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YoungTradCath
Guest
Why are Catholic institutions so hypocritical?
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NewEnglandPriest
Guest
Did you read the article? It’s a straight forward situation of government funding. You can’t give academic credits for political or religious activities.
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juno24
Guest
from the article:
I think this sums up the prevailing attitude of so many in government quite well. Collecting towels and blankets for kittens and puppies at the pound? Worthwhile. Cleaning garbage off the beaches or streets? Worthwhile. Collecting cell phones for women’s shelters? Most certainly worthwhile. Praying and fasting to save the lives of unborn human beings? Mmmm… Not so much.
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YoungTradCath
Guest
I did read it. I agree that it’s dumb to award academic credit for ANY un-academic endeavor. But, I believe that the anti-abortion movement should be perpetuated in Catholic schools.
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Not_Sure_1
Guest
Do you really take the side of a godless government, over the Church’s call for all Catholics to spread their faith?
Do you take the side of a godless government, over a man who wants to stop an event that by all statistics and numbers is worse than the reported holocaust (in only two years (4000000 dead in a year), more deaths than even the holodomor?
Stop taking the side of the godless, support the Church and Catholics as they remain firm in the teachings of the Church, and the natural human mercy that should come with all who are witnessing a veritable mass-murder happening behind closed doors.
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NewEnglandPriest
Guest
The Catholic school can do that all it wants, it just can’t offer academic credit for it.
Once again, free do to so but just can’t offer academic credit for it.
This isn’t about godless v. godly but rather about simple application of law.
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Dale_M
Guest
News Update
The principal, David Hood, has returned to work. A letter has been sent to parents assuring them that respect for life will be taught in an age-appropriate manner.
winnipegfreepress.com/local/anti-abortion-vigils-prompt-review-at-catholic-schools-132600178.html
The principal, David Hood, has returned to work. A letter has been sent to parents assuring them that respect for life will be taught in an age-appropriate manner.
winnipegfreepress.com/local/anti-abortion-vigils-prompt-review-at-catholic-schools-132600178.html
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Elizabeth502
Guest
Just some corrections on some statements made so far.
The issue is not academic credit. The issue is community service hours. the article has an “or” before those two phrases, and that would certainly follow the pattern of schools in the U.S. as well. Community service hours do not transfer to academic credit. They are completely separate. Many U.S. schools – public, private secular, and religious – require community service hours not for “academic credit,” but as a condition of graduation. Usually it’s a minimum # of hours. Usually there’s a wide choice for students: some choices are school-sponsored & even organized (as an option); in other cases students choose from a long list; in other cases, more enterprising students develop their own original ideas. In U.S. Catholic schools, though, I can’t think of any community service which has been suggested which involves a religious activity (such as prayer), or in any way identifies the activity as promoting a religious viewpoint. Rather, in Catholic schools (such as my children have attended), the service opportunities are essentially social justice opportunities that align with the corporal works of mercy (Visiting the elderly, that kind of thing.)
Now, unlike U.S.Catholic schools, in which"the government" does not require community service hours, it seems that in Canada that is required (apparently as an aspect of government funding). That is what makes their situation different from that in U.S. Catholic schools, as ours are not government-funded.
The only reason there is, in Canada, a church “versus” school issue is because of this gov’t funding there. That situation does not apply in the U.S., because any religious school here does have autonomy and can choose its curriculum, including its religious content, its religious viewpoint within academics, and its requirement to complete community service as an aspect of character-building and good citizenship, both. One of the great advantages in Catholic schooling is the freedom to express these viewpoints, and to understand how integrated our faith is with history, literature, science, the creative arts, etc. Again, though, I haven’t seen an overtly religious activity being suggested as community service in the broad acquaintance I have with Catholic schools. Religious activities, including off-campus ones, normally do not accrue community service hours. Perhaps there are some that I am not acquainted with and am happy to be corrected on that.
The issue is not academic credit. The issue is community service hours. the article has an “or” before those two phrases, and that would certainly follow the pattern of schools in the U.S. as well. Community service hours do not transfer to academic credit. They are completely separate. Many U.S. schools – public, private secular, and religious – require community service hours not for “academic credit,” but as a condition of graduation. Usually it’s a minimum # of hours. Usually there’s a wide choice for students: some choices are school-sponsored & even organized (as an option); in other cases students choose from a long list; in other cases, more enterprising students develop their own original ideas. In U.S. Catholic schools, though, I can’t think of any community service which has been suggested which involves a religious activity (such as prayer), or in any way identifies the activity as promoting a religious viewpoint. Rather, in Catholic schools (such as my children have attended), the service opportunities are essentially social justice opportunities that align with the corporal works of mercy (Visiting the elderly, that kind of thing.)
