Catholics shouldn't try to convert Jews

[Peebo]

Catholics ‘shouldn’t try to convert Jews’
AAP DECEMBER 10, 2015 9:20PM

CATHOLICS should not try to convert Jews and should work with them to fight anti-Semitism, the Vatican says.

THE direction came in a major new document that drew the church further away from the strained relations of the past.

Christianity and Judaism are intertwined and God never annulled his covenant with the Jewish people, said the document from the Vatican’s Commission for Religious Relations with Jews.
“The Church is therefore obliged to view evangelisation to Jews, who believe in the one God, in a different manner from that to people of other religions and world views,” it said.
It also said Catholics should be particularly sensitive to the significance to Jews of the Shoah, the Hebrew word for the Holocaust, and pledged “to do all that is possible with our Jewish friends to repel anti-Semitic tendencies”.
“A Christian can never be an anti-Semite, especially because of the Jewish roots of Christianity,” it said.
The document coincided with the 50th anniversary of a revolutionary Vatican statement that repudiated the concept of collective Jewish guilt for Jesus’ death and launched a theological dialogue that traditionalists have rejected.
They feel there should be a so-called “Jewish mission” to convert Jews because they did not accept Jesus as the Messiah, and were therefore bound to be displeased by the new official stance on conversion, a senior Vatican official said.
“In concrete terms this means that the Catholic Church neither conducts nor supports any specific institutional mission work directed towards Jews,” said the document, adding that there was a “principled rejection of an institutional Jewish mission”.
A Vatican expert in Catholic-Jewish dialogue said it was the first time a repudiation of active conversion of Jews was so clearly stated in a Vatican document.
Until about 1960, prayers at Catholic Masses on Good Friday, the day commemorating the death of Jesus, labelled Jews “perfidious” and called for their conversion.
That prayer was eliminated from general use after the 1962-1965 Second Vatican Council introduced a new missal, or prayer book used at Masses.
But later a prayer for the Jews was allowed to remain in the old-style Latin Mass, sometimes called the Tridentine Rite, used by ultra-traditionalists such as the Society of Saint Pius X, whose members reject the reforms of the Second Vatican Council.
In 2008, former Pope Benedict further reformulated the prayer used by the traditionalists to remove language Jewish groups found offensive, such as “the blindness of that people”.
Thursday’s document said Catholics should “bear witness to their faith in Jesus Christ also to Jews” but that they should do so in “a humble and sensitive manner, acknowledging that Jews are bearers of God’s word …”

 

[Justin_Swanton]

Oh boy, oh boy, oh boy…

From a supernaturally beneficial point of view, what does Catholicism have that Judaism does not?

• The full revelation of the most important religious truths, including the Trinity, the Incarnation, Christ’s redemptive mission, Our Lady’s co-redemptive mission, the existence and nature of grace, Eschatology, etc., etc.
• the seven Sacraments, all vehicles of grace
• the moral and supernatural teaching of the Magisterium and the saints.
• and so on

And we are not supposed to do everything we can to bring the Jews to these treasures? What do they have? The Old Testament and their own religious writings, the latter of which have no divine guarantee of truth or even of common decency, as seen in another thread. I avoid getting personal on CAF so I will not say what I think of the person or persons who drew up that document.

 

[Mac_Murchaidh]

The document did not say that Catholics should not try to convert Jews.

First and foremost it must be stated emphatically that the document is not a magisterial document or doctrinal teaching of the Catholic Church, nor does it posit to be either of these. It does not forbid Jewish conversion to Catholicism, it does not say that we cannot evangelise and preach the Gospel. It does reiterate the traditional view of the Church, perhaps best expressed by Saints Bernard and Thomas Aquinas, that the Church should not concern itself with a corporate conversion of the Jewish people.

But it is a deeply flawed document.

“While affirming salvation through an explicit or even implicit faith in Christ, the Church does not question the continued love of God for the chosen people of Israel.” This is an abominably erroneous statement which flies in the face of Scripture, the Magisterium, and the teachings of the saints. But I suppose heterodoxy is to be expected.

“Let no man deceive himself. Unless he believes that Christ Jesus has lived in the flesh, and shall confess His cross and passion, and the blood which He shed for the salvation of the world, he shall not attain eternal life, whether he be a king, or a priest, or a ruler, or a private person, a master or a servant, a man or a woman.”

Furthermore, the document takes Nostra Aetate a step too far. The Church does not and cannot reject every form of supersessionism. It merely rejects erroneous ideas of supersessionism.

