Catholic church lays down dress code

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JMJFan4life said:
This is my first time on these forums, so please overlook any goofs, ok? I just had to say IMHO…other denominations that don’t even believe God is actually present dress with more respect than we Catholics do . . . yet we profess to believe Jesus is actually present! I find that disrespectful, very prideful and presuming on Our Lord’s love. No one expects coattails, ties and formal wear, but modesty would be great! When I see services at the Mormon Church (on my way to Mass) they are all in their “Sunday best”.🤷! Why do we think God doesn’t deserve our ‘best’?
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I LOVE THAT!! lol…and I NEVER hear anyone say that anymore! unless its to poke fun of me 😦

but seriously tho, on sundays, i have a thing, me and my daughter…we ALWAYS wear our “sunday best” …even if we dont get to mass (<- i know big time :eek: but it happens) we always make it a point to wear our sunday best…and, well, everynight we pray, but idk…it means something to us…we refer to ourselves as ‘His girls’ 😃 and on sundays, we always look our best for Him…

but yah thats great and i never heard it said…ever… maybe if we said it more…like…to the girl with her boobs hangin’ out 'Hey hun!! So…I’ll see you next mass??? in your ‘sunday best’??? maybe she’d get the hint…

maybe not 🤷
 
On the other side of this issue, I must also admit that there is a question on my mind. When do people have time to get distracted by the way that others dress?

When we (the brothers) go to mass, we sit and the mass begins. I have no idea what’s going on around me. I’m too focussed on the scripture readings, the sermon, hymns, prayers and what is happening on the altar to even remember who was in front or behind me.

I remember a lady being very upset one day because she said that I did not give her the sign of preace. She thought that I had been rude and ignored her. The truth was that I didn’t even notice that she was behind me when I turned to shake an outstretched hand. At that moment, my mind is usually on the miracle that has just happened on the altar. When the priest elevates the consecrated host, we (the brothers) don’t seem to care about anything or anyone any more, except him. He is truly present and truly loving and loveable. No one else exists for us, except Christ. He is there, the perfect man and God all in one body and blood in our midst. Nothing else can distract us.

Maybe I’m naive, but I’ve always assumed that everyone else enters into the same “trance” for lack of a better word. I can’t exactly explain it, but it’s as if nothing else existed between us and him.

While I continue to say that modern society has lost its sense of the appropriate, not only for mass, but for every situation, I must also note that there is not much time or attention left to notice much more than the word of God and the Eucharist during mass.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
I wish this could be instituted in the US like it is in the many churches in Europe. When I was there girls would not be allowed if their shoulders were bare or knees showing or any other inappropriate dress. At the parish I go to here, there are always girls at Sunday mass wearing really short shorts or skin tight dresses. I think they’re manner of dress is disrespectful.
 
slyboots said:
I have been a social worker for the state for 15 years. For 10 of them I worked primarily with assistance for families (TANF). Most all my clients’ incomes were below the poverty level. Most of them were also African Americans.
While they might not have fancy clothes all the time, at church they dressed like they were being presented to royalty. They wore the best they had and so did their children. Through Catholic Charities locally we were able to help them with interviewing and work clothes which they also wore to church.
Just because you are poor it does not mean you have to come to church in dirty, torn clothes. There are agencies and thrift stores (I have bought some of my things in those) and clothing giveaways around.
If you are poor and don’t know what your resources are go to the local assistance office and ask for info on resources for clothing. There will be some.

Aside from that it is usually not the poor who come dressed in jeans and halter tops and t-shirts that say unspeakable things.

Back to the African American families in church…I said they dressed as if they were going to be in the presence of royalty…
Catholics at mass are in the presence of the Incarnate God. Why do we dress as if we are on our way to the beach? Or to the club? Mass is not a “stop on the way”. It is a destination.
Should we not dress nicely when in the the presence of the “King of Kings”?
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:clapping::clapping::clapping:

Excellent post!
 
