Catholic Perspectives on Climate Change and Population

[4elise]

Tigg…I congratulate you on successfully extending the lies and suspicion originally perpetuated by WatchingMedia on this thread. In your infinite knowledge you’ve insinuated that the Catholic groups/organizations which subscribe to Catholic Climate Change are somehow “disloyal” to the church.

Your comments re: the Leadership of Religious Women state a fact about an investigation of this fine group of women. But guess what? No finding has been released.

If one follows your thinking …every Catholic seminary and men’s religious community in the U.S. is suspect because they too were “under investigation”.

It’s one thing to disagree with a position. You somehow can’t be bothered to argue on the principles of a postion, but engage in nasty ad hominem attacks.

Who does this help?

No one - except those who like to see Catholics at their worst.

 

[archangel04]

So… let me see if I understand this.
It is OK to disagree with the USCCB when they speak about Climate Change, it’s potential impact on millions and millions of people around the world - but not to come to a different conclusion on health care legislature?

Are you serious? Look around you, the whole global warming scam is just a way to introduce population control around the world. Have you seen the recent weather records? They are all indicating that the earth is cooling. Listen I am all for taking care of our planet, especially with treating animals with respect, but and that’s a BIG BUT, there are thousands of innocent unborn children being killed every day, many countries with relativism ideology by allowing same-sex unions, divorce, and other abominations. Should we concern ourselves with preserving our natural recourses and keeping the earth clean? yes we should, but there are more important issues at hand right now.

 

[archangel04]

By the way getting your teaching from certain “groups” on what the Catholic Church teaches is not the best way to go about, it’s like trying to learn history by watching The Da Davinci Code.

 

[4elise]

Are you serious? Look around you, the whole global warming scam is just a way to introduce population control around the world. Have you seen the recent weather records? They are all indicating that the earth is cooling. Listen I am all for taking care of our planet, especially with treating animals with respect, but and that’s a BIG BUT, there are thousands of innocent unborn children being killed every day, many countries with relativism ideology by allowing same-sex unions, divorce, and other abominations. Should we concern ourselves with preserving our natural recourses and keeping the earth clean? yes we should, but there are more important issues at hand right now.

My POINT of adding this thread was to point to WHAT the CATHOLIC church is saying about climate change and POPULATION - what the USCCB is stressing should be our concerns on this topic -

It is so frustrating to me when people point to the needs to protect the unborn, and other moral issues and then say - well this is what we should be paying attention to - as if we can ONLY pay attention to one issue??? I don’t know about others, but I try to ensure that my actions reflect my faith - I support pro life organizations, I strive to support Catholic missionary organizations that are working to bring faith and hope to people around the world, and yes - AT THE SAME TIME - I can be concerned about, and strive to act in a way to increase my own awareness of how my actions impact others - and this can be in a long-term global climate changes sense, or how my over consumption of unnecessary goods should be dealt with -

From what I have learned and understand climate change is a critical issue demanding our attention - but then again - I also believe debt relief for Africa is a critical issue - I believe giving young women access to affordable health care so they can chose life is a critical issue -

I think it is always easier to rail against things that have nothing to do with my life - I am a 50+ year old married women - so I can beat my chest and say we must stop abortion, we must preserve marriage as we understand it, because these things do not directly effect my life - however I must look at my own personal actions - my own personal choices if I am going to look at other issues - what do I buy? what do I dispose of? Where do I put my time and treasure?

So I believe the Church with the USCCB are helping us try to look at this and HOW we should speak about this a s CATHOLICS ----- something I AM VERY GRATEFUL FOR.
ALL PEOPLE (an unborn child in Ohio and 7 year old child in a village in Zimbabwe) are children of God - should we care equally for each child?

