Catholics neeed to read their Bibles!

[2nd_Adam]

Actually you are wrong. Acts 9:31:

“h men oun ekklhsia kaq olhV thV ioudaiaV kai galilaiaV kai samareiaV eicen eirhnhn oikodomoumenh kai poreuomenh tw fobw tou kuriou kai th paraklhsei tou agiou pneumatoV eplhquneto”

The red part actually translates to Catholic Church.

ekklhsia kaq olhV thV = Church Catholic… Or Catholic Church.

Again, the question is about Catholic translations. Do Catholic translations acutally translate it to the Cathoilc Church, or not?

 

[2nd_Adam]

what contents do you want to discuss? I’m ready & waitin…

Justification by faith, what the Scripture reveal in regards to justification by faith?

 

[2nd_Adam]

Originally Posted by 2nd Adam
Let’s start discussing core biblical doctrine according to the Scriptures. When was Abraham declared righteous? We can study Romans chapters 3 and 4 as well as James chapter 2.

Why do Calvanists gravitate to Romans virtually to the exclusion of the rest of scripture?

That’s an unfair statement. I posted that we can explore Romans chapters 3 and 4 together with James chapter 2.

 

[2nd_Adam]

No, not a bit! Please keep an eye out, because 2nd may get serious about this discussion, and then we can have at it. You will know he is serious when he opens one of these threads over in Apologetics. Until that happens, it is all just a smokescreen.

I just like to hang our on the non-Catholic Reglion, because I am catholic but not Catholic. We should discuss the Scriptures hear on the “Catholics need to read their Bibles”, so Catholics will be motivated to read their Bibles when participating on this thread. Sometimes, a challenge in what one personally believes is the best motivation to open and study your Bibles.

 

[2nd_Adam]

You have misunderstood, Jimmy B. Although 2nd has claimed to be “catholic” he means he knows He belongs to the One Church founded by Christ. However, he has had none of these experiences you assume. I am not sure he has ever been to a Mass. He is a Reformed Evangelical (Calvanis). I do think he has learned more about the Catholic faith, even though he seems to be here primarily in order to make converts. He is much more open minded than most folks that come here from his tradition.

Why, thanks for the compliment. I am not hear to make converts. My motivation when I post on different Christian and Catholic Christian sites, is to help each other to grow in our affection and love for our God. I believe in remnant theology, knowing full well that there is a remnant in the Catholic Church just like any other Christian community. When I say that I am catholic, I am describing the universal church, or the true body of Christ only known by God alone. It has nothing to do with the Catholic Church as an institution or other branches within Christianity. I don’t believe any of the branches of Christianity has the fullness or truth, is an exclusive One True Church, inlcluding the Reformed Churches too.

 

[spoiltvictorian]

I just like to hang our on the non-Catholic Reglion, because I am catholic but not Catholic. We should discuss the Scriptures hear on the “Catholics need to read their Bibles”, so Catholics will be motivated to read their Bibles when participating on this thread. Sometimes, a challenge in what one personally believes is the best motivation to open and study your Bibles.

Adam, I don’t think you understand…they do study their Bibles. It’s just that they do it in harmony with the teaching of the Church. You think that the proof somebody reads their Bible is that they agree with you. You have to understand that won’t always happen.

 

[2nd_Adam]

hi adam. i have been researching the scriptures with you, and all you respond with is philosophy. so i must come to the conclusion that yes, you are reading the word of God in the light of calvins teachings, and not that of Christ or his Church. so therefor calvin is your authourity. so to you calvin is a prophet and the institutes of calvin are real. sound familiar? another group claims this about their founder and his writings. you are of the same spirit apparently. i think we shall call it, the cult of calvin. been nice chatting with ya.
when You are ready to research scripture let me know. or we could discuss the life of calvin. that would be fun. shall we talk about the people he disagreed with that he had put to death? or maybe his anti semitism:shrug:have a good one

I am a Christian first, Evangelical second, and a Reformed Christian a distant third. My Christian Faith does not rise or fall in what Calvin or Luther believed, because all Christians know in part, including the Apostle Paul. I acknowledge that truth, as Christians grow in this life in both life and doctrine, resulting in transformation to the praise of God’s glorious grace. I think you guys are focusing too much on what you think Calvinists believe as compared to what God reveals in the Scriptures. Actually, there are more non-Calvinists in Protestantism than Calvinists. So, by attacking Calvinisn, it does not prove a point in a debate between Protestant essential theology from Catholic essential theology. Catholics and Protestants share many many essential doctrines which makeup the Faith that once for all delieved to the saints. I personally believe that Catholic Faith has moved to a more solid and clear positon of justification by faith… which was really the dividing line causing the Protestant Reformation.

 

[2nd_Adam]

I’VE GOT IT! I’VE FIGURED IT OUT! :newidea::newidea::newidea::newidea:

2nd Adam reads Scripture because he was predestined to read it!