As a corporate entity, we should not be concerned with the conversion of the Jews. God will accomplish that before the Second Coming/ But we must preach the Gospel and encourage all individuals to embrace the true faith.

 

[Vouthon]

Oh boy, oh boy, oh boy…

And we are not supposed to do everything we can to bring the Jews to these treasures? What do they have? The Old Testament and their own religious writings, the latter of which have no divine guarantee of truth or even of common decency, as seen in another thread. I avoid getting personal on CAF so I will not say what I think of the person or persons who drew up that document.

So I’m guessing you believe the same concerning Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI as well then?

ncronline.org/blogs/ncr-today/church-should-not-pursue-conversion-jews-pope-says

**Church should not pursue conversion of Jews, pope says

After excerpts from the second volume of the pope’s book on Jesus made the rounds last week, featuring his rejection of the idea that “the Jews” killed Christ, the full text adds another point with important implications for Christian/Jewish relations – in effect, that Christianity “must not concern herself with the conversion of the Jews.”
The comment comes in Benedict XVI’s book Jesus of Nazareth: Holy Week, the full text of which was released today.
**

The comment comes in Benedict XVI’s book Jesus of Nazareth: Holy Week, the full text of which was released today.

**While the pope does not affirm a theory propounded by some theologians holding that the Jews will be saved independently of Christ, experts say, he does clearly suggest the church should not be targeting Jews for conversion efforts.

“Israel is in the hands of God, who will save it ‘as a whole’ at the proper time, when the number of Gentiles is full,” the pope writes. The historical duration of this “proper time,” Benedict says, cannot be calculated.

In terms of the proper Christian attitude in the meantime, Benedict approvingly quotes Cistercian abbess and Biblical writer Hildegard Brem: “The church must not concern herself with the conversion of the Jews, since she must wait for the time fixed for this by God.”**

Although Benedict XVI stipulated in the first volume of his book that he writes as a private theologian rather than authoritatively as head of the Catholic church, his comments inevitably carry weight as indications of the way Benedict is likely to approach these questions as pope.

The question of conversion has long been among the most explosive in the arena of Catholic/Jewish relations. Still today, perceptions in the Jewish world that Christians are targeting them for missionary efforts produce sharply negative reactions.

Benedict XVI acknowledges that the question of “Israel’s mission” in God’s plan has a painful past.

“We realize today with horror how many misunderstandings with grave consequences have weighed down our history,” he writes. Yet, the pope says, “the beginnings of a correct understanding have always been there, waiting to be rediscovered, however deep the shadows.”

The key to that correct understanding, Benedict writes, lies in the Biblical notion of the “times of the Gentiles.”

The charge given by Jesus to carry the Gospel to the ends of the earth, Benedict says, implies a sequence: first the “full number” of the Gentiles comes to the faith, and only then the Jews. He quotes St. Bernard of Clairvaux’s advice to one of his predecessors, Pope Eugene III, that “a determined time has been fixed” for the conversion of the Jews “that cannot be anticipated.”

Benedict says that in the early church, the urgency of evangelization wasn’t based so much on the idea that every human being had to know Christ in order to be saved, but rather on a “grand conception of history,” according to which the Gospel had to reach all the nations in order for the world to fulfill its destiny.

Until God’s plan comes to fruition, Benedict says, the “particular task” of the disciples of Christ is to carry the faith to the Gentiles, not to the Jews.

 

[Brendan]

Sigh,

I wonder how many of the MSM actually read the document

This is the relavant statement

It is easy to understand that the so-called ‘mission to the Jews’ is a very delicate and sensitive matter for Jews because, in their eyes, it involves the very existence of the Jewish people. This question also proves to be awkward for Christians, because for them the universal salvific significance of Jesus Christ and consequently the universal mission of the Church are of fundamental importance. The Church is therefore obliged to view evangelisation to Jews, who believe in the one God, in a different manner from that to people of other religions and world views. In concrete terms this means that the Catholic Church neither conducts nor supports any specific institutional mission work directed towards Jews. While there is a principled rejection of an institutional Jewish mission, Christians are nonetheless called to bear witness to their faith in Jesus Christ also to Jews, although they should do so in a humble and sensitive manner, acknowledging that Jews are bearers of God’s Word, and particularly in view of the great tragedy of the Shoah.

It does not state that there shall be no evangelization of the Jews, in fact, it outlines the conditions for it.

There is no institutional effort, but there is still a call to individual Catholics to bear witness to Christ in a humble and sensitive manner.

In other words, nothing new here.

