"Catholics" on Birth Control

[Jea9]

I don’t even know that the pill is sinful if a woman is married if there is a true medical need. I have no desire to investigate.

Here’s the statement I don’t understand though:

It totally was typed wrong sorry. I even had to re-read it myself several times I meant that it’s a sin if you are trying to avoid having a child. Boy…you sure do have to be careful how you type something…you lose something in electronic communications that’s for sure

 

[LittleDeb]

Isn’t that the “old” NFP?

Aren’t the days of abstinence lessened with the Creighton Model?

Not married, just curious.

That is an average. I use Sympto-thermal method and have about 9 days at most. The method used doesn’t shorten your days. Your familiarity with your own body through the method you use can shorten it. For those people trying to be exceptionally conservative they can have 14-20 days of abstinence when they don’t yet know their bodies. (early marriage, post childbirth etc.)

Personally, I think everyone should chart for awhile whether married or single. It is such a good way to understand the changes our natural hormones bring about. A previous poster mentioned facial hair. That can be managed by understanding our hormones and boosting certain vitamins.

Yet another reason I prefer charting. I like knowing my body. Those Catholics who defend their use of ABC? I actually feel really sorry for them. I remember when I was duped by the contraception industry.

 

[PetersKeys]

That is an average. I use Sympto-thermal method and have about 9 days at most. The method used doesn’t shorten your days. Your familiarity with your own body through the method you use can shorten it. For those people trying to be exceptionally conservative they can have 14-20 days of abstinence when they don’t yet know their bodies. (early marriage, post childbirth etc.)

Personally, I think everyone should chart for awhile whether married or single. It is such a good way to understand the changes our natural hormones bring about. A previous poster mentioned facial hair. That can be managed by understanding our hormones and boosting certain vitamins.

Yet another reason I prefer charting. I like knowing my body. Those Catholics who defend their use of ABC? I actually feel really sorry for them. I remember when I was duped by the contraception industry.

Yea I know how that goes. I know so many people who have been trapped in by plannedparenthood and they are brainwashing so many young women of today, even young Catholic women.

I am curious. If a woman died while on birth control would she die in mortal sin? I personally think this would be the big danger of it, because it puts you in a state of mortal sin until you stop taking it.

 

[Seatuck]

Uh…women who grow beards?
It balances out the correct amounts of female hormones in their bodies. Not enough = facial hair.
So a medication which prevents conception, can be used as medication to regulate a woman’s hormones.
If preventing conception is a side effect of the medication, and the woman is married, it really does become a gray area as far as sin goes.

For me, I wouldn’t do it.
(But then, I don’t have a beard.)

Nope, there are other treatments for that including non hormonal. It is beneficial to have testing done anyway to find out just exactly what hormones are needed and provide them instead of a premeasured dose like in ABC pills.There are creams and patches etc.

 

[Sean_Boyle]

Well, if the Bishop says it is ok, then isn’t it ok in that diocese? Ok or not, BC has become a non-issue. I know you all hate to acknowledge that, but it is true. The Catholics Church just isn’t going to give glory to God by not having sex or by not masturbating or by not eating meat on Friday, or going to Church with your head covered.

You all need to get away from all the things it is not supposed to do and focus on doing what God wants. I’d be very surprised if God couldn’t think of something His Church needs to do now that it is not doing. For starters, how about teaching young people, that have a very bad example from their drug addict parent, how to find happiness in a marriage? Ever go to a priest, or deacon for help? You know they are not professionally trained for that. Wouldn’t it be nice to know you are going to someone that is a good Catholic and helping you and you are actually getting good, professional help?

How about understanding the reason why people feel they need to be homosexual. If it is based on something that isn’t right how about coming up with a way to fix it? Does anybody know how much money anybody has spent on studies of why people are straight or gay?

I just picked homosexuality out of the blue, anything would work. How much energy does the Church spend on understanding things and coming up with really good programs to help people?

Honestly, practicing Catholic’s are more concerned about the workings of faith and how God presents them to us to follow then how one person believes it should be done.

