challenge question, who can answer this

[rinnie]

There is only One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church rinnie. Whatever they’ll tell you, there’s only One. Whether its capital “C” or lower case “c” ‘cause both still possess’ the same meaning. Gk. “katholikos”(universal). It’s not a proper noun when we use “Catholic” than “catholic”.

I agree with this completely. I just can see the more i ask questions about the Catholic Apostolic Church that all everone does is confirm what i do believe. You know when a person is Catholic is seems that they never really leave the Church. Oh they may for awhile but if they do its not because they are searching, its because either they didnt like that the church wouldnt let them do whatever they wanted and looked the other way. Or they were just young and didnt find the time. But in the end it seems 90% go back. It is the true going home in this world. IT has to be just has to be because it the truth. And because it says in the bible it is the only true Church and it will prevail. It has it will and it does. And i guess it goes back to the beginning of every time I ask a question I never get a answer that makes sense. I mean no offense no matter who you are, and how you understand the bible. And it is our guide. When i ask a question no one can answer it. But untill some can show me in the bible where there are 2 Catholic churchs which is what my answer seems to be, there is only one answer. There is only one true Catholic Church. Now who are we to follow in the Catholic Church, i have to say the Pope because again the important questions do have answers and God appointed Peter to hand down the church. Again how can anyone say thats a lie. But im not hard headed but if all of this is not true why did God do it that way. I know that we can read the bible and make it be whatever we want, but again, this thread was all about that. And when people did that it didnt make sense. But again what i was taught on one could say no, how in the world did you come up with that, Again it had to have come from the Holy Spirt thru the Pope because it makes sense.

 

[2ndGen]

There is only One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church rinnie. Whatever they’ll tell you, there’s only One. Whether its capital “C” or lower case “c” ‘cause both still possess’ the same meaning. Gk. “katholikos”(universal). It’s not a proper noun when we use “Catholic” than “catholic”.

youtube.com/watch?v=oGaHpexp2-4

:bowdown2:

 

[2ndGen]

I agree with this completely. I just can see the more i ask questions about the Catholic Apostolic Church that all everone does is confirm what i do believe. You know when a person is Catholic is seems that they never really leave the Church. Oh they may for awhile but if they do its not because they are searching, its because either they didnt like that the church wouldnt let them do whatever they wanted and looked the other way. Or they were just young and didnt find the time. But in the end it seems 90% go back. It is the true going home in this world. IT has to be just has to be because it the truth. And because it says in the bible it is the only true Church and it will prevail. It has it will and it does. And i guess it goes back to the beginning of every time I ask a question I never get a answer that makes sense. I mean no offense no matter who you are, and how you understand the bible. And it is our guide. When i ask a question no one can answer it. But untill some can show me in the bible where there are 2 Catholic churchs which is what my answer seems to be, there is only one answer. There is only one true Catholic Church. Now who are we to follow in the Catholic Church, i have to say the Pope because again the important questions do have answers and God appointed Peter to hand down the church. Again how can anyone say thats a lie. But im not hard headed but if all of this is not true why did God do it that way. I know that we can read the bible and make it be whatever we want, but again, this thread was all about that. And when people did that it didnt make sense. But again what i was taught on one could say no, how in the world did you come up with that, Again it had to have come from the Holy Spirt thru the Pope because it makes sense.

Which leads to another question…

How many Catholics that leave Catholicism actually go through the troubles of formally renouncing there faith to The Church in The Church’s official manner?

Maybe to them it doesn’t matter and they don’t do it because they don’t beleive “in” The Church anymore, but how many actually walk into a/their Church and say “I quit” and “where do I sign”?

 

[JRKH]

Which leads to another question…

How many Catholics that leave Catholicism actually go through the troubles of formally renouncing there faith to The Church in The Church’s official manner?

Maybe to them it doesn’t matter and they don’t do it because they don’t beleive “in” The Church anymore, but how many actually walk into a/their Church and say “I quit” and “where do I sign”?

I left the church for a good many years but I never “formally” quit. First of all I never knew there was a formal process for quitting and secondly, since I wasn’t asked if I wanted to join (infant baptism) I wouldn’t see the need to ask (or declare formally) to leave.

Peace
James

 

[Uncle_Norbert]

I left the church for a good many years but I never “formally” quit. First of all I never knew there was a formal process for quitting and secondly, since I wasn’t asked if I wanted to join (infant baptism) I wouldn’t see the need to ask (or declare formally) to leave.