Should we as Catholics speak about Climate Change in a way that stresses that ‘population control’ is not the solution - YES - but no, many just say - hey it has been cooler, so it isn’t happening - it is the LONG term change that is climate change - in some places it will get cooler, in some hotter, what will this mean for the people living in pacific islands only feet above sea level? what will it mean for people struggling to farm on land in Africa with increasing droughts? ALL THESE PEOPLES LIVES ARE AS VALUABLE AS THE LIVES OF THE UNBORN - not one or the other - ALL LIFE / ALL PEOPLE - the unborn and the born - may we as Catholics speak for ALL LIFE and act in ways that reflect our understanding that we are all children of God.

 

[4elise]

By the way getting your teaching from certain “groups” on what the Catholic Church teaches is not the best way to go about, it’s like trying to learn history by watching The Da Davinci Code.

I guess the USCCB doesn’t equate to the absurd (and IMHO poorly written) fiction of Dan Brown to me.

 

[tpw]

Are you serious? Look around you, the whole global warming scam is just a way to introduce population control around the world. Have you seen the recent weather records?

Perhaps you should tell those now forced to flee from their homelands because of the effects of global warming that it’s simply a scam to reduce populations. So the growing desertification of Saharan African countries is a scam…The rising tides and their attending affects on low-lying areas is a “scam”. And the work that Catholic Relief Services, Jesuit Relief Services and others providing for them is really imaginary.

Kind of hard to give conceive and birth when you’re on the run…don’t you think?

 

[Tigg]

Should we as Catholics speak about Climate Change in a way that stresses that ‘population control’ is not the solution - YES - but no, many just say - hey it has been cooler, so it isn’t happening - it is the LONG term change that is climate change - in some places it will get cooler, in some hotter, what will this mean for the people living in pacific islands only feet above sea level? what will it mean for people struggling to farm on land in Africa with increasing droughts? ALL THESE PEOPLES LIVES ARE AS VALUABLE AS THE LIVES OF THE UNBORN - not one or the other - ALL LIFE / ALL PEOPLE - the unborn and the born - may we as Catholics speak for ALL LIFE and act in ways that reflect our understanding that we are all children of God.

You are correct that Catholics should speak for all life, but if you are pushing the Consistent Life/Seamless Garment argument that in some instances has been heretically defined to say all life issues have the same moral weight, I’m afraid you are in defiance of true Church teaching. Your farmers in Africa struggling with drought due to climate change can in no way be put on the same par with the deliberate ending of life in the womb.

(This question comes to mind) — “**Who **is educating Catholic bishops and school educators in America on the truth or falsehood of climate change science?”

In this clip, when the Irish bishops launched the “Cry of the Earth” they were being coached by a professor who shared the Nobel Peace prize with Gore. And, of course, it later was exposed for the scam that it was. So you might be able to understand our skepticism, when likewise, other Catholic groups touting the green movement have been identified with various error and dissent against Church teaching. They are not credible to me as sources of gaining a truly “Catholic Perspective” as your thread title suggests.

After all, this is not just a simple push or reminder to use common sense as good stewards of the earth, but instead, as happens in Ireland, is an all-out effort directed toward the complete re-orientation of Catholic school systems in re-educating our children… As the following video from the Archdiocese of Chicago seems to reveal, ‘the greening of our children in defense of the climate and salvation of the planet appears to supercede the greater commission of defending the faith from error and saving souls for Christ…

[Catholic Climategate: Truth Vs. Falsehood |](Catholic Climategate: Truth Vs. Falsehood |)

 

[kimmielittle]

You are correct that Catholics should speak for all life, but if you are pushing the Consistent Life/Seamless Garment argument that in some instances has been heretically defined to say all life issues have the same moral weight, I’m afraid you are in defiance of true Church teaching. Your farmers in Africa struggling with drought due to climate change can in no way be put on the same par with the deliberate ending of life in the womb.

(This question comes to mind) — “**Who **is educating Catholic bishops and school educators in America on the truth or falsehood of climate change science?”

In this clip, when the Irish bishops launched the “Cry of the Earth” they were being coached by a professor who shared the Nobel Peace prize with Gore. And, of course, it later was exposed for the scam that it was. So you might be able to understand our skepticism, when likewise, other Catholic groups touting the green movement have been identified with various error and dissent against Church teaching. They are not credible to me as sources of gaining a truly “Catholic Perspective” as your thread title suggests.