 

[justinthemartyr]

Well, if the Bishop says it is ok, then isn’t it ok in that diocese? Ok or not, BC has become a non-issue. I know you all hate to acknowledge that, but it is true. The Catholics Church just isn’t going to give glory to God by not having sex or by not masturbating or by not eating meat on Friday, or going to Church with your head covered.

You all need to get away from all the things it is not supposed to do and focus on doing what God wants. I’d be very surprised if God couldn’t think of something His Church needs to do now that it is not doing. For starters, how about teaching young people, that have a very bad example from their drug addict parent, how to find happiness in a marriage? Ever go to a priest, or deacon for help? You know they are not professionally trained for that. Wouldn’t it be nice to know you are going to someone that is a good Catholic and helping you and you are actually getting good, professional help?

How about understanding the reason why people feel they need to be homosexual. If it is based on something that isn’t right how about coming up with a way to fix it? Does anybody know how much money anybody has spent on studies of why people are straight or gay?

I just picked homosexuality out of the blue, anything would work. How much energy does the Church spend on understanding things and coming up with really good programs to help people?

a non issue?

This person is another proof of the path being narrow, and few entering(into heaven).

It is wishful thinking to believe that artificial birth control is a non issue. Obedience is necessary.

 

[LittleDeb]

Yea I know how that goes. I know so many people who have been trapped in by plannedparenthood and they are brainwashing so many young women of today, even young Catholic women.

I am curious. If a woman died while on birth control would she die in mortal sin? I personally think this would be the big danger of it, because it puts you in a state of mortal sin until you stop taking it.

You know that is a really good question and I think the heart of what the OP is addressing.

I guess we would have to say that objectively a person would be in a state of mortal sin. But, then there is that important word, culpability. Subjectively, we don’t know. Is she, personally, in mortal sin? Only God knows for sure.

Welcome to CAF. I hope your stay here is a good one.

 

[PetersKeys]

You know that is a really good question and I think the heart of what the OP is addressing.

I guess we would have to say that objectively a person would be in a state of mortal sin. But, then there is that important word, culpability. Subjectively, we don’t know. Is she, personally, in mortal sin? Only God knows for sure.

Welcome to CAF. I hope your stay here is a good one.

Thanks for the welcome

If she knows what the church teaches on birth control. That it is a mortal sin. Then it puts the person in a knowledge of that sin, which makes her culpable. I think if a women who is taking birth control gets absolution from the priest, wouldn’t it make it an invalid absolution if she continued to take birth control? I was always taught there has to be a firm resolve, a resolve to stop whatever act you confess in the future, in order for a confession to be totally valid.

I think your in a state of mortal sin as long as the chemical stays in your body.

 

[Lee44]

Hi,

Just where in the Bible does Jesus or any of the Apostles say that ABC is a sin. Its only a sin that the Roman Catholics “made up” to increase their rolls. BTW, studies show that over 50% of American Catholic women practice ABC.

 

[PetersKeys]

Hi,

Just where in the Bible does Jesus or any of the Apostles say that ABC is a sin. Its only a sin that the Roman Catholics “made up” to increase their rolls. BTW, studies show that over 50% of American Catholic women practice ABC.

The Bible mentions at least one form of contraception specifically and condemns it. Coitus interruptus, was used by Onan to avoid fulfilling his duty according to the ancient Jewish law of fathering children for one’s dead brother. “Judah said to Onan, ‘Go in to your brother’s wife, and perform the duty of a brother-in-law to her, and raise up offspring for your brother.’ But Onan knew that the offspring would not be his; so when he went in to his brother’s wife he spilled the semen on the ground, lest he should give offspring to his brother. And what he did was displeasing in the sight of the Lord, and he slew him also” (Gen. 38:8–10).

The biblical penalty for not giving your brother’s widow children was public humiliation, not death (Deut. 25:7–10). But Onan received death as punishment for his crime. This means his crime was more than simply not fulfilling the duty of a brother-in-law. He lost his life because he violated natural law, as Jewish and Christian commentators have always understood. For this reason, certain forms of contraception have historically been known as “Onanism,” after the man who practiced it, just as homosexuality has historically been known as “Sodomy,” after the men of Sodom, who practiced that vice (cf. Gen. 19).

