Catholics set to pass Anglicans as leading UK church

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I think we’ll all have to wait for the inevitable disintegration of the Anglican Communion to play itself out, before we see any resulting new sects apply for incorporation with the Holy See.
 
As far as ordinations would go very many (including the last 4 Archbishops of Canterbury) have been ordained by bishops with valid apostolic succession.

John
 
Maranatha said:
Clarification re Times article on Anglican-Roman Catholic relations

Growing Together in Unity and Mission is being published as an agreed statement of IARCCUM (the International Anglican - Roman Catholic Commission for Unity and Mission), and is to be published under the Commission’s authority, not as an official statement of the Catholic Church and the Anglican Communion. It is being put forward to foster discussion and reflection, as the statement clearly states.
…
Growing Together in Unity and Mission has not yet been officially published. It is unfortunate that its contents have been prematurely reported in a way which misrepresents its intentions and sensationalises its conclusions. The first part of the document, which treats doctrinal matters, is an attempt to synthesize the work of ARCIC (the Anglican - Roman Catholic International Commission) over the past 35 years. It identifies the level of agreement which has been reached by ARCIC, but is also very clear in identifying ongoing areas of disagreement, and in raising questions which still need to be addressed in dialogue. Those ongoing questions and areas of disagreement are highlighted in boxed sections interspersed throughout the text. It is a very honest document assessing the state of Anglican - Roman Catholic relations at the present moment.

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The end of that second link is worth a look:​

The Times article speculates about the Catholic Church’s response to a possible schism within the Anglican Communion. **It should be pointed out that the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity has consistently spoken of the value of the Anglican Communion remaining a communion, rooted in the Apostolic faith, **as indicated in this statement from 2004: “It is our overwhelming desire that the Anglican Communion stays together, rooted in the historic faith which our dialogue and relations over four decades have led us to believe that we share to a large degree.” During the visit of the Archbishop of Canterbury to Pope Benedict in November, 2006, the Holy Father noted: “It is our fervent hope that the Anglican Communion will remain grounded in the Gospels and the Apostolic Tradition which form our common patrimony and are the basis of our common aspiration to work for full visible unity.”
  • which is rather different from some of the comments on CAF my emphasis]
 
Jeffrey said:
Ruth Gledhill, Religion Correspondent

Radical proposals to reunite Anglicans with the Roman Catholic Church under the leadership of the Pope are to be published this year, The Times has learnt.

The proposals have been agreed by senior bishops of both churches.

In a 42-page statement prepared by an international commission of both churches, Anglicans and Roman Catholics are urged to explore how they might reunite under the Pope.

timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article1403702.ece
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From a comment on Ruth Gledhill’s weblog:​

Is it likely that Rome would jeopardise the greater goal of unity with the orthodox by unilaterally allowing ex-anglican married bishops? I very much doubt it. So Akinlola, Williams, Wright, Scott-Joynt, Nazir-Ali et al will be faced with a stark choice if they want to go down this route to unity with Rome: put aside their wives and embrace celibacy OR step down from episcopal rank and serve as simple priests under their local catholic ordinary. (Of course none of this makes mention of the already-ordained women, both priests and bishops.)

If they opt to keep their episcopal status it is asking no greater sacrifice than they blithely demand of every gay man in the church - and what they ask of someone else…oughtn’t they to be prepared to do it themselves?

timescolumns.typepad.com/gledhill/2007/02/growing_togethe.html#comments
 
The Anglican Use could indeed grow around the world.

That would be a good thing.
 
Jerry-Jet said:
The Anglican Use could indeed grow around the world.

That would be a good thing.
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For that to happen the Catholic bishops are going to have to facilitate more Anglican Use parishes. There are something like 6 or 7 in the entire USA and most of those are in Texas. For example, I don’t think that there is a single parish within a seven hour drive from where I live and I live in one of the largest concentrations of Episcopal faithful in the country. Virginia is divided into three dioceses of the Episcopal Church…the Diocese of Virginia, the Diocese of Southern Virginia and the Diocese of Southwestern Virginia. The Diocese of Virginia alone is the largest Episcopal diocese in the Episcopal Church with respect to membership (at least prior to losing The Falls Church, Truro and other historical parishes…currently in litigation). You would think that an Anglican Use parish in Northern Virginia, Richmond or Tidewater would be quite viable.
 
Pax vobiscum!

I remember reading sometime last year that the Traditional Anglican Communion was very interested in a reunion with Rome. I’m sure they are some of the Anglicans that have been involved in these talks. Anyone have any updates on that particular situation?

In Christ,
Rand
 
I wonder with the idea of the anglicans and catholics merging. Would this mean that the royals would have to drop their racist law of no royal marrying a catholic. Because as it stands, A royal can marry a jew a muslim a buddisht, heck even a devil worshipper. But they can’t marry a catholic without losing their title. I don’t know if it’s because they are worried about catholics reclaiming the throne or because incest is a sin for catholics hahahaha.
 
The Anglican church in the global south is primarily evangelical. That’s where all the numbers are. 17 million in Nigeria alone, they dwarf the Roman Catholic church in that country. These people have more in common with Methodists than Roman Catholics.