All true Christians, regardless of being Protestants or Catholics, are predestined to read the Sacred Scriptures… becasue that is what God’s adopted children do. The Catholic Church has a very high view of Sacred Scriptures, therefore, why don’t Catholics study their Sacred Scriptures like their seperated brothers. That is the purpose of the OP link written by a Catholic. I love to go a round or two with my Arminian Protestant brothers, forcing both of us to search the Scriptures daily. Why can’t we do the same here? If I am wrong on an issue or doctrine, I welcome my brothers to enlighten me through the Scirptures… alway reforming to the revealed will of God. :newidea::newidea::newidea:

 

[rinnie]

[SIGN][/SIGN]

Why, thanks for the compliment. I am not hear to make converts. My motivation when I post on different Christian and Catholic Christian sites, is to help each other to grow in our affection and love for our God. I believe in remnant theology, knowing full well that there is a remnant in the Catholic Church just like any other Christian community. When I say that I am catholic, I am describing the universal church, or the true body of Christ only known by God alone. It has nothing to do with the Catholic Church as an institution or other branches within Christianity. I[SIGN] don’t believe any of the branches of Christianity has the fullness or truth, is an exclusive[/SIGN] One True Church, inlcluding the Reformed Churches too.

How can you say that when the CC is the only Church that has all of the sacraments?

 

[2nd_Adam]

and he is following an apostate like calvin because he was predestinated to do it! and he will be led to the truth of catholicism, because he is predestinated to do it! lol at least i hope that is what happens. he seems like a decent enough guy. but if he were so comfortable in his point of view, he wouldnt be searching so hard to be convinced by the catholic point of view. i think he just needs the right reason to convert. keep working on him, he will be catholic eventually.lol!

Now, that kind of positing does not help our call for Christian unity according to Jesus. I think you should study the ECT 1 and ECT II documents.

The ECT Statement taken from Christianity Today, December 8, 1997, pp. 35-77

EVANGELICALS AND CATHOLICS TOGETHER: THE GIFT OF SALVATION

For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. For God sent the Son into the world, not to condemn the world, but that the world might be saved through him. (John 3:16-17)

We give thanks to God that in recent years many Evangelicals and Catholics, ourselves among them, have been able to express a common faith in Christ and so to acknowledge one another as brothers and sisters in Christ. We confess together one God, the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit; we confess Jesus Christ the Incarnate Son of God; we affirm the binding authority of Holy Scripture, God’s inspired Word; and we acknowledge the Apostles’ and Nicene creeds as faithful witnesses to that Word.

seekgod.ca/ect2.htm

seekgod.ca/ect3.htm

 

[rinnie]

[SIGN][/SIGN]

All true Christians, regardless of being Protestants or Catholics, are predestined to read the Sacred Scriptures… becasue that is what God’s adopted children do. The Catholic Church has a very high view of Sacred Scriptures,[SIGN] therefore, why don’t Catholics study their Sacred Scriptures like their seperated brothers. [/SIGN]That is the purpose of the OP link written by a Catholic. I love to go a round or two with my Arminian Protestant brothers, forcing both of us to search the Scriptures daily. Why can’t we do the same here? If I am wrong on an issue or doctrine, I welcome my brothers to enlighten me through the Scirptures… alway reforming to the revealed will of God. :newidea::newidea::newidea:

I study the scripture ever day. My dad did study and read the bible for the last 50 years of his life daily. And he was RC. How could you make a statement about Catholics. There are just as many Catholic’s here on this site who study the bible as there are Protestants.

We just know that we do not have the Power of the HS to define scripture because we accepted that teaching in the bible. So where is your proof that Catholics don’t study the bible?

 

[rinnie]

[SIGN]Now, that kind of positing does not help our call for Christian unity according to Jesus. I [/SIGN]think you should study the ECT 1 and ECT II documents.

The ECT Statement taken from Christianity Today, December 8, 1997, pp. 35-77

EVANGELICALS AND CATHOLICS TOGETHER: THE GIFT OF SALVATION

For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. For God sent the Son into the world, not to condemn the world, but that the world might be saved through him. (John 3:16-17)

We give thanks to God that in recent years many Evangelicals and Catholics, ourselves among them, have been able to express a common faith in Christ and so to acknowledge one another as brothers and sisters in Christ. We confess together one God, the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit; we confess Jesus Christ the Incarnate Son of God; we affirm the binding authority of Holy Scripture, God’s inspired Word; and we acknowledge the Apostles’ and Nicene creeds as faithful witnesses to that Word.

seekgod.ca/ect2.htm

seekgod.ca/ect3.htm

Maybe Practice what you preach? You just accused Catholics of not studying scripture is that a way to unite us?

 

[2nd_Adam]

Calvanists are basically “Paulists”. They believe that Paul’s writings are the only place to find what they call “cohesive doctrines regarding salvation”. Any other scripture references are just extraneous. The organized presentation on the doctrine of justification (which they consider salvation) is found only in Paul.