Peace
James

Interesting point. I always considered that if you officially joined another church, it was automatic. Then again, to go and “offically quit” the Catholic Church struck me as more a cry for attention (like someone saying they’re going to commit suicide) than actually wanting to leave the Church.

 

[rinnie]

Again, When have you ever ever heard someone say i quit because the Catholic Church was teaching me lies, or their truth didnt ring true with the bible. I mean sure you get these people who say the Church didnt make me feel this or that. Well no one can make you feel this or that. Its all from inside. But show me a Catholic that can say they left the Church because it didnt teach the truth. I have never seen it yet. And then if they do, then tell me what they lied to you about. And what Church had proof and confirmed what you said. Usually these people still havent found the RIGHT church yet. And one thing about the Catholic Church. at least every one i have ever went to, they dont come up and grab you and say, who are you , where are you from, If you want to be a part of it you are welcome. There are always ways to get involved. If you dont or arent ready they dont push you. They dont get into your business.

 

[lizzy_bird]

they make their own interpretation of the Bible. They can then easily explain away much of Catholic teaching such as what Jesus meant when saying “You must eat my body and drink my blood.”

 

[paidion]

Y’all are missing it…

The whole point in stating the differences between “Catholic” and “catholic” was to describe how many folks outside the Roman Catholic church view the two and why they don’t have a problem using the Apostles’ Creed, etc. Whether one agrees with the premise or not, that distinction is commonly used.

If one is trying to evangelize the “lost”, it helps to speak their language…

If one only cares about being “right” then I guess the above doesn’t matter much.

How many go to the Church because of being argued and bashed to it?

 

[rinnie]

they make their own interpretation of the Bible. They can then easily explain away much of Catholic teaching such as what Jesus meant when saying “You must eat my body and drink my blood.”

But see thats just it, they tell us what we think, and what we do. Then when we say no this is what it means then they fight with us. But again back to repeating myself we can tell them what that means, and we dont know everything but we go to the church and they explain things, AND THEY MAKE SENSE. the Church Makes sense. These people who do their own interpretation dont. I mean like we worship idols. If i did why would i lie about it. I dont worship the Blessed Mother, but do i love her yes, Do i pray and ask her to pray for me yes. What is wrong with that. other religions can ask everyone else to pray for them but when we go to the saints we are praying to false Gods. Go figure. And again if you want to know what a Catholic believes dont ask a Catholic because i guess we dont know. But ask anyone else they will again do their interpretation of the Catholic Religon for you too. And again they are wrong. But ask some where does it say that again you never hear from them again. Like this post where in the bible does it say there are 2 Catholic churches. No one can answer that. And who came up with it.

 

[slyboots]

Your post shows me that the only things that Protestants knowis what they “don’t” believe in.

Oh sorry.
They believe in Believer’s baptism. You must be able to choose baptism for yourself. And re-baptism when needed.
They believe in Hell. Big time. With enthusiasm. And Catholics are certainly going there.
They believe in Heaven. No Catholics allowed.
They believe Christ died and rose form the dead. Ding, Ding, Ding!!! We have an agreement in that.
There’s a jillion things they believe in which they would tell you come directly from the Bible. Solo Scriptura, y’all.
Nevermind that solo scriptura isn’t biblical. Or that we have no record of people being re-baptized. Or that one has to choose for one’s self to be baptized. Or that Heaven is not the sole place of repose of protestants. Or Hell the place of repose for Catholics.

 

[paidion]

How can any religion, that goes by the bible not believe in the catholic church.

If one believes the Scriptures, but does not have the “fullness of faith” because one does not partake of the Eucharist or follow the Traditions, then what do you expect? Why would one believe in the catholic church?

And if Scripture alone was enough to convince anyone of the truth, then what’s the problem with “sola scriptura” or “solo scriptura”?

shalom

 

[2ndGen]

Oh sorry.
They believe in Believer’s baptism. You must be able to choose baptism for yourself. And re-baptism when needed.
They believe in Hell. Big time. With enthusiasm. And Catholics are certainly going there.
They believe in Heaven. No Catholics allowed.
They believe Christ died and rose form the dead. Ding, Ding, Ding!!! We have an agreement in that.
There’s a jillion things they believe in which they would tell you come directly from the Bible. Solo Scriptura, y’all.
Nevermind that solo scriptura isn’t biblical. Or that we have no record of people being re-baptized. Or that one has to choose for one’s self to be baptized. Or that Heaven is not the sole place of repose of protestants. Or Hell the place of repose for Catholics.