I didn’t read the whole post as it seemed a dispute over who was right and wrong. However, I read *Dressing with Dignity *by Colleen Hammond over the weekend, and I was shocked at why more priests are not forbidding Communion over the scandolous and essentially lazy dress of the faithful. I was wondering why if this topic was so upsetting to many people, where is references from the Church on what is to be considered appropriate dress? How come we Catholics read books on Padre Pio and then figure since we’re in the USA, it doesn’t apply to us and only to those in Italy? I believe it gets warm in Italy, too. What with growing grapes and all. But back to the subject at hand, to the best of my recollection and please someone contribute to what I’m trying to say, a Pope in the 50’s I believe, had to send letters to all priests allowing them and insisting that they: forbid Communion to the Faithful if they were dressed in a manner that was deemed inappropriate. I wish I had the book here, but I am at work. Mrs. Hammond cited many documents from the Church both papal and articles. Her interest was in finding the truth in modesty. Awesome book. Tan Books actually gives discounts to Churches so they may distribute to the faithful. I just wanted to add that; there are documents from the Church and as far as I know, the Vatican has not removed the permission given to priests to withhold communion.
 
leah_laf said:
I didn’t read the whole post as it seemed a dispute over who was right and wrong. However, I read *Dressing with Dignity *by Colleen Hammond over the weekend, and I was shocked at why more priests are not forbidding Communion over the scandolous and essentially lazy dress of the faithful. I was wondering why if this topic was so upsetting to many people, where is references from the Church on what is to be considered appropriate dress? How come we Catholics read books on Padre Pio and then figure since we’re in the USA, it doesn’t apply to us and only to those in Italy? I believe it gets warm in Italy, too. What with growing grapes and all. But back to the subject at hand, to the best of my recollection and please someone contribute to what I’m trying to say, a Pope in the 50’s I believe, had to send letters to all priests allowing them and insisting that they: forbid Communion to the Faithful if they were dressed in a manner that was deemed inappropriate. I wish I had the book here, but I am at work. Mrs. Hammond cited many documents from the Church both papal and articles. Her interest was in finding the truth in modesty. Awesome book. Tan Books actually gives discounts to Churches so they may distribute to the faithful. I just wanted to add that; there are documents from the Church and as far as I know, the Vatican has not removed the permission given to priests to withhold communion.
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I believe the problem is that a universal dress code may not be possible to implement as there are cultures where the Western manner of dress is not the norm. I’m remembering a visit that Pope John Paul II made to an African nation. I can’t recall which one. But the native people were dressed in their fineries as per their custom. Thus the women were topless, but with many colorful garments, necklaces and whatever other adornments they consider to be very fitting for the presence of royalty.

But I believe the key point is exactly what we saw in this visit to Africa and what we saw among the seminarians at World Youth Day in Australia who wore the native outfits at the papal mass. Every culture has norms as to what is appropriate for God and we seem to have lost ours. That’s the point.

Going topless in the middle of Africa is part of the culture and it does not impress the local people. But the same is not part of our culture. In the end, you are judged for your attitude. If your attitude is inconsistent with the context in which you live, then it may be inappropriate and you should examine it. In that case, wearing beach clothing to church is inconsistent with our Western culture. We woulld be expected to wear something more to the office. Why put on slacks and polo or skirt and blouse for the office and wear a tank top to the mass? It does not make sense.

In the rain forests of Africa and South America it makes sense to be topless at mass, because you are topless when you meet a world leader. You are topless when you attend a great celebration. You are topless for any special occasion. It would make no sense to them to ask them to wear western clothing.

The same logic applies in Europe and North America. Shirts, slacks, blouses and skirts are what men and women wear when they want to present in an indoor setting. No one is asking people to wear evening attire. In fact, that would be very distracting unless it’s a wedding.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
Charlotte408 said:
i would hope a priest or someone standing at the door welcoming people in would softly say something to the person, and maybe they’d sit at the back of the pews or something idk…
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Maybe the 4th Degree Knights could finally put all those swords to good use…rattle rattle 😃
 
JReducation said:
I believe the problem is that a universal dress code may not be possible to implement as there are cultures where the Western manner of dress is not the norm. I’m remembering a visit that Pope John Paul II made to an African nation. I can’t recall which one. But the native people were dressed in their fineries as per their custom. Thus the women were topless, but with many colorful garments, necklaces and whatever other adornments they consider to be very fitting for the presence of royalty.

But I believe the key point is exactly what we saw in this visit to Africa and what we saw among the seminarians at World Youth Day in Australia who wore the native outfits at the papal mass. Every culture has norms as to what is appropriate for God and we seem to have lost ours. That’s the point.

Going topless in the middle of Africa is part of the culture and it does not impress the local people. But the same is not part of our culture. In the end, you are judged for your attitude. If your attitude is inconsistent with the context in which you live, then it may be inappropriate and you should examine it. In that case, wearing beach clothing to church is inconsistent with our Western culture. We woulld be expected to wear something more to the office. Why put on slacks and polo or skirt and blouse for the office and wear a tank top to the mass? It does not make sense.

In the rain forests of Africa and South America it makes sense to be topless at mass, because you are topless when you meet a world leader. You are topless when you attend a great celebration. You are topless for any special occasion. It would make no sense to them to ask them to wear western clothing.

The same logic applies in Europe and North America. Shirts, slacks, blouses and skirts are what men and women wear when they want to present in an indoor setting. No one is asking people to wear evening attire. In fact, that would be very distracting unless it’s a wedding.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
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You are right about cultures and context. I think one has to recognize that our norms are changing. They are always changing. What was considered inappropriate in the US 100 years back is respectable now. As norms change, different people will have different standards at any point, many a function of age, and it’s inevitable that conflict will ensue.

This is not confined to church. It happens in all social settings.
 
Another book I finished this afternoon, A Chat with Converts, had a very good chapter on the Mass as a Sacrifice, as well as a ceremony. It referenced how we live in a society, and as a society, we follow certain rules or conventions that teach us how to act at a ceremony. Simple gestures like taking ones hat off, shaking hands, kneeling before a king (earthly or God) we learned as a form of respect. And all these things, true be it in one country or another, has it’s own rules for ceremonies. But, the issue at hand is the attire (behavior is an entirely different subject) we wear to the ceremony of Mass. The book also references verses from the Book of Exodus where God, way back when, encouraged people to hold ceremonies and we still do following Tradition. But, the manner in which we present ourselves should be not as a slob. Basically, as a society we have our rules for attending a ceremony. Unfortunately just because everyone is wearing miniskirts doesn’t mean that it’s okay period, especially for Mass Which, by the way, one can still see the Roman and Grecian robes and vestaments our priests wear today.

I will find the reference from *Dressing With Dignity *in regards to the Papal Decree on dress for Mass. It happened in the 50’s I think and it was directly meant for America, as well as France.
 
buffalo said:
Catholic church lays down dress code

Manila: The Archdiocese of Manila has issued a dress code that calls on the faithful to present themselves in formal and more conservative attire when attending mass, a local paper said.
In a circular sent to parish priests on Sunday, Father Godwin Tatlonghari, assistant minister of the archdiocese’s Ministry of Liturgical Affairs (MLA), said a new dress code was being imposed following complaints from worshippers that the slack dress sense of some was proving to be disturbing, the Star said.

more…
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👍👍 It’s about time.
 
thechrismyster said:
in what i felt was appropriate. if i was wearing jeans and wasn’t near my house, and someone called me and said “Jesus is at the Pizza Hut”… i wouldn’t waste time running home first to change… i’d go as is.
if i was home, i’d wear what i always wear, jeans and a shirt.
my taste isn’t your taste isn’t other peoples taste…

you can’t regulate dress with any meaningful result.
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More importantly, What would Jesus be wearing to this dinner? Robe and sandals or suit and tie?
 
Katrina5 said:
More importantly, What would Jesus be wearing to this dinner? Robe and sandals or suit and tie?
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There is a rule in theology that says that you cannot speculate what already is. Jesus has already come, celebrated his last supper, suffered his passion, and risen from the dead. Therefore, to speculate what he would wear to a dinner at Pizza Hut is a violation of a fundamental riule of Catholic theology.

Catholic theology can speculate about that which is not clear or comprehensible or about that which has not yet come to pass, but not about that which already is.

The valid question here is, how were Jesus and his disciples dressed for the Last Supper. Given the fact that it was a seder, it is apporpriate to assume that they were wearing the clothing prescribed by the culture, time and place for a seder meal. Even among Jews, the clothing for the seder varies from one Hebrew nation to another. Not all the Hebrew people were Jews. The Jews, properly speaking were from Judea. Jesus was a Jew.

The rule in Judea was that one wear an outer garment to cover the garment that one was wearing on the street, because the garment on the street would bring in dust. One of the observances by the Jews of Judea is the kosher observance. Everything has to be washed several times before it is used, including one’s clothing. The clothing had to be immacualtely clean, not matter how poor it was. In addition, the customary head covering was to be worn by men, it was optional for women. And men could not wear their shoes inside to avoid breaking the kosher. There were no dirty shoes at the Last Supper, only clean bare feet.

Had there been women at the Last Supper, which there probably were, because someone had to do the cooking and serving, they would have worn an outer tunic over their clothes as well, to keep everything clean and recall that they must be ready for travel, as their forefathers were in Egypt on the night that they celebrated their seder and left.

The answer is simple, if we duduct it from Judaic tractiion. The clothing must be clean and it should be clothing appropriate for travel. Hebrew Catholics still observe this today when we attend mass.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
JReducation said:
There is a rule in theology that says that you cannot speculate what already is. Jesus has already come, celebrated his last supper, suffered his passion, and risen from the dead. Therefore, to speculate what he would wear to a dinner at Pizza Hut is a violation of a fundamental riule of Catholic theology.

Catholic theology can speculate about that which is not clear or comprehensible or about that which has not yet come to pass, but not about that which already is.

The valid question here is, how were Jesus and his disciples dressed for the Last Supper. Given the fact that it was a seder, it is apporpriate to assume that they were wearing the clothing prescribed by the culture, time and place for a seder meal. Even among Jews, the clothing for the seder varies from one Hebrew nation to another. Not all the Hebrew people were Jews. The Jews, properly speaking were from Judea. Jesus was a Jew.

The rule in Judea was that one wear an outer garment to cover the garment that one was wearing on the street, because the garment on the street would bring in dust. One of the observances by the Jews of Judea is the kosher observance. Everything has to be washed several times before it is used, including one’s clothing. The clothing had to be immacualtely clean, not matter how poor it was. In addition, the customary head covering was to be worn by men, it was optional for women. And men could not wear their shoes inside to avoid breaking the kosher. There were no dirty shoes at the Last Supper, only clean bare feet.

Had there been women at the Last Supper, which there probably were, because someone had to do the cooking and serving, they would have worn an outer tunic over their clothes as well, to keep everything clean and recall that they must be ready for travel, as their forefathers were in Egypt on the night that they celebrated their seder and left.

The answer is simple, if we duduct it from Judaic tractiion. The clothing must be clean and it should be clothing appropriate for travel. Hebrew Catholics still observe this today when we attend mass.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
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Riiiiiight! The women did the cooking and serving, but were too sub-human to take part in any meal.
Things haven’t changed one bit in two thousand years.
I am so outa here.
 
“There is a rule in theology that says that you cannot speculate what already is. Jesus has already come, celebrated his last supper, suffered his passion, and risen from the dead. Therefore, to speculate what he would wear to a dinner at Pizza Hut is a violation of a fundamental riule of Catholic theology.”

So, what will folks do with all thoes bumper stickers saying, “What Would Jesus Do?”
 
Katrina5 said:
Riiiiiight! The women did the cooking and serving, but were too sub-human to take part in any meal.
Things haven’t changed one bit in two thousand years.
I am so outa here.
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oh get real…and yes, some women DO still serve their men…its called RESPECT…
 
WillieWonka said:
“There is a rule in theology that says that you cannot speculate what already is. Jesus has already come, celebrated his last supper, suffered his passion, and risen from the dead. Therefore, to speculate what he would wear to a dinner at Pizza Hut is a violation of a fundamental riule of Catholic theology.”

So, what will folks do with all thoes bumper stickers saying, “What Would Jesus Do?”
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oh i cant stand those things!!

they should trade em’ in for ‘CATHOLIC RADIO STATION’ bumperstickers!!! lol!! YEAH!! I’m sure theyre more useful anyways…i LOVE that radio station…
 
Charlotte408 said:
oh get real…and yes, some women DO still serve their men…its called RESPECT…
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I am single, so whose man do I have to serve and respect, mommy? The priest? Can’t do that, no women allowed up there.

As for getting real-- I’m working on that.
 
Katrina5 said:
I am single, so whose man do I have to serve and respect, mommy? The priest? Can’t do that, no women allowed up there.

As for getting real-- I’m working on that.
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We have many women who serve in our church as deacons, communion servers as well as other functions. Ok, they are not permitted to be priests but that is what Jesus and the Apostles were, men. Mary is held in very high respect and status in the Catholic Church as she should be for being the mother of Christ so why the complaining about who serves in what capacity. The nuns in our school do a great job on their own without interference from our pastor and he cannot become a nun.

This is off topic as I see it.

Lynn-D
 
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