Worldwide Anglicans in communion with Canterbury are not interested in union with the Pope. I suspect the ‘journalist’ wrote the article just to sell it, with nothing real to base it on.

The Episcopal church is down from a recent 2.4 million to something (no one knows for sure, active membership is around 800,000 according to some sources) but a very significant portion are former Roman Catholics. These ex-RC may be a result of intermarriage or just plain fondness for the church, but many are there because of irregularities that will not work out in the RC church: second marriages with no possibility of annulment, opposition to Humanae Vitae, gay-lesbian orientation in active relationships, etc. If five percent of what’s currently left in the Episcopal Church become Roman Catholic I would be very surprised.

The referenced article is a cruel hoax calculated to make money for the author. Don’t fall for it.

Michael
 
The Anglican church in the global south is primarily evangelical. That’s where all the numbers are. 17 million in Nigeria alone, they dwarf the Roman Catholic church in that country. These people have more in common with Methodists than Roman Catholics.

Worldwide Anglicans in communion with Canterbury are not interested in union with the Pope. The report is a working paper with ideas but those ideas are just speculations, sort of like a ‘war games’ exercise. It’s a way of stimulating debate and dialogue but not a seriously feasable plan at this early stage. I suspect the ‘journalist’ wrote the article just to sell it, with nothing real to base it on.

The Episcopal church is down from a recent 2.4 million to something (no one knows for sure, active membership is around 800,000 according to some sources) but a very significant portion are former Roman Catholics. These ex-RC may be a result of intermarriage or just plain fondness for the church, but many are there because of irregularities that will not work out in the RC church: second marriages with no possibility of annulment, opposition to Humanae Vitae, gay-lesbian orientation in active relationships, etc. If five percent of what’s currently left in the Episcopal Church become Roman Catholic I would be very surprised. The bulk of the most likely candidates must have fled the wreck by now.

The referenced article is a cruel hoax calculated to make money for the author. Don’t fall for it.

Michael
 
The ‘racist law’ you refer to dates back to a time of huge conflict between Catholicism and the CofE in Britain. The Catholic James II was deposed by the Protestant William III and he set the law.

Britain is still a CofE country, and this law is just one small part of that tradition.

Will it affect you? Never. Will it affect 99.9999% of British Catholics? Never. Might if ever affect someone? Yeah. But we’ll cross that bridge when we come to it.
 
Titus said:
The ‘racist law’ you refer to dates back to a time of huge conflict between Catholicism and the CofE in Britain. The Catholic James II was deposed by the Protestant William III and he set the law.

Britain is still a CofE country, and this law is just one small part of that tradition.

Will it affect you? Never. Will it affect 99.9999% of British Catholics? Never. Might if ever affect someone? Yeah. But we’ll cross that bridge when we come to it.
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A racist law is still a racist. Regradless 0f when it was impossed, wether it was last week or hundreds of years ago. And just because a racist law doesn’t effect me does that mean i need not be offended by it? Should i not care if a Black man is discriminated against? because Hey i’m not black so why should i care? Lucky the people who fought againt south’s racist laws or the soldiers who fought against hitler never had your attitude.
 
Titus said:
The ‘racist law’ you refer to dates back to a time of huge conflict between Catholicism and the CofE in Britain. The Catholic James II was deposed by the Protestant William III and he set the law.

Britain is still a CofE country, and this law is just one small part of that tradition.

Will it affect you? Never. Will it affect 99.9999% of British Catholics? Never. Might if ever affect someone? Yeah. But we’ll cross that bridge when we come to it.
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A racist law is still a racist. Regradless 0f when it was impossed, wether it was last week or hundreds of years ago. And just because a racist law doesn’t effect me does that mean i need not be offended by it? Should i not care if a Black man is discriminated against? because Hey i’m not black so why should i care? Lucky the people who fought againt the south’s racist laws or the soldiers who fought against hitler never had your attitude.
 
latin_rite said:
A racist law is still a racist.
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Please excuse this Jewess but how is it racial discrimination? In what sense are Catholics and Protestants different races? Can a Catholic change race by becoming a Protestant or vice-versa?

Shouldn’t it be ‘sectist’ or something?
 
Kaninchen said:
Please excuse this Jewess but how is it racial discrimination? In what sense are Catholics and Protestants different races? Can a Catholic change race by becoming a Protestant or vice-versa?

Shouldn’t it be ‘sectist’ or something?
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**Good point. **
latin_rite said:
A racist law is still a racist. Regradless 0f when it was impossed, wether it was last week or hundreds of years ago. And just because a racist law doesn’t effect me does that mean i need not be offended by it? Should i not care if a Black man is discriminated against? because Hey i’m not black so why should i care? Lucky the people who fought againt the south’s racist laws or the soldiers who fought against hitler never had your attitude.
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**Suddenly things are very combative. Let’s be clear: I’m not in favour of the law. But in the great scheme of things, it is of extremely small importance. **
 
Titus said:
in the great scheme of things, it is of extremely small importance.
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I agree. The odds of the law affecting anyone is extremely small, unlike the Jim Crow laws of the American South.

And (to get the thread back on topic) the growing numbers of Catholic Britons will make the day come sooner when the “no Catholic royals” provision comes to an end.
 
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