That’s an incorrect statement my brother. Calvinism is more a systematic theology based on the entire Scriptures, from Genesis to Revelation. It has great continuity between the Old Testament and the New Testament. I see that the Catholic systematic theology seems to have a sharp discontinuity between the Old Testament and the New Testament. If the New Testament came through the Catholic Church, I guess the Old Testament is not considered too important in the Catholic Faith. If you can see the great continuity between the Old Testament saints and New Testament saints, you too would believe in remnant theology.

 

[2nd_Adam]

Adam, I don’t think you understand…they do study their Bibles. It’s just that they do it in harmony with the teaching of the Church. You think that the proof somebody reads their Bible is that they agree with you. You have to understand that won’t always happen.

Did you read the OP written by a Catholic and found on Catholic Answers? The thread of “Catholic need to read their Bibles” is based on a work done by a Catholic. I just thought a topic like this would be a great incentive for Catholics to seach the Scriptures with me. So, if you disagree with “Catholics need to read their Bible”, maybe you should get Catholic Answers to remove that article written by a Catholic.

 

[AwGusTeen]

That’s an unfair statement. I posted that we can explore Romans chapters 3 and 4 together with James chapter 2.

It’s not a statement – it’s a question, and one that I believe is pertinent. Many - MANY - five pointers that I know dwell almost exclusively in Romans. As an example, I have conversed with a Calvinist minister who has preached in Romans (with the exception of a few odd subjects) since 2007! Clearly, he doesn’t represent every Calvinist, but I would say that the majority of Calvinists here take this same approach.

libcfl.com/audio.htm

So, do you have a response to my original question?

 

[2nd_Adam]

It’s not a statement – it’s a question, and one that I believe is pertinent. Many - MANY - five pointers that I know dwell almost exclusively in Romans. As an example, I have conversed with a Calvinist minister who has preached in Romans (with the exception of a few odd subjects) since 2007! Clearly, he doesn’t represent every Calvinist, but I would say that the majority of Calvinists here take this same approach.

libcfl.com/audio.htm

So, do you have a response to my original question?

Calvinism is a loaded word. Many Arminian Protetstants are extremely hostile to Reformed Calvinists. What is a Calvinist anyways? I bet you can find Bible commentaries by John Calvin on just about all the books in the Bible. Romans and John tend to be very doctrinal; therefore, Protestants in general spend much time in these two books… do to their doctrinal nature. I still think if a Catholic brother really wants to represent their Calvinists siblings, they need to study from this site to best represent what Reformed Christians actually believe. As siblings, we cannot distort each others views, but best rerpesent each other honestly and fairly.

monergism.com/

 

[spoiltvictorian]

Did you read the OP written by a Catholic and found on Catholic Answers? The thread of “Catholic need to read their Bibles” is based on a work done by a Catholic. I just thought a topic like this would be a great incentive for Catholics to seach the Scriptures with me. So, if you disagree with “Catholics need to read their Bible”, maybe you should get Catholic Answers to remove that article written by a Catholic.

Well, yes, I don’t agree with that part of the original editorial, but I think it is a concession - the real topic being the perception of Catholics as only remaining Catholic because they don’t read their Bibles. It’s also an exhortation because most of us could probably use more time listening to God’s Word.

“I just thought a topic like this would be a great incentive for Catholics to search the Scriptures with me.” There it is again. What is the test that a Catholic has searched the Scriptures? They don’t hold to Catholicism. I’m not saying you shouldn’t disagree with Catholic interpretations of the Bible because you should. I’m saying you shouldn’t assume that until somebody agrees with you, they’re not reading their Bibles. Or if they are merely reading, they’re not searching the Scriptures.

 

[Rustic_Papist]

Catholics neeed to read their Bibles!

Any man can pick up a Bible and read it. Though not many can understand it. This is the reason for the existance of thousands of Protestant “churches”.

Sincerely yours in Christ,
Rustic Papist.

 

[2nd_Adam]

Well, yes, I don’t agree with that part of the original editorial, but I think it is a concession - the real topic being the perception of Catholics as only remaining Catholic because they don’t read their Bibles. It’s also an exhortation because most of us could probably use more time listening to God’s Word.

“I just thought a topic like this would be a great incentive for Catholics to search the Scriptures with me.” There it is again. What is the test that a Catholic has searched the Scriptures? They don’t hold to Catholicism. I’m not saying you shouldn’t disagree with Catholic interpretations of the Bible because you should. I’m saying you shouldn’t assume that until somebody agrees with you, they’re not reading their Bibles. Or if they are merely reading, they’re not searching the Scriptures.

I am not saying that Catholics need to agree with my interpertations of the Scriptures. We all truly know in part, and by challenges by those who understand things differently within the body of Christ… we all grow in the grace and knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ. The OP link admits that Catholics in general are weak in Sacred Scripture and Protestants are weak in church history. So, both communites should learn from each other.

 

[2nd_Adam]

Any man can pick up a Bible and read it. Though not many can understand it. This is the reason for the existance of thousands of Protestant “churches”.

Sincerely yours in Christ,
Rustic Papist.

Catholics and Protestants are in agreement that God the Holy Spirit illuminates the Scriptures to receive it. The difference is really about how the Holy Spirit works in our communities.