 

[Vouthon]

Sigh,

I wonder how many of the MSM actually read the document

This is the relavant statement

It does not state that there shall be no evangelization of the Jews, in fact, it outlines the conditions for it.

There is no institutional effort, but there is still a call to individual Catholics to bear witness to Christ in a humble and sensitive manner.

In other words, nothing new here.

Evangelization is distinct from a concerted effort to convert someone. It is a much more complex phenomenon involving dialogue and proclamation.

 

[Brendan]

Evangelization is distinct from a concerted effort to convert someone. It is a much more complex phenomenon involving dialogue and proclamation.

The goal of evangelization is the conversion of someone.

The ‘bearing witness’ called for by the Church does not exclude dialogue. Such dialogue will not happen on the institutional level though, but is called for at the personal level.

 

[Vouthon]

The goal of evangelization is the conversion of someone.

The ‘bearing witness’ called for by the Church does not exclude dialogue. Such dialogue will not happen on the institutional level though, but is called for at the personal level.

Call me a ‘nuance-freak’ but I would say that evangelization is not about “converting someone”. It is about proclaiming the truth of Christ in the sincere hope that others might be receptive to it, in a spirit of love and openness. It is not an assertive attempt to change someone’s mind. To me, proclamation not only includes dialogue but is inseparable from it. Evangelization ultimately respects the integrity of the conscience of (even) an erring person, whereas proselytism (for example) is entirely one-sided and is not concerned at all with a common search for truth, merely the imposition of the truth upon another.

 

[TMC]

Sigh,

I wonder how many of the MSM actually read the document

This is the relavant statement

It does not state that there shall be no evangelization of the Jews, in fact, it outlines the conditions for it.

There is no institutional effort, but there is still a call to individual Catholics to bear witness to Christ in a humble and sensitive manner.

In other words, nothing new here.

I agree that this document is consistent with the Church’s teaching since at least VII, but I wouldn’t say there is nothing new. What is new is that the Church is more clearly expressing the teachings that Jews may be saved without converting, and that the Church does not have “an institutional mission” to convert Jews. I think the clearer statement is appropriate, as there has been some confusion on both of those topics (as evidenced by the many threads on Judaism here on CAF.)

Here is a link to the actual document, for those who may not have seen it:

vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/chrstuni/relations-jews-docs/rc_pc_chrstuni_doc_20151210_ebraismo-nostra-aetate_en.html

 

[Justin_Swanton]

Sigh,

I wonder how many of the MSM actually read the document

I read it.

It is easy to understand that the so-called ‘mission to the Jews’ is a very delicate and sensitive matter for Jews because, in their eyes, it involves the very existence of the Jewish people.

No it doesn’t. A Jew who becomes a Catholic stills remains biologically a Jew. If however his Jewishness consists exclusively of his religion then, fine, he lets it go. He has found something far better that will give him what he ***really ***needs - every supernatural help provided by the Church for the salvation of his soul.

This question also proves to be awkward for Christians, because for them the universal salvific significance of Jesus Christ and consequently the universal mission of the Church are of fundamental importance.

What’s awkward about that? It’s the ***truth ***for heaven’s sake!

The Church is therefore obliged to view evangelisation to Jews, who believe in the one God, in a different manner from that to people of other religions and world views.

Eyewash. Protestants are closer to Catholicism than Judaism: by baptism and their acceptance of the New Testament they are more ‘people of God’ than the Jews are, yet who is looking on ***them ***in a different manner? What of CA’s entire apologetics programme?

In concrete terms this means that the Catholic Church neither conducts nor supports any specific institutional mission work directed towards Jews.

Then CA can shut down its entire programme aimed at the conversion of protestants.

While there is a principled rejection of an institutional Jewish mission, Christians are nonetheless called to bear witness to their faith in Jesus Christ also to Jews, although they should do so in a humble and sensitive manner, acknowledging that Jews are bearers of God’s Word, and particularly in view of the great tragedy of the Shoah.

What has the Shoah got to do with us? We didn’t herd the Jews into the gas chambers. The Nazis did, and our countries lost millions of people overcoming them. And what precisely does ‘humble’ and ‘sensitive’ mean? I believe that only Catholicism has the fullness of God’s revelation and the supernatural means God has given to help us on our road to heaven. The Jews, like the Protestants, Moslems, and other beliefs, have some good and true elements in their religion, but these are mixed with erroneous ideas and have all the inadequacy of a religion bereft of so many vital doctrines. I’ve had a number of Jewish friends, and I don’t view them differently from any other non-catholic religion. Does that make me ‘arrogant’ and ‘insensitive’?

