Child I Babysit is Hitting Others

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pensmama87

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I know it’s not the most unheard of thing in the world for kids to hit each other when they are frustrated, especially when they are young. But I need help figuring out if what I’m seeing here is unusual, and how to go about fