Catholic history is disturbing

[Realcatholicgk]

Actually religion is the enemy of a relationship with Christ!

**
Hi Martin,
Boy you are so much smarter then me! Thanks for that insight! It opened my eyes! Of course religion is the enemy of a relationship with Christ! Any one should be able to see that! Jesus sure was wrong establishing the church wasn’t He? I mean who need instructions or teachers telling them what has to be done in order to save their souls? But, wait a minute, wouldn’t not having a religion be an religion unto itself? Plus what would it teach? Maybe borrow a book from a religion? But if you did that, then wouldn’t you then be a part of that religion? Boy it sure gets hard when you take Jesus out of having a relationship with him doesn’t it?
But I guess you have a point! We shouldn’t have no religion geting between us and Jesus! :whacky:
Unless, that is you are a Catholic because Jesus taught us that that is the only way to reach him. You can’t actually obey his commandment to “Eat My Flesh and Drink My Blood” which He said multiple times in John 6 if you weren’t a member of the Catholic religion so you couldn’t be saved.

Shhhhh, I hear someone coming, I have to hide!

God Bless.

**

 

[benedictus2]

Actually religion is the enemy of a relationship with Christ!

Can you please supply a detailed explanation of that considering you did not say “I think”? You are claiming it as a fact that religion is the ENEMY OF A RELATIONSHIP WITH CHRIST.

 

[Realcatholicgk]

In all honesty, to me the most disturbing thing about Catholic history is the point at which they deviated from the gospel of grace through faith in the all-sufficient, atonement of the Lamb. The finished work of the cross. Do you think that’s true?

**Hi Martin,

In all honesty, the most disturbing thing to me is people lying about the Catholic church. The church never deviates from the teachings that it teaches perhaps you are confused with some counterefeit church?
In Philippians 2:5-11, we are told “Your attitude should be the same as that of Christ Jesus: Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped, but made himself nothing taking the very nature of a servent, being made in human likeness. And being found in appearance as a man, he humbled himself and became obedient to death-event death on a cross! Therefore, God exalted him to the highest place and gave him a name above every name, that at the name of Jesus every knee shall bow, in heaven and on earth, and in every tounge confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the Glory of God the Father”
This of course is indicitive of a Christ centered attitude characterized by humility, serventude, self-sacrifice and redemptive suffering (for righteousness sake and the gospel). These principles based upon the cross of Christ Jesus and the gospel, may seem to be neglected in our age. They are not! St. Paul encouraged the Philippians living according to the principles of the cross of Christ Jesus in this “gospel partnership” to contiue, and those not abiding to begin appropriating these principles by grace through faith.

All that is needed forsalvation is to follow the Catholic church’s teaching and stop spreading false teachings about what the Church teaches or how it teaches. Do you think that’s true?

God Bless**

 

[Realcatholicgk]

Can you please supply a detailed explanation of that considering you did not say “I think”? You are claiming it as a fact that religion is the ENEMY OF A RELATIONSHIP WITH CHRIST.

**Hi Ben,

take a deep breath! Hold it … OK … let it out! Again! … OK …feeling better? If so, can I ask you a couple of questions? What makes you think that Martin could supply such a list? And what made you think that Martin actually “thinks?” Didn’t that statement alone prove he doesn’t “think”. Now do you understand? He would be lying to say “I think” wouldn’t he? So please don’t be so quick to judge! :tsktsk: Wait, a minute…I have an idea …

Hey Martin, would you consider restating what you said to read:

“Actually in my experience, religion has been my enemy in my personal attemps to have a relationship with Christ!”

That might be more truthful! and maybe Ben would be able to calm down! He hates liars! He is funny that way. Some people can accept lies and falsehoods, But I am guessing, he isn’t around Protestants as much as I am, so it upsets him more!

Thanks for your kind consideration!

Ben: Martin may modify his statement, IO don’t think he actually intented to lie. he seems like a nice enough fellow! Lets wait and see!

God Bless**

 

[bett_ur_kidding]

**
Cinette, you should have said: So if you want to help her" lose her soul" with you, here is your chance! **

Get real!!! If anyone’s lost it is you. You poor soul. I can’t believe some of the outrageous things you say. You are so obnoxious and rude. Every thing that spews out of your mouth is totally the opposite of what Christ stands for. You could care less about anyone else. It’s a laughing matter to you that someone “loses their soul”. You lack charity. Christ showed us to be meek and gentle. And sweetie, salvation is not obtained by going to your church. So erroneous

 

[Martin777]

Realcatholicgk:
I didn’t say the true church was an enemy, I said RELIGION. There is a huge difference.
Do you really think Jesus is leading you to talk to me like that? Mighty sarcastic. Please forgive me if I sounded like that.