Anyway, can anyone answer my earlier question? Does continuance of birth control make confession invalid if the person dosen’t confess it or continues to take it without a firm resolve after confession??

 

[YADA]

Hi,

Just where in the Bible does Jesus or any of the Apostles say that ABC is a sin. Its only a sin that the Roman Catholics “made up” to increase their rolls. BTW, studies show that over 50% of American Catholic women practice ABC.

Hello Lee44,

You are totally misinformed on this and the statement is blatantly anti-catholic … Now I am sure you [at least I hope] did not mean to be catholic bashing … and I assume you are just ignorant of Christian history and the topic of artificial birth control [ABC]. And just to clarify "ignorance’ is not an insult it just means you are uninformed or unaware…

Until 1930 +/- all of Christianity taught that ABC was sinful. It was the Anglicans that broke with that tradition first. The Baptists were the most vociferous to condemn the break that the Anglicans made in allowing ABC.

The Pope wrote and encyclical denouncing the practice and predicted that if the procreative aspect of conjugal love between married persons is denied by ABC rising divorce rates would be the first result. This would be followed by increases in the number of abortions [killing of innocent unborn children]. Once abortion becomes common place euthanasia would follow [the killing of elderly and medically fragile and disabled persons.] Physical and mental abuse, etc.

Guess what happened after the Anglican ABC revolt?..

The other Christian denominations followed suit and accepted ABC. Divorce rates increased. Even with the advent of the “Pill”, abortion rates are sky high. Marriage is not the norm, more babies are concieved out of wedlock, they are aborted at will or raised in fatherless homes. Sex is just a date event, serial monogamy outside of marriage is siocially acceptable and ‘sex’ not a “marriage” issue. Euthanasia is becoming the new rage. And homosexuality is the ‘in thing’.

Child abuse and drug abuse are at all time highs …

That Pope was more right then he knew and the decline probably occured much faster than he thought …

Go read the history about the Anglican approval of ABC at the Lambeth [SP?] Convention in the 1930’s.

The ban of ABC by the Chruch had*** nothing*** to do with gaining adherents or increasing collections. It is totally based upon the concept that God is the giver of Life. That we are called to participate with God and not attempt to usurp or thwart the will of God.

 

[Lee44]

Yada,

So you are blaming Anglicans for all of the sins of the world. Man you are so misinformed. BTW, I was a Roman Catholic for 15years come this Easter Vigil. However this Easter Vigil me and my wife are being offcially “accepted” into the Episcopal Church.

its attitudes like yours that are driving people out of the Church of Rome what with all of your Papal claptrap

 

[hasikelee]

Yada,

So you are blaming Anglicans for all of the sins of the world. Man you are so misinformed. BTW, I was a Roman Catholic for 15years come this Easter Vigil. However this Easter Vigil me and my wife are being offcially “accepted” into the Episcopal Church.

its attitudes like yours that are driving people out of the Church of Rome what with all of your Papal claptrap

That is deliberate bait. I hope the other poster doesn’t take it.

How about you present one fact against the numerous facts in the previous post.

 

[Lee44]

That is deliberate bait. I hope the other poster doesn’t take it.

How about you present one fact against the numerous facts in the previous post.

Why don’t you get your head out of the sand and go live your life as Christ commanded. This forum is so full of hate and bigotry towards those of other faiths. I guess you are going to blame someone else for all of the Child molesting Roman Catholic Priests. Typical Papist, can’t take responsibilty so blame someone else.

 

[newbetx]

Yada,

So you are blaming Anglicans for all of the sins of the world. Man you are so misinformed. BTW, I was a Roman Catholic for 15years come this Easter Vigil. However this Easter Vigil me and my wife are being offcially “accepted” into the Episcopal Church.

its attitudes like yours that are driving people out of the Church of Rome what with all of your Papal claptrap

No, That wasn’t how it’s meant. You are chosing to walk away from the faith. It is your right to do so. It is impolite to say the things you have in the manner you have. You are free to believe what you want. So are we.

