Catholic nuns urge passage of Obama's health bill

[catharina]

I am in awe at being in the presence of so many divine beings who are so perfect they can judge others. I am a sinner. I am a Catholic. My Lord died for my sins. And my sins are the only ones I am to be concerned about for He will judge all others.

I believe that there are so many sins of hypocrisy here, which is so evident from what you write. Holier than thou, you bet.

Humility is tough sometimes, but perhaps needed by many here.

But what do I know. I am simply a sinner.

Sarcasm will get you nowhere. All of us are sinners.

That one cannot seem to see the sin of paying for abortions is troubling.
What is obstructing the vision, the sight, the acknowledgment?

Repeating:

One must stand against sin and can do so without condemning a sinner.
If others find condemnation of certain sins troubling, they can ask themselves why.

Saying this:
“The love and tolerance of the Holy Spirit does not extend to tolerating sin. Supporting the possibility of ANY funding for abortion is supporting actions that are gravely sinful” is NOT stating that any individual bears the action of culpability for the sin. It states that such action is gravely sinful. Judging another’s soul, conscience, culpability is not my job.

Hoped the distinction was obvious.
Guess not.

 

[Corki]

I am in awe at being in the presence of so many divine beings who are so perfect they can judge others. I am a sinner. I am a Catholic. My Lord died for my sins. And my sins are the only ones I am to be concerned about for He will judge all others.

I believe that there are so many sins of hypocrisy here, which is so evident from what you write. Holier than thou, you bet.

Humility is tough sometimes, but perhaps needed by many here.

But what do I know. I am simply a sinner.

Humility is tough and important but please don’t focus so much on the one virtue that you stop learning about the faith. There is more to being a Catholic than living a single virtue, important though it may be.

There are also the cardinal virtues including Charity. The CCC says of this virtue

1829 The fruits of charity are joy, peace, and mercy; charity demands beneficence and fraternal correction; it is benevolence; it fosters reciprocity and remains disinterested and generous; it is friendship and communion: Love is itself the fulfillment of all our works. There is the goal; that is why we run: we run toward it, and once we reach it, in it we shall find rest.

And there are the Spiritual Works of Mercy

The Spiritual Works of Mercy

Admonish the sinner
Instruct the ignorant
Counsel the doubtful
Comfort the sorrowful
Bear wrongs patiently
Forgive all injuries
Pray for the living and the dead

Yes, we have to look inside and work on reforming our own sins but the Christian life is not all about self. The “new commandment” we are to live as Christians (CCC 1823) is to look beyond one’s self and to care for our neighbors. That includes trying to bring people away from wrong actions and ideas.

 

[da_nolo]

Is this some sort of misunderstanding - or have the nuns in this country really drifted this far away from Catholic teaching?

By RICARDO ALONSO-ZALDIVAR
Associated Press Writer
WASHINGTON (AP) - Catholic nuns are urging Congress to pass President Barack Obama’s health care plan, in an unusual public break with bishops who say it would subsidize abortion.

Some 60 leaders of religious orders representing 59,000 Catholic nuns Wednesday sent lawmakers a letter urging them to pass the Senate health care bill. It contains restrictions on abortion funding that the bishops say don’t go far enough.

The letter says that “despite false claims to the contrary, the Senate bill will not provide taxpayer funding for elective abortions.” The letter says the legislation also will help support pregnant women and “this is the real pro-life stance.”

they don’t represent 59000 anyone, they are supposed to lead by example…and would fail in respect to such claims

 

[da_nolo]

Posted by Catharina:

Wow, Catharina. I take it you have no sin, since you are so willing to cast the first stone at those YOU believe are sinning.

A person’s sins, doing right or wrong is between him and Our Lord. Who among us has a right to judge anyone? And how can you find fault, as a Catholic no less, with millions of people who are suffering and dying due to inadequate or no healthcare, finally getting help? That doesn’t sound compassionate or merciful.

At the end of the day, the bottom line in Jesus’ message was to love one another as He has loved us. It is the central message of our faith. I will pray that you get it soon.

Catharina is not casting a stone. rather she is setting example that Jesus expresses in the Gospel. when ever someone around Jesus would be tempted to sin or did sin; Jesus was there to try and correct their mistake.

Now He was God, and has every right to do the such. If we are to follow Him, are we not then to help others realize what is sin in the best manner allowed? More importantly, to challenge those who claim to represent HIM in the manner they act?

