but the 6 million number is the preferred number to be always used.
To play it safe I always say 12 million Jew were killed in the holocaust. Why not? No one wants to look for a really accurate count. Don’t know why.
The Pope made a speech in Spring saying “millions” of Jew were murdered by the Nazi’s. He also was immediately accused by a Jewish authority of being a holocaust denier. Millions of murdered people seems like a lot, but it’s not enought to say “millions”, either, unless you want to be called a holocaust denier, like the Pope was.
You have to say the words “6 million.” Fifty two million people died in World War II but saying 6 million Jews died in the holocaust is the important number to remember and alway say. The other 46 million dead are not so important and are hardly ever mentioned. If you say 48 million people died in WWII, nobody will call you a WWII denier.
Interestingly, the first time the figure 6 million was used was in an article in the NYT in 1923, yes 1923! A Jewish author reported that 6 million Jews had been killed in World War I (out of 17 million dead). Who knows where he came up with the 6 million figure.
I don’t know what’s up with the number 6, either, but it seems to be an important number for some reason that’s not clear. There is evidence for 3 million murdered, maybe - if you count ALLl the Jews claimed to be missing after WWII, but the 6 million number is the preferred number to be always used.
To play it safe I always say 12 million Jew were killed in the holocaust. Why not? No one wants to look for a really accurate count. Don’t know why.
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nice2000
Guest
Thank you !!
Back in January, Pope Benedict XVI lifted the excommunications of Bishop Williamson and the three other excommunicated SSPX bishops as the next step in reconciling the rift and bringing them back into the fold. It was an act of mercy and love on Benedict’s part, not a concession to their doctrinal positions.
At that time, Benedict received a lot of flak because of Williamson’s position on the Holocaust (which Benedict was unaware of). The other three SSPX bishops do not appear to agree with Williamson on this point. At that time, Williamson seemed open reinvestigating the issue.
Of course, starting next week, the Vatican is starting its closed-door dialogue with the SSPX, so I guess it makes sense to start seeing this sort of stuff make it back into the news.
I understand more clearly now.
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manualman
Guest
Anybody on either side who focuses excessively on the exact number is a nut. (And I can’t recall B16 being called a denier for merely using the word ‘millions’ instead of 6 million.)
Arguing about statistics misses the entire point. Jews were brutally targeted like a disease and treated with about as much dignity by the Nazis. The Nazis went so far beyond any imaginable scapegoat magnitude that ‘satanic’ is the only word to describe what happened.
Granted, the Nazis also did their best to wipe out the gypsies, the mentally retarded, etc. But nowhere was the energy and resources devoted to the eradication ANYTHING like what they had for the Jews. To deny that reality is truly scary and DOES make you wonder what is percolating in the mind of such a person.
Arguing about statistics misses the entire point. Jews were brutally targeted like a disease and treated with about as much dignity by the Nazis. The Nazis went so far beyond any imaginable scapegoat magnitude that ‘satanic’ is the only word to describe what happened.
Granted, the Nazis also did their best to wipe out the gypsies, the mentally retarded, etc. But nowhere was the energy and resources devoted to the eradication ANYTHING like what they had for the Jews. To deny that reality is truly scary and DOES make you wonder what is percolating in the mind of such a person.
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Layman
Guest
What does any Bishop’s opinion on the numbers killed in any war matter with regard to his leading his flock in the Catholic faith?
Answer: It’s a handy stick for her opponents to beat the Catholic Church with. It caters to the handwringing tendency of today. And it will only work if the Church lets it.
I sure am tired of other religions, perverts and atheists trying to set the agenda for how the Church conducts herself.
As I think Katherine Hepburn said when asked a question about her romanctic life by a reporter, the correct response should be: “What business is it of yours?”, and move serenely on.
PS: I think a cynic could have a lot of fun these days by saying that, yes, one is a racist, sexist, fascist homophobe and then watch people’s brains melt in front of you.
Answer: It’s a handy stick for her opponents to beat the Catholic Church with. It caters to the handwringing tendency of today. And it will only work if the Church lets it.
I sure am tired of other religions, perverts and atheists trying to set the agenda for how the Church conducts herself.
As I think Katherine Hepburn said when asked a question about her romanctic life by a reporter, the correct response should be: “What business is it of yours?”, and move serenely on.
PS: I think a cynic could have a lot of fun these days by saying that, yes, one is a racist, sexist, fascist homophobe and then watch people’s brains melt in front of you.
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NewEnglandPriest
Guest
Well, holocaust denial often goes hand-in-hand with antisemitism. So it would be of grave concern if a Catholic bishop were a bigot.
Secondly, the Holocaust is one of the most documented atrocities in history. To deny it’s existence would lead many to question the denier’s sanity.
Third, there’s the issue of international relations between the Vatican and Israel. The Vatican does not want to appear to give cover/support for the antisemitic bigots who hate Israel and want to destroy it.
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Neil_Anthony
Guest
Because it was immoral of him to disrespect the 6 million Jewish victims of the holocaust like that. It was cruel and wrong of him to insult the family members of those who died.
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JaMc
Guest
And Generalissimo Francisco Franco . . . is still dead.
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