I mean no disrespect with, "its attitudes like yours that are -]driving/-] *luring *people out of the Church of Rome. Misunderstanding about justification abounds.

I kindly suggest that if you have not already done so, read Christopher West’s Theology of the Body for Beginners. It explains all of this “Papal claptrap” in a way that even a disbeliever like me can understand.

Peace!

 

[YADA]

Yada,

So you are blaming Anglicans for all of the sins of the world. Man you are so misinformed. BTW, I was a Roman Catholic for 15years come this Easter Vigil. However this Easter Vigil me and my wife are being offcially “accepted” into the Episcopal Church.

its attitudes like yours that are driving people out of the Church of Rome what with all of your Papal claptrap

It may be bait …

No I do not blame the Anglicans for all the sins of the world … They were [in fact] the first Christian Faith [as in the “Anglican Church” as a body] who abandoned the tenet of faith that ABC was a sinful act. That is a historical fact … so is the conndemnation of that stance by the Baptists that was made at the time. The Encyclical that was written ‘as a response’ to the Anglican decision is also a historical document …

It was you who made the assertion that the ban of ABC by the Catholic Church was “Made Up” to get more catholics … a statement that is blatantly anti-catholic and historically false…

You can research the history or remain in your ignorance…

I hope you find a home in the Episcopal Church that brings you closer to Christ. And wonderful that you and your wife will be united in a faith trdition *.

It is sad that you did not learn much about your catholic faith during your 15 year sojourn let alone the history of christian faith and practice across the various traditions. Sadder still that you harbor so much hate for the historical Christian faith. I hope you can learn forgiveness and reconcilliation and some history too ***

 

[hasikelee]

Why don’t you get your head out of the sand and go live your life as Christ commanded. This forum is so full of hate and bigotry towards those of other faiths. I guess you are going to blame someone else for all of the Child molesting Roman Catholic Priests. Typical Papist, can’t take responsibilty so blame someone else.

Still waiting for one fact against the numerous facts presented in the prior post…

Your remarks only hurt your credibility. If you are as committed in your belief as you claim you are, then present some credible, cited information to prove it, or stop asserting yourself on it.

 

[childofmary1143]

no, shes married, and takes it because she dosen’t want kids. She even said her bishop said it was ok. Im having a hard time believing her. I also found she is pro-choice and is feminist.

I don’t understand how these people can blantantly go against church teaching and yet claim to be ok when taking communion. Are they really just that ignorant? or is it bad denial and wanting justification of sin

Getting back on topic of this thread. It offends me greatly that a person can support abortion and birth control and still claim to be Catholic and desecrate Our Lord with reception of Holy Communion.

She claims that your Priest and Bishop said it was okay but do you think, based on what you have observed, that is true? I ask that because if she is lying about that then perhaps the Priest/Bishop can stop the desecration that is taking place. If not perhaps get some proof in print or on media and forward it to the Vatican.

 

[newbetx]

Until the second coming, we’ll always have “Cafeteria Catholics”
I define those as:

1. those that don’t know about or understand a particular aspect of what they should believe and practice.
2. those that do know, but at this time, refuse to follow “because it obviously doesn’t apply to me”
3. those that have been misled and think they follow the faith, but don’t.

I suspect that she is #2 and has self-deluded (?) herself into thinking that’s she’s a #3 because she doesn’t want to admit she’s a #2. And why not? So much easier to put the blame on someone else these days.

Although if you think ANYONE in your parish has been led to #3, it’s worth checking out.

 

[1234]

Yada,

So you are blaming Anglicans for all of the sins of the world. Man you are so misinformed. BTW, I was a Roman Catholic for 15years come this Easter Vigil. However this Easter Vigil me and my wife are being officially “accepted” into the Episcopal Church.

its attitudes like yours that are driving people out of the Church of Rome what with all of your Papal claptrap

Congratulations Lee&Wife!

You will find a very welcoming congregation in the Episcopal Church.