For Catholics, we only Teach Jesus (that which He taught). If you really love your neighbor then be passionate in the manner which you speak to them and respectful. otherwise; pointing out a flaw or that which is not what Jesus taught would be acceptable to point out.

point in case, these nuns. THOU SHALL NOT KILL. the law from God for all to follow. if someone was to be a nun. then they clearly support this law simply by accepting the role as a nun. But if one decides to accept surgical abortion under any circumstance, then that person (whether a nun or not) is not following, nor supporting…God’s law.

in which case, as a good neighbor…I should step in and try to correct this error.

 

[da_nolo]

Hi everybody,
I am stil confused about what the new healthcare reform is, maybe because i am outside of the usa. But i certainly do agree with sadwife that if this bill is going to help millions of uninsured americans to have medical care is a great advancement in our country. We can not enjoy medical insurance and go out to the street and see all those uninsured people living on the streets or working people who have been denied medical coverage.

1. Similar to nazi Germany, soviet Russia, and mostly every single country. Politicians try to sneak their agenda (legal or illegal) into bills/laws/etc. that seem fine or tolerable. they do this to fool you and take you for stupid.

please excuse the bluntness, but its the truth. so I ask you…why accept any evil when it is served with a side dish of may be good? that’s exactly how people fall into temptation to begin with.
Think of peer pressure (experienced through out life; mostly high school/teen). A potential good or pleasurable experience is always over weighed while the bad is cast to the side.

1. Within in the U.S. Constitution; it clearly outlines that forcing any person(s) to conduct in any manner that would contradict their own (religious) conscious is illegal. Since politicians added the mandate as part of the bill to pass, the whole bill must be denied. this is U.S. congress practice outlined by the Constitution as well - If I recall correctly. It may just be another law, but still…don’t remember a single bill that passed if a single part of bill is unacceptable. NONE SHOULD.

God said: love your neighbor.

God also made it clear that there is the Law of God, and the law of man. the first is above the second at all times.

here is a law that violates the our practice of God’s Law. would you support that?
I don’t.

Since i have been living outside the usa for a while and being in constant contact with expatriates, talking to them, british, french, australians, etc, and asked them if they will have medical coverage when they retire and their answers are a “yes”. i have realized that our country still needed so much to change about medical care.

Hearing so many voices of senior citizens who can not afford to pay for their medicines, etc. so many people uninsured, part time jobs that do not offer medical insurance, people being rejected because pre-existing conditions, people who has lost their houses because they could not pay for long term illnesses,etc.

Understand that the people of other countries have systems very different then ours. they pay upward of 50 or even 80% tax, compared to our highest tax rate 30% (its actually a little higher - between 30 and 40, but I forgot exact amount).

Furthermore, U.S. system is based on a free market and the original REPUBLIC. Our constitution does not allocate socialist style govt. even though so many blinded by whatever think it does and tempt to push for it. All the countries you’ve listed have accepted such style of govt. in their past. Ours…only once and we exceeded from them.

So within a republic govt. has limited influence/regulations. since its free market; business owner(s) may practice in a manner to protect their investments. and they do. otherwise all these insurances may go bankrupt and there would be zero coverage for no one.

i certainly believe that our healthcare system has been wisely manipulated because of greed and listening to my expatriated friends who are almost retiring and looking forward to have a pleasant happy life for retirement and a peace of mind since they have medical coverage till they die.

this does not determine that reform taking place is the right one. it actually would put more woes on our economy and govt. in the long run. we can hardly afford simple necessities such as law enforcement. The people need to be smart and reform what we can in the manner that we can. so in other words; not everything can we spend billions into.

We can not go on thinking or believing that we are good catholics and refusing to accept that there are millions of people at this very moment who do not have medical care

there’s CHARITY which we do, that makes us the largest in the world. please don’t act like nothing is being done.

and that they are also human beings that have the same rights and needs as us.

who has what right?
The U.S. has declared unalienable right to LIFE, liberty, and pursuit to happiness. the constitution and bill of rights explains what govt. may or may not do which is based on such ‘rights’. yet the right to life is ignored to certain humans? why? because they are not born yet? they don’t look like you or I? that truly is nazism.

The united states is one of the principal countries that donates so much money for different causes to other countries, why shall we deny medical care to all our citizens when we should first take care of our own and then, with the money that is left to go to other causes?

Law is not Charity.

I dont really know what this bill is about abortion, but, there are some very good points or goals like the one mentioned above.

huh?

We need to realize that we are not going to be forever young and strong or that as we get older we are not going to suffer from a long term illness, sooner or later all of us we"ll be on the same boat, with illness to cope with, from our part or from the part of one of our beloved ones. If we do not have compassion towards the weak, we will find our own token of bad luck to makes us realize that not everything that shines is gold and last forever.

There are ways to pay for everything? no.
even the current administration and its political party have argued that certain necessities and resources are not forever and may not always exist.