Now, unlike U.S.Catholic schools, in which"the government" does not require community service hours, it seems that in Canada that is required (apparently as an aspect of government funding). That is what makes their situation different from that in U.S. Catholic schools, as ours are not government-funded.
The only reason there is, in Canada, a church “versus” school issue is because of this gov’t funding there. That situation does not apply in the U.S., because any religious school here does have autonomy and can choose its curriculum, including its religious content, its religious viewpoint within academics, and its requirement to complete community service as an aspect of character-building and good citizenship, both. One of the great advantages in Catholic schooling is the freedom to express these viewpoints, and to understand how integrated our faith is with history, literature, science, the creative arts, etc. Again, though, I haven’t seen an overtly religious activity being suggested as community service in the broad acquaintance I have with Catholic schools. Religious activities, including off-campus ones, normally do not accrue community service hours. Perhaps there are some that I am not acquainted with and am happy to be corrected on that.
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NewEnglandPriest
Guest
Correct, its about “community service credits” and not “academic credits.” But it all boils down to what the government requires and considers to meet those requirements…
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CrazyRachel
Guest
Praise God this man’s job is now safe. Its only sad it was ever on the line in the first place for encouraging children to respect life and standing up for what is right.
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curlycool89
Guest
Speaking as a person who graduated high school in Canada (at a Catholic high school), I can say that service hours are a requirement of our Christian Ethics course. You don’t pass the course unless you had a certain number of hours (and you can’t graduate without passing CE each year).
That is the sort of idea.
Personally (and I know this will put me in opposition to some people here), I agree with the school (yep, I’m agreeing with Archbishop Weisgerber. That’s new to me too). I’m not in favour of giving service hours for prayer. In my opinion, it would just make the prayer seem phoney; it would lessen the authenticity. You should prayer because you are moved by the Spirit to pray, not because you get a reward out of it.
I know that in my years, people could get hours for doing things like volunteering with the Scouts or helping/mentoring disabled kids. There were also really easy volunteer activities (helping younger grades get band uniforms sized/picked, scorekeeping for volleyball/basketball), and some that ended up being part of a class (visiting a hospital as part of Choral to sing songs and visit those in the hospital).
I know the few years I had to do service hours I ended up with more hours then I actually needed, and that was not exactly putting a lot of effort into it.
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Phemie
Guest
I also agreed with the school. There are lots of opportunities to earn volunteer hours, even in our small town. Praying is not something you do for credit, at least not in credit in this world.
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Jeanna
Guest
You make a good point, however should the principal face dismissal? IMHO That seems quite harsh.
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Mungling
Guest
Let’s be honest here, I’ve rather recently graduated from a high school in Canada. The requirements for what constitutes volunteer hours are really lax, and I know a fair number of people that create fake hours just so they don’t have to bother. Whenever you do volunteer my experience has been that the person who was giving the hours would always give more than on was actually entitled to.
The community service IS a good idea, and young people should try to be more actively involved in their community. But to pretend the system we have now is anything but a joke would be dishonest. Then again, perhaps my experience was not representative.
Whether or not it is good to give community service for prayer, the bottom line is that the principle’s job was threatened because he was supporting the pro life movement. I’ve always thought that people would consider it a given that a Catholic School would espouse a pro life viewpoint but I suppose even that’s controversial in Canada.
The community service IS a good idea, and young people should try to be more actively involved in their community. But to pretend the system we have now is anything but a joke would be dishonest. Then again, perhaps my experience was not representative.
Whether or not it is good to give community service for prayer, the bottom line is that the principle’s job was threatened because he was supporting the pro life movement. I’ve always thought that people would consider it a given that a Catholic School would espouse a pro life viewpoint but I suppose even that’s controversial in Canada.
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Phemie
Guest
I work in a community performance arts centre where all of our ushers, many of our techs and backstage workers are volunteers. A great many of them are students (part of our professional tech’s duties is to train students so that they can do the tech for their own schools’ shows) and they are really good at what they do. Most don’t even ask us to sign off on their ‘volunteer hours’ sheet because they get those hours elsewhere (we do record each volunteer’s hours simply to show funders how much the theatre means to the community).
That said, we do have students who sign up specifically to get their volunteer hours. It’s been my experience that they are the ones who don’t show up when they’re scheduled, they don’t look happy to be there when they do show up and they usually don’t bother to come back once they have met their required number of hours if they’ve ever bothered to show up in the first place.
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