(This question comes to mind) — “**Who **is educating Catholic bishops and school educators in America on the truth or falsehood of climate change science?”

 

[kimmielittle]

Perhaps you should tell those now forced to flee from their homelands because of the effects of global warming that it’s simply a scam to reduce populations.

The rising tides and their attending affects on low-lying areas is a “scam”.

The courts and Government have already been forced to admit it…

The film blames global warming for species losses including coral reef bleaching. The Government could not find any evidence to support this claim.​

The film suggests that the Greenland ice covering could melt causing sea levels to rise dangerously.** The evidence is that Greenland will not melt for millennial.**​

The film suggests that the Antarctic ice covering is melting, The evidence was that it is in fact increasing.​

The film suggests that sea levels could rise by 7m causing the displacement of millions of people. In fact the evidence is that sea levels are expected to rise by about 40cm over the next hundred years and that there is no such threat of massive migration.​

The film claims that rising sea levels has caused the evacuation of certain Pacific islands to New Zea land. The Government are unable to substantiate this and the Court observed that this appears to be a false claim.​

Read more: newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2007/10/09/court-identifies-eleven-inaccuracies-al-gore-s-inconvenient-truth#ixzz0skw5jXlF

An INTERESTING FACT:

It was a U.K. Truck Driver who brought this law suit.

And the work that Catholic Relief Services,

Why is the Catholic Relief Services using my monies given to directly help the poor…financing lobbyist groups? Especially when according to USCCB

Poverty USA: The State of
Poverty in America

For the fourth consecutive year, the poverty rate and the number of Americans living in poverty both rose from the prior years. Since 2000, the number of poor Americans has grown by more than 6 million. The official poverty rate in 2004 (the most current year for which figures are available) was 12.7 percent, up from 12.5 percent in 2003.

Total Americans below the official poverty thresholds numbered 37 million, a figure 1.1 million higher than the 35.9 million in poverty in 2003. (U.S. Census Bureau, Income, Poverty and Health Insurance Coverage in the United States: 2004)

                     On average, more than one out of every three Americans - 37 percent of all people in the United States - are officially classified as living in poverty at least 2 months out of the year. (U.S. Census Bureau, *Income, Poverty, and Health Insurance Coverage in the United States: 2004*)

The number of Americans living in severe poverty - with incomes below half of the poverty line - remained the same at 15.6 million. (U.S. Census Bureau, Income, Poverty and Health Insurance Coverage in the United States: 2004)

usccb.org/cchd/pov/povfacts.shtml

 

[kimmielittle]

(Chicago, IL: March 12, 2009) Speakers at a United Nations conference on global warming taking place in Copenhagen made global headlines Tuesday by claiming melting polar ice is causing global sea levels to rise faster than previously expected.
But James M. Taylor, a senior fellow for environment policy at The Heartland Institute, notes the best available research shows there has been no acceleration of sea-level rise since the end of the Little Ice Age in the late nineteenth century, and global sea level has actually been declining since 2005. [See Holgate 2007 and Jevrejeva et al. 2006, complete source citations at the end of this media alert.]
Moreover, Taylor points out that polar ice is no less extensive than it was in 1979, when satellites first began accurately measuring polar ice sheets, so melting snow and ice are not likely to be causing rising sea levels. Antarctica is actually gaining ice mass as its temperatures fall. [See Krinner et al. 2007, at the end of this media alert.]
Why is there such a large disconnect between U.N. cries of alarm and real-world climate data indicating nothing unusual is occurring?
One likely answer, Taylor says, can be found in the self-interest of the bureaucrats and environmentalists who make up the vast majority of attendees at the U.N. conference. “Virtually everyone at the Copenhagen conference stands to make more money if a new global warming treaty is approved later this year. Follow the money. These bureaucrats and environmentalists are looking out for their own paychecks and careers first, and looking at the real science second or not at all.”
Evidence of the conflict of interest, Taylor says, can be seen in the eight corporations that are listed as “Star” sponsors on the official Web site of the Copenhagen conference at climatecongress.ku.dk/. All have major interests in renewable power and the emerging multi-billion-dollar carbon offset industries. This is in striking contrast to a conference on climate change that just concluded in New York, which accepted no corporate funding, and where speakers concluded that global warming is not likely to cause rising sea levels.