 

[Realcatholicgk]

Realcatholic

I have Protestant friends and family members who take their faith and their relationship with the Lord very seriously. I wouldn’t want you sitting around the Christmas tree with them saying some of the things you mention here.

of course they do! They love Jesus! It is their counterfeit religions that are evil. Not them theirselves!

And you say my thinking is distorted.

**If by that you mean that you don’t know that all baptised people are baptised into the Catholic church then my answer must be YES! **

I do have faith and I do pray. I’ve been doing that for many years.

**To which God or to all of them? **

I went to the prayer group. I go to the church. What do you know about holy laughter?
**
Well lets see, about 20 years ago a movement that came out of Africa started to occur at certain “Charismatic” gatherings particularly among evangelical “christian” churches a “phenomenon” (Being nice ) called "holy laughter” and being “slain in the Spirit” and some people attending such “events” also stagger around as if drunk, which might be termed as being “drunk in the Spirit.” (I was wondering, do Circus’ still have side shows? I use to love the freaks. Oh, sorry, back to the history lesson… ) Anyway, these activities are labeled in the movement as “manifestations of the Spirit” and actually have no Scriptural support for these bizarre activities. In fact, the only place in the Bible where the phrase “the manifestation of the Spirit” occurs is in 1 Corinthians 12:7-11 “Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good. To one there is given through the Spirit the message of wisdom, to another the message of knowledge by means of the same Spirit, to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by that one Spirit, to another miraculous powers, to another prophecy, to another distinguishing between spirits, to another speaking in different kinds of tongues, and to still another the interpretation of tongues. All these are the work of one and the same Spirit, and he gives them to each one, just as he determines” No where did it mention the laughing of the idots or drunking fools or any other ridiculous thing!.In fact One of the fruits of the Spirit is self-control **(Galatians 5:23). At the end of 1 Corinthians 14, the Bible’s largest chapter teaching on the operation of the Holy Spirit in the assembled church, Paul closes with this charge: [vs. 40] “But everything should be done in a fitting and ORDERLY way.” Disorder is entirely contrary to the nature of the Holy Spirit and His operations in the Church.

You can search the New Testament. You will NOT find a hint of anything endorsing laughing in a gathering of believers. In fact, the New Testament only refers to laughing six times, and five of those in a negative context. But, being as learned as you are, I am guessing you knew all that already?

We had this discussion on another thread. You probably don’t remember but you were kind of abusive to me then. You’re a little better now but just look at your own attitude. You’re the pot calling the kettle black.
**
My attitude might be called righteous indignation! I have never been abusive to anyone that was inquisitive, but with someone like you, who are so adversarial ,I could see how any real believer in Jesus might cross the line. You do know that even Jesus whipped sense into fools! You are an example of a really strange, confused, perhaps even mentally disturbed person. And please believe me when I say that is said with love for you.
**
I’m tired of hearing people profess unity and disunity at the same time.

**The Catholic church unites! Everyone else attempts to disunite the true believers! **

I am very confident in God’s love for me. It’s a gift from Him that I do not deserve.

**AMEN None of us do! As you said it is a Gift. As such we must accept it and follow his directions. Or we can use our free will and reject it! Our God is good!

Now go have yourself a good laugh!

God Bless**

 

[Realcatholicgk]

Get real!!! If anyone’s lost it is you. You poor soul. I can’t believe some of the outrageous things you say. You are so obnoxious and rude. Every thing that spews out of your mouth is totally the opposite of what Christ stands for. You could care less about anyone else. It’s a laughing matter to you that someone “loses their soul”. You lack charity. Christ showed us to be meek and gentle. And sweetie, salvation is not obtained by going to your church. So erroneous

**
Hi bett,

How are you? Thank you for your kind, Christ-like words. They warmed my heart!
You might not believe me but every word that spews out of your mouth is totally in keeping with the teachings of the Catholic church. Now, I will admit that I am not as smart as many of the people here, nor as educated, so I can’t help not being as eloquent. For that I apologize. However, my message is true and completely valid. I once heard a saying “If the truth hurts…change religions” or somthing like that! freesmileys.org/smileys/char048.gifOK, I made it up!
If I sound angry or emotional at times it is just Christ coming out of me like when Jesus cleared the temple of the money changers and animal-sellers. In fact, “my” Jesus often showed great emotion and anger (Matthew 21:12-13; Mark 11:15-18; John 2:13-22). Jesus’ emotions was described as “zeal” for God’s house (John 2:17). Another time Jesus showed anger was in the synagogue of Capernaum. When the Pharisees refused to answer Jesus’ questions, “He . . . looked round about them with anger” (Mark 3:5). I can just imaging Jesus’ face everytime a Protestant insults His mother!