 

[Peebo]

Sigh,

I wonder how many of the MSM actually read the document

This is the relavant statement

It does not state that there shall be no evangelization of the Jews, in fact, it outlines the conditions for it.

There is no institutional effort, but there is still a call to individual Catholics to bear witness to Christ in a humble and sensitive manner.

In other words, nothing new here.

Actually there is something new…The document coincided with the 50th anniversary of a revolutionary Vatican statement that repudiated the concept of collective Jewish guilt for Jesus’ death and launched a theological dialogue that traditionalists have rejected.
They feel there should be a so-called “Jewish mission” to convert Jews because they did not accept Jesus as the Messiah, and were therefore bound to be displeased by the new official stance on conversion, a senior Vatican official said.
“In concrete terms this means that the Catholic Church neither conducts nor supports any specific institutional mission work directed towards Jews,” said the document, adding that there was a “principled rejection of an institutional Jewish mission”.
A Vatican expert in Catholic-Jewish dialogue said it was the first time a repudiation of active conversion of Jews was so clearly stated in a Vatican document.

 

[Mac_Murchaidh]

I agree that this document is consistent with the Church’s teaching since at least VII, but I wouldn’t say there is nothing new. What is new is that the Church is more clearly expressing the teachings that Jews may be saved without converting, and that the Church does not have “an institutional mission” to convert Jews. I think the clearer statement is appropriate, as there has been some confusion on both of those topics (as evidenced by the many threads on Judaism here on CAF.)

You’re right, the Church does not have “an institutional mission” to seek the CORPORATE conversion of the Jewish people.

But the Church nowhere states nor expresses that Jews may be saved without converting to the Catholic faith. To say that merely observing the Old Covenant and the Mosaic Law is salvific is heretical. Anyone, whether layman or cardinal, who holds such a belief, has fallen into heresy and error.

 

[Genesis315]

Call me a ‘nuance-freak’ but I would say that evangelization is not about “converting someone”. It is about proclaiming the truth of Christ in the sincere hope that others might be receptive to it, in a spirit of love and openness. It is not an assertive attempt to change someone’s mind. To me, proclamation not only includes dialogue but is inseparable from it. Evangelization ultimately respects the integrity of the conscience of (even) an erring person, whereas proselytism (for example) is entirely one-sided and is not concerned at all with a common search for truth, merely the imposition of the truth upon another.

The CDF issues a note about this very topic a while back and this is not how it defines evangelization and proselytism as far as I can tell. In fact, one of the reasons it was published was to correct “a growing confusion which leads many to leave the missionary command of the Lord unheard and ineffective.” In listing elements of this confusion, it included the erroneous idea that legitimate evangelization is only “to present one’s own ideas and to invite people to act according to their consciences, without aiming at their conversion to Christ and to the Catholic faith.” Our Lord did not tell the Apostles to go forth to all the nations and just proclaim what He said, but rather to actually observe what He taught–to actually teach people to change their behavior. Granted, this can take many forms, but the hoped for goal must be conversion.

Proselytism, on the other hand, is defined as “the promotion of a religion by using means, and for motives, contrary to the spirit of the Gospel; that is, which do not safeguard the freedom and dignity of the human person.” It basically is coercion, rather than persuasion. But real persuasion is good–it’s what all the Apostles did and what missionaries have done for 2000 years.

Here’s the whole document:
vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20071203_nota-evangelizzazione_en.html

 

[Genesis315]

As has been mentioned, the document right up front says it is not a document of the Magisterium or even a doctrinal document, but a starting point for discussion.

That being said it actually has a decent explanation of the meaning of the old covenant not being revoked by Christ (especially concerning the covenant with Abraham and the olive tree metaphor).

As for institutional mission, this isn’t really new. The conversion of the Jews is often seen in eschatological terms. For example, St. Bernard encouraged Pope Bl. Eugene III’s institutional mission to everyone else, but not the Jews:
St. Bernard:

It is important, therefore, for you to do what you can so that unbelievers may be converted to the faith, that converts may not turn away, that those who have turned away may return; moreover, that the perverse may be directed toward righteousness, the corrupted called back to the truth, and the corruptors refuted by invincible arguments so that they either correct their error, if that be possible, or, if it is not, that they lose their authority and the means of corrupting others. And you must not completely neglect the worst kind of fools; by this I mean heretics and schismatics, for these are the corrupted and the corruptors. Like dogs they tear apart; like foxes they deceive. You should make the greatest effort either to correct such men lest they perish, or restrain them lest they destroy others. Granted, time excuses you from dealing with the Jews: they have their boundary which cannot be passed. The full number of the Gentiles must come in first.