 

[2ndGen]

The fact is, who better to tell us about a Stephen King novel than Stephen King himself?

Same goes with The Holy Bible.

Who better to tell us what we are supposed to get out of it than The Church that God chose to reveal it to us?

 

[scott1228]

Let’s turn this question around, just to make a point.

How can you read the Bible and still make the case for private interpretation and the multiplication of denominations?

Read 1st Corinthians and tell me that this is the situation St. Paul wanted.

Not only that, but take a look at all the denominations and their beliefs. Some allow divorce and remarriage, some don’t. Some say abortion is allowable, some don’t. Some say homosexual acts are fine, some do not.

Same question. If you think private interpretation is enough, how do you justify all these churches with diverging views of morality? Unless you think that these issues are not important, but then again, if you read the Bible, they seem to be.

 

[rinnie]

Sometimes i think that there are just certain people who can see, and others or cant. Its not about being right its about the truth.

I feel that in Church yesterday I had a revelation or something. You know how you can read the bible a hundred times but every time you read it you see it for the first time. But you have read it a million times, had to of, but it was just revealed to you. Its like the more you read it the more you learn. And then other times its just the same ole same ole. Does anyone know what i mean. But i really am trying to pick up on the 2 ways at seeing the catholic church im just not there yet. But if its in there i will find it.

 

[scott1228]

Yes, that happens to me quite often.

That is why I read the sunday readings on the us bishops web site every week before church, also so I know what is going on in case baby happens to cry right then!

usccb.org/nab/

I think for Catholics, the Church is the Church. We know what the Apostle’s Creed refers to.

For others, I think that they have to find a way to feel comfortable with it because it obviously is historical.

 

[paidion]

Sometimes i think that there are just certain people who can see, and others or cant. Its not about being right its about the truth.

I feel that in Church yesterday I had a revelation or something. You know how you can read the bible a hundred times but every time you read it you see it for the first time. But you have read it a million times, had to of, but it was just revealed to you. Its like the more you read it the more you learn. And then other times its just the same ole same ole. Does anyone know what i mean. But i really am trying to pick up on the 2 ways at seeing the catholic church im just not there yet. But if its in there i will find it.

If I read you correctly, I’d say you’re on the right track. G-d often opens new understandings to me in the Scriptures. Not to say I get new interpretations, but that I understand things a little better… bit by bit. And I do have to admit, I’ve not found much new in the book of Numbers lately )

 

[rinnie]

If I read you correctly, I’d say you’re on the right track. G-d often opens new understandings to me in the Scriptures. Not to say I get new interpretations, but that I understand things a little better… bit by bit. And I do have to admit, I’ve not found much new in the book of Numbers lately )

Yes See as a child i went to a Catholic school. We never read the bible. What i mean is we never quoted scripture. So when people would ask me something i would say i dont know. But i know its in there. I will find it. Now here is the wild part, sometimes i will open the Bible and there it is. Other times i have to really find it. Its like i try to explain to people the Catholic Church, the mass Part is like bible study. You have the reading and Father discusses it. Well when you have heard this from birth its in there, you just dont know it. Then times in your life its like a computer you have to boot it up. No one can tell me any scripture i have never heard before. Its just now that im older is means something now. you know what i mean. Or its like emergency money now you need it. You have never been without. But you are just now learning that. Does that make any sense. Im horrible at making my point sometimes.

 

[inchrist101]

Ok here it is guys. Can someone give me a straight answer. How can any religion, that goes by the bible not believe in the catholic church.

Rinnie as a former Catholic I will give you an honest answer expecting of course that many responses will contain the usual “For crying out loud”, “God Bless you but you are wrong”, “Oh Please” etc. etc. And of course don’ forget the typical bolded and all uppercase words. But here goes.

I believe the Bible points directly to the catholic church. Catholic meaning universal. The word catholic lower case “c” is just a synonym for universal and was used very early in our history to describe Jesus church. And yes way before Constantine used the term, which is contrary to what some protestants may say but they are wrong. The early church Fathers wanted to make sure everyone knew that it was open to anyone professing Jesus as their savior. (Essentially) Unlike the Jewish religion which really didn’t and doesn’t make a habit out of trying to convert people like Christians do.

The catholic Bible is no different than any other Bible with respect to what is written in the Gospels, the Pauline epistles, Revelations, Peter 1 & 2 etc. etc. It’s different in the OT in that the catholic Bible uses the english translation from Latin from Hebrew. But essentially the meaning is the same. Where the catholic Bible differs is more in the accepted books and what is considered true cannon. The catholic Bible adds the books of the apocrypha which doesn’t bother me because they contain some really good reading. Although some seem to contradict the Gospels but that’s a different argument. Bibles today are usually split into translations with thought-based being on one end and word for word on the other. You can argue that some bibles use different sets of codexes which is where some people get irritated with NIV. But NIV still footnotes those sections and verses to give the reader a sense of what other manuscripts say. Personally I’ve read many translations including the catholic version and I find that at the end of the day they all say the same thing. I prefer the NLT study version because of the simpler English and the study notes are fantastic. Plus the OT is translated directly from the original Hebrew Bible and not the septuagint. But it’s in the study notes where in my personal experience I have found the differences to be with a catholic Bible vs non-catholic. The catholic Bible will preach exactly what their interpretation is of the verses. If you look at ESV which is more Protestant-based the study notes are very Protestant.

If you do a good review of church history as I’ve done simply to learn where from we came then you will find many interesting facts about the development of the church over the many centuries since it first started in Jerusalem at Pentacost. To save time and space, basically when Constantine took over Rome and declared Christianity to be accepted he ended up appointing 5 arch-bishops to oversee the 5 major Roman provinces including Rome herself. After assuming the title Pontificus Maximus the Arch-Bishop of Rome met with much scrutiny from the remaining 4 arch-bishops which resulted as we all know in the great schism. After this the church in Rome took on the title Roman Catholic. Catholic with an uppercase C. The argument for a pope can be handled in a different conversation.

So if you ask someone does the Bible point to the catholic church, that is the universal church of Jesus, then yes it does. But it does not point to the Roman Catholic church. Forget the argument that the Roman Catholic is the original church of Jesus because it’s not. The church was not founded in Rome. It’s a part of the catholic church just like any Christian church is.

So go ahead and fire away I’m sure you’re chomping at the bit. Just try to keep it in good spirits. And when in doubt ask God to speak through you.

PEACE and GOD Bless

 

[rinnie]

NO I would never want to do that. And as a former Catholic you know that we are not to do that. We are to respect other beliefs, but in turn not let them turn us away from ours.

ok here is what i was taught. The church is one. She acknowledges one Lord, confesses one faith is born of one baptism forms only one body is given life by one spirit. (cf.eph 4:3-5

The Church is holy Most holy God is her author, Christ is her bridegroom gave himself up to make her holy.

The Church is catholic, she proclaims the fullness of the faith.

The church us apostolic, She is built on a lasting foundation. The twelve apostles of the lamb rev.21:14. She is indestructible cf:mt16:18 She is upheld infallibly in the truth Christ governs her through Peter and the other apostles.who are present in their sucessors, the pope and the college of bishops.

the ONE TRUE CHURCH needs to be all of these

The sole church of Christ which in the creed we profess to be one holy catholic and apostolic which is governed by the sucessor of Peter and by the Bishops in communion with him. Nevertheless many elements of sanctification and of truth are found outside of is visible confines.

Now the way i was taught if you read the gospel the true Church must have all of these. The Roman Catholic Church is the only church that i know of that have all of these.

The way i understand Catholic to mean is for everyone. Not every church. One true church, see what i mean. To say every church is catholic means that it has to have all of the above. If all of the churches did this then we would be what Jesus wanted. All of us to be united in one Church. We wouldnt argue about your church or mine or the neighbors. We really would be universal One. Like it was when he left it to Peter. And the bible tells you that. That the Church will prevail. It will be the last standing. It was the first and it will be the last.

But please if i insulted or hurt you i dont mean to. Its just i cant see when its says universal means to separate Catholic to catholic little c big c. the one true church must have all.

But may i ask you why you left the church? if you dont want to say and its none of my business i understand. But was it personal or the teachings that you had a problem with. Either way God Bless you and thankx for trying. But im so sorry i still dont feel i got a answer that makes sense yet.