http://cms.ku.dk/fa-sites/klima-sites/klimakongres/sponsorlogos/sponsorlogo6.jpg/

heartland.org/full/24899/Global_Warming_And_Sea_Level_Another_False_Alarm.html

 

[mpi]

My Catholic perspective on climate change and population is that both are are fabricated issues by Marxists within the Catholic church. As you know, “green” is the new “red”. Disaffected communists who are disappointed with the fall of the USSR have found their new home in the “green” movement. These people are also using the “green” agenda to infiltrate the Catholic church.

Lets pray for the conversion of their soul saway from the darkness of Marxist/totalitarian thought and toward God and His church on earth.

 

[4elise]

You are correct that Catholics should speak for all life, but if you are pushing the Consistent Life/Seamless Garment argument that in some instances has been heretically defined to say all life issues have the same moral weight, I’m afraid you are in defiance of true Church teaching. Your farmers in Africa struggling with drought due to climate change can in no way be put on the same par with the deliberate ending of life in the womb.

WHAT?
IF A CHILD DIES OF MALNUTRITION IN AFRICA - OR A CHILD DIES AS A RESULT OF ABORTION - DOES GOD CARE LESS ABOUT THE CHILD IN AFRICA???

(This question comes to mind) — “**Who **is educating Catholic bishops and school educators in America on the truth or falsehood of climate change science?”

PERHAPS IT IS THE HOLY FATHER? :banghead:

Pope concerned by effect of climate change on Mongolia
cathnewsasia.com: 2:23 03-06-2010

Pope concerned by effect of climate change on Mongolia
Pope Benedict XVI voiced his serious concern for the thousands of Mongolian families who face the very real risk of famine after prolonged extreme weather conditions in the Asian nation. The Holy Father was speaking to the new Ambassador from Mongolia to the Holy See, Luvsantseren Orgil, on May 20. (Vatican Radio)

Mongolia is a land locked nation in central-east Asia. Famous for its high planes and traditional nomadic culture, it is the 19th largest and the most sparsely populated independent country in the world, with a population of around 2.9 million people.

However after the worst winter on record, its 800,000 herders and their families are facing the risk of famine.

In his address to the news ambassador from Mongolia … the Pope’s first concerns were for these families. Expressing his concern and solidarity: “for the many individuals and families who suffered as a result of the harsh winter and the effects of last year’s torrential rains and flooding”, the Pope observed that “environmental issues, particularly those related to climate change, are global issues and need to be addressed on a global level”.

The United Nations says that nearly 8 million cows, yaks, camels, horses, goats and sheep, the only source of livelihood for rural nomads, have died. As a result thousands of destitute are streaming into the capital, Ulaanbaata. The U.N. estimates the disaster may prompt up to 20,000 herders to abandon their nomadic life and flee to the city.

Pope Denounces Leaders’ Failure to Reach Climate Change Treaty
Published January 11, 2010
AP
VATICAN CITY

Pope Benedict XVI denounced the failure of world leaders to agree to a new climate change treaty in Copenhagen last month, saying Monday that world peace depends on safeguarding God’s creation.

He issued the admonition in a speech to ambassadors accredited to the Vatican, an annual appointment during which the pontiff reflects on issues the Vatican wants to highlight to the diplomatic corps.

Benedict has been dubbed the “green pope” for his increasingly vocal concern about protect the environment, an issue he has reflected on in encyclicals, during foreign trips and most recently in his annual peace message. Under Benedict’s watch, the Vatican has installed photovoltaic cells on its main auditorium to convert sunlight into electricity and has joined a reforestation project aimed at offsetting its CO2 emissions.