And sweetie, if I didn’t care I wouldn’t be here. There are other things to do beside attempt to help people learn the truth! In fact, heaven might be limited to 144,000 as the JW think. I might be giving away my spot. But because the true church doesn’t teach that, I really don’t think so! You are in my prayers!

God Bless**

 

[bett_ur_kidding]

Realcatholicgk:
Get a clue

 

[bett_ur_kidding]

I can just imaging Jesus’ face everytime a Protestant insults His mother!

She might be your mama, she’s not mine

 

[Realcatholicgk]

She might be your mama, she’s not mine

** Hi Bett,
A fearless person. Outstanding! I like that!
I mean after all what could Jesus do to you for insulting His mother? freesmileys.org/smileys/violent088.gif

You are too precious!

God Bless
**

 

[bett_ur_kidding]

I guess I was a little harsh.

 

[Hisalone]

Anyone Cathoolic, Protestant, Agnostic etc who is not disturbed by Catholic history has not heart nor soul. One could still be afaithfull Catholic and not agree with much of the history but to ignore and overllok to deny and justify is beyound the pale.

 

[Cinette]

Anyone Cathoolic, Protestant, Agnostic etc who is not disturbed by Catholic history has not heart nor soul. One could still be afaithfull Catholic and not agree with much of the history but to ignore and overllok to deny and justify is beyound the pale.

The light overcomes darkness.

The most beautiful diamond will have a flaw.

For me the glorious history of the Church overcomes the darkness of some of its members.

The fact that the Church has stood the test of time is a witness to the influence and support of the Holy Spirit.

The Church is both Human and Divine.

Don’t let it worry you my friend.

Remember Acts 5:38-39 :

*“If this plan or this undertaking is of men, it will fail; but if it is of God, you will not be able to overthrow them”
*
Blessings
Cinette

 

[Cinette]

She might be your mama, she’s not mine

Just before Jesus said “It is finished” he turned to John and said “Behold thy Mother” and then he turned to Mary and said “Behond thy son”. Now if Mary was just a “vessel” (as some Protestants claim) would Jesus have said these things before he died? Can anyone in his right mind think that this was something insignificant?

When I contemplate this tears come to my eyes. Gentle, beautiful Mother Mary who cares for us all so much and who wishes us to be united to her son - how can anybody put her down or diminish her?

Shame on you! And at Christmastime too! What must Jesus think of you !
Blessings
Cinette

 

[Dameedna]

All of our human history is disturbing.

I’m an athiest, but I don’t blame religion or a church for all the “evil”(so to speak) of the world.

I just blame man. I blame us. I blame you and me.

And I think we can do a lot better, and I think we realize it and are trying to and that gives me hope. Humans can be dreadful…but their capacity for love, passion and extrodinary acts of goodness… well…yeah. That’s who we are too

 

[cazayoux]

Get real!!! If anyone’s lost it is you. You poor soul. I can’t believe some of the outrageous things you say. You are so obnoxious and rude. Every thing that spews out of your mouth is totally the opposite of what Christ stands for. You could care less about anyone else. It’s a laughing matter to you that someone “loses their soul”. You lack charity. Christ showed us to be meek and gentle. And sweetie, salvation is not obtained by going to your church. So erroneous

I’m sure he was not genuinely apathetic to the loss of a soul, but actually poking fun at the non-Catholics that think Catholics are losing their soul.

Lighten up.

Is being meek and gentle all that Christ showed us?
I mean … there is only one thing that we know of from scripture that Jesus actually made with his own hands … a whip.
What did he do with that whip?
Was he being meek and gentle?

My point is, read ALL of scripture.
Don’t be so quick to point at someone else as not being Christ-like.

michel

 

[ron77nyc]

Actually religion is the enemy of a relationship with Christ!

I’m reading a book about Bernard of Clairvaux who reformed the Church in the 12th century. Here is an excerpt explaining your point:

“Jesus’ teachings had been “developed”----diced and interpreted----so that many believed only trained clergy could understand what God wanted from the faithful. This erected a hierarchical barrier between men and God.”

Bernard was attacked for teaching people how to have a realtionship with Jesus. This was before the Protestant reformation so we can’t blame them for this one.

 

[ron77nyc]

Realcatholicgk:
Ron

I do have faith and I do pray. I’ve been doing that for many years.

Realcatholic

To which God or to all of them?

What is that supposed to mean?

 

[ron77nyc]

**Hi Ben,

Some people can accept lies and falsehoods, But I am guessing, he isn’t around Protestants as much as I am, so it upsets him more!

God Bless**

Benedictus is a woman. A woman who has class and manners. That’s a plus when you’re trying to make friends and influence people.