What’s ironic is that some bishops are pushing for a revision of a prayer that implies the blindness or veil that Israel experiences preventing them from recognizing their Messiah, but that is the very concept that justifies the Church not having an “institutional mission” to the Jews. Although, as St. Thomas says in his commentary on Romans, this blindness is not universal, as there are Jewish converts in every age.

 

[Vouthon]

In listing elements of this confusion, it included the erroneous idea that legitimate evangelization is only “to present one’s own ideas and to invite people to act according to their consciences, without aiming at their conversion to Christ and to the Catholic faith.” Our Lord did not tell the Apostles to go forth to all the nations and just proclaim what He said, but rather to actually observe what He taught–to actually teach people to change their behavior.

Here’s the whole document:
vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20071203_nota-evangelizzazione_en.html

That’s not quite what I said. I stated:

It is about proclaiming the truth of Christ in the sincere hope that others might be receptive to it, in a spirit of love and openness. It is not an assertive attempt to change someone’s mind.

Yes we should have the “hope” of conversion, of a seed being planted by our efforts in cooperation with the grace of God, and I think you’ll find I stated that above.

The document you quoted is warning against relativism, which is not at all what I said.

I’m not denying that we should proclaim Christ in the hope of opening the hearts of others to the saving grace of God.

Evangelization is about a common search for truth, in which we nurture people towards fullness in Christ, while respecting their freedom and the truth they already have, which in itself is ordained towards Christ.

I can understand why you might think I’m saying the same as in the above but if you read closely what I said I think you’ll find that I’m not.
I believe that how we present our teaching in this regard is very important.

 

[TMC]

You’re right, the Church does not have “an institutional mission” to seek the CORPORATE conversion of the Jewish people.

But the Church nowhere states nor expresses that Jews may be saved without converting to the Catholic faith. To say that merely observing the Old Covenant and the Mosaic Law is salvific is heretical. Anyone, whether layman or cardinal, who holds such a belief, has fallen into heresy and error.

Yes, the Church does state that Jews can be saved without converting, and saying so is not heretical. It is right in this document, which is a Church document. It is also expressed other places, including Lumen Gentium.

 

[phil19034]

I highly recommend listing to “The Making of a Jewish Nun” CD from Lighthouse Catholic Media.

lighthousecatholicmedia.org/store/title/the-making-of-a-jewish-nun?promoCode=104130

Mother Miriam of the Lamb of God (formerly Rosalind Moss) gives a great testimony to her life and answers some questions at the end regarding Evangelization towards the Jews.

Also - we have to remember that historically (before the New Evangelization) the Catholic Church formally evangelized two different ways:

1. via missionaries to the nations
2. via Priests via pastoral sermons & homilies and one-on-one spiritual direction.

I’m not including lay evangelization, simply institutional evangelization. The Church does not institutionally evangelize the Jews, but we are still called to bare witness to them and talk to them about our believes.

Also, for Jewish Converts and for interfaith marriages between Catholics and Jews, there is the Hebrew Catholics (which have been under the watch of Cardinal Burke) - hebrewcatholic.net

God Bless!

 

[Vouthon]

In his interview with Peter Seewald, Pope Benedict XVI stated that, with reference to the liturgy, "we do not pray directly for the conversion of the Jews in a missionary sense, but that the Lord might hasten the historic hour in which we will all be united."

This of course does not mean that individual Jews will not, through the grace of God, be made open to the fullness of truth in Christ and that we should not direct them towards that fullness if they are heading in this direction but it is very clear that Christians are not allowed to target Jews for missionary efforts or purposes.

Proclaim what we believe with humility and sensitivity to Jews, yes, but no explicit missionary activity.

 

[jaimeleglise]

I don’t understand this. Doesn’t the Jewish people have the right to hear the Good News?

 

[Mac_Murchaidh]

Yes, the Church does state that Jews can be saved without converting, and saying so is not heretical. It is right in this document, which is a Church document. It is also expressed other places, including Lumen Gentium.

This is not a Church document. It is a document produced by a committee without a shred of magisterial authority. And the document itself explicitly states it is neither a magisterial document nor a doctrinal document.

Lumen Gentium has said no such thing. Not a single line in any document issued by the Second Vatican Council teaches heresy. And that, my friend, is heresy.