For the pontiff, it’s a moral issue: Church teaching holds that man must respect creation because it’s destined for the benefit of humanity’s future.

In his speech, the pontiff criticized the “economic and political resistance” to fighting environmental degradation that was exemplified in the negotiations to draft a new climate treaty at last month’s summit in Copenhagen.

In this clip, when the Irish bishops launched the “Cry of the Earth” they were being coached by a professor who shared the Nobel Peace prize with Gore. And, of course, it later was exposed for the scam that it was. So you might be able to understand our skepticism, when likewise, other Catholic groups touting the green movement have been identified with various error and dissent against Church teaching. They are not credible to me as sources of gaining a truly “Catholic Perspective” as your thread title suggests.

BUT - I have no doubt that simply and easily these too can be discounted as a ‘Catholic Perspective’

 

[archangel04]

archangel04;6808230:

Are you serious? Look around you, the whole global warming scam is just a way to introduce population control around the world. Have you seen the recent weather records?

Perhaps you should tell those now forced to flee from their homelands because of the effects of global warming that it’s simply a scam to reduce populations. So the growing desertification of Saharan African countries is a scam…The rising tides and their attending affects on low-lying areas is a “scam”. And the work that Catholic Relief Services, Jesuit Relief Services and others providing for them is really imaginary.

Kind of hard to give conceive and birth when you’re on the run…don’t you think?

Those people that have to flee their country have a CHOICE to move and find a better place for them and their family. This happens throughout history many many times and it will continue to happen again. The unborn only have their mother to defend them, and when their mothers choose to kill them, who is there to defend them? So yes I do find fighting abortion as a higher cause over poverty. I feel grief and sadness for all those who suffer from these natural disasters, but as long as they live they have a fighting chance. Now the climate is constantly changing, and as I said before I am in support to taking care of our resources and keeping our planet clean, but when this “movement” is used to drown out the cries of the unborn and used to promote population control, than that’s where I draw the line! Just look how the EU is promoting population control all over Europe, look at how our administration is pushing for contraception in Africa. By the way Africa has many badlands, not to mention the Equator passes over it, so yeah I would expect Africa to be hot.

 

[archangel04]

I guess the USCCB doesn’t equate to the absurd (and IMHO poorly written) fiction of Dan Brown to me.

The USCCB within the past year has been in a state of “dumbfoundedness” with all the scandal of the pro-abortion, and gay rights groups that it was associated with. The USCCB has no weight when it comes to official Church teachings or interpretation of matter of the Faith, that role is left to Congregation for the Doctrine of Faith (CDF) that is located at the Vatican. Until the Bishop’s of this country start to use their God given authority against pro-abortion politicians than they can talk about “global-warming”. Until then they need to focus on being Sheppard of Christ and protect the faithful against the wolves in sheep clothing. The USCCB has never had a scientific study done on global warming, so I am not sure where they get the idea they can " authoritatively " have a say in this matter.

Again my position on global warming is that it’s a scam, but in saying this, I still feel we all need to play our part in protection what God has given us to have dominion over. To always recycle, use our recourses in moderation, do simple things that can help, but this matter is not as important as defending innocent life. Until the day that abortion seizes to exist than we can set all of our focus on other matter, including the environment.
.

 

[Tigg]

WHAT?
IF A CHILD DIES OF MALNUTRITION IN AFRICA - OR A CHILD DIES AS A RESULT OF ABORTION - DOES GOD CARE LESS ABOUT THE CHILD IN AFRICA???

Big difference here - one is a result of a deliberate evil act with the intention of ending life. They cannot be defined as equivalent evils; nor has the Holy Father said anything to remotely suggest that they are.

We are not saying that we shouldn’t be good stewards of the earth. Since we retired, we only own one car (to help conserve and reduce our own pollution) and I only use my dishwasher when I have company and a full load of dishes; sometimes I will save “clean” inside water to water my outside plants and we are careful to keep lights off and even the air conditioning when not absolutely necessary. We each can do our own small part to reduce the “impact” we may have on our environment. This is common sense and responsible stewardship which we are called as Christians to do. Alas, we seem to have gone off the deep end with this subject and replaced our worship of the true God with worship of the “Sacred Earth Community.”

BTW, I’m sure it has already been mentioned that it was reported that 30,000 scientists wanted to sue Al Gore for fraud for his global warming scam.

 

[4elise]

tpw;6809386:

Those people that have to flee their country have a CHOICE to move and find a better place for them and their family. This happens throughout history many many times and it will continue to happen again. The unborn only have their mother to defend them, and when their mothers choose to kill them, who is there to defend them? So yes I do find fighting abortion as a higher cause over poverty. I feel grief and sadness for all those who suffer from these natural disasters, but as long as they live they have a fighting chance. Now the climate is constantly changing, and as I said before I am in support to taking care of our resources and keeping our planet clean, but when this “movement” is used to drown out the cries of the unborn and used to promote population control, than that’s where I draw the line! Just look how the EU is promoting population control all over Europe, look at how our administration is pushing for contraception in Africa. By the way Africa has many badlands, not to mention the Equator passes over it, so yeah I would expect Africa to be hot.

WHY CAN’T WE CARE AND WORK FOR MORE THAN ONE GOOD THING?
I think the - 'if you aren’t paying attention to abortion then you can’t care about anything else’ is a smoke screen - I think this tool can be used to take the steam out of people of good will - keep them from examining their own choices and actions.

And seriously choice? Those who will be climate refugees over the next 100 years have no choice - no voice - and we CATHOLICS who believe ALL people (born and unborn) are made in God’s image should be their voice too and this is what the Holy Father is talking about.

Yes there are places in Africa that are hot (and some that are cold) - but the already larger burden of poverty and disease (here and the islands in the Pacific, places in Latin America) will be increased as the land can produce less and less food - for these children, these women and men we really need to be acting - and opening our eyes and our hearts to how our actions can impact their lives - Blessings

 

[4elise]

Big difference here - one is a result of a deliberate evil act with the intention of ending life. They cannot be defined as equivalent evils; nor has the Holy Father said anything to remotely suggest that they are.

BUT THE LIFE has the same value - no? That is what I am talking about - the life of a child in Africa, a family in Micronesia, their LIVES are as important to our loving Father in Heaven as the unborn.

THE DEATH of a child from malnutrition - a women of AIDS - is as much of a loss of LIFE as the death of an unborn child.

The evil of abortion is deliberate. It ends a life.
You and I do not perform abortions. We work to change legislature in the US to change the laws, we work to support women who find themselves with an unplanned pregnancy so they will chose life, we pray for an end to this evil…

All this does not mean we should then put our heads in the sand on the other important issues and choices that impact LIFE, and this is the point of the OP - the issue of climate change can not be used as an excuse to excercise an anti-life agenda of population control

We are not saying that we shouldn’t be good stewards of the earth. Since we retired, we only own one car (to help conserve and reduce our own pollution) and I only use my dishwasher when I have company and a full load of dishes; sometimes I will save “clean” inside water to water my outside plants and we are careful to keep lights off and even the air conditioning when not absolutely necessary. We each can do our own small part to reduce the “impact” we may have on our environment. This is common sense and responsible stewardship which we are called as Christians to do. Alas, we seem to have gone off the deep end with this subject and replaced our worship of the true God with worship of the “Sacred Earth Community.”

BTW, I’m sure it has already been mentioned that it was reported that 30,000 scientists wanted to sue Al Gore for fraud for his global warming scam.

I would encourage you - because you are already open to the concept of your actions can and do have an impact - do your own research, don’t be minipulated by the conservative media or the ‘association to Gore’ as a way to vilify actions - creation and the earth are sacred as we view them as gifts from our loving Father. As Catholics I do not believe we should associate ourselves with liberal or conservative points of view - we have the unique opportunity to speak for ALL life - the Catholic perspective. Blessings

 

[4elise]

going to the Vatican Web site - a search on Climate Change comes back with what the Church - the Holy Father have said and are saying on this important topic:

gsearch.vatican.va/search?entqr=0&access=p&sort=date%3AD%3AL%3Ad1&output=xml_no_dtd&ie=UTF-8&btnG=Search+on+vatican.va&client=default_frontend&q=%27climate+change%27&ud=1&oe=UTF-8&proxystylesheet=default_frontend&ip=66.214.159.253&start=0

 

[tpw]

Climate change isn’t simply a matter of “taking care of resources”. It requires dramatically re-evaluating lifestyles perpetuated by American media, advertising and commercial interests. The “culture of death” is perpetuated by false claims “youthfulness”, “vanity”, “consumerism”, the “pursuit of pleasure” and the reduction of complex political phenomenon to simply matters of choice without regard for what exactly is being chosen. It reduces the very Catholic worldview of “the common good” to individual pursuits of pleasure.

Re: the “choice” people facing deperate situations have please take some time and read “Fleeing for Their Lives” from Georgetown Press. It’s an anthology from a conference sponsored by Boston College last year featuring testimony from Catholic social ethicians and those in the field who work with refugees ranging from CRS to Jesuit Refugee Service. It’s not so simple as you want to make it.

I encourage you in your pro-life work. How about encouraging others who embrace a Consistent Life Ethic in the work they feel compelled to participate in? No one can do it all. But all can do something.

 

[4elise]

Climate change isn’t simply a matter of “taking care of resources”. It requires dramatically re-evaluating lifestyles perpetuated by American media, advertising and commercial interests. The “culture of death” is perpetuated by false claims “youthfulness”, “vanity”, “consumerism”, the “pursuit of pleasure” and the reduction of complex political phenomenon to simply matters of choice without regard for what exactly is being chosen. It reduces the very Catholic worldview of “the common good” to individual pursuits of pleasure.

Re: the “choice” people facing deperate situations have please take some time and read “Fleeing for Their Lives” from Georgetown Press. It’s an anthology from a conference sponsored by Boston College last year featuring testimony from Catholic social ethicians and those in the field who work with refugees ranging from CRS to Jesuit Refugee Service. It’s not so simple as you want to make it.

I encourage you in your pro-life work. How about encouraging others who embrace a Consistent Life Ethic in the work they feel compelled to participate in? No one can do it all. But all can do something.

tpw… who is this responding to? THIS IS ANYTHING BUT SIMPLE

I could not agree more with you about the need to “dramatically re-evaluate lifestyles perpetuated by American media, advertising and commercial interest” re the Catholic perspective on the common good - Do you have a link to “Fleeing for Their Lives” ?

CRS has been a leader in working to provide care for refugees from natural disaster and wars - and I have complete respect for Jesuit Refugee Service having seen their and CRS’s work first hand -

CRS is a partner with the Catholic Coalition on Climate Change -
And from jceao.net/content/jesuit-calls-global-refugee-review JRS: 03/05/2010
“Former Jesuit Refugee Services International Director Fr Mark Raper has argued that all states share a responsibility to vulnerable people who cannot live decently in their homelands - whether due to climate change, natural disaster or war.”

What I object to is the attempt to portray the Church as not having a position on this important topic of our day - we have to work together for all our brothers and sisters… I object to people saying that the issue of abortion should be the ONLY thing we should resolve - or that it must be resolved before we take steps to address this - or they take a position on this the USCCB has undermined their authority - I find all this very frustrating

• I think people can disagree on the amount of human activity that is impacting climate change - BUT to say that the majority of scientists do is just not true.
• I think people can disagree on what actions should be taken (I do not advocate cap and trade for example because it has been shown to make the situation worse!)
• But I think it is irrational to say that it isn’t happening and that the Church does not have a position and interest in this - because it will impact PEOPLE - the people made in God’s image - AND - the Church needs to be speaking as they do in the OP - to clarify that issues like population control are NOT the answer - but if we (the Church) do not stay engaged in the discussion we can not represent the important position of the ‘COMMON GOOD’

tpw - I think we are much closer to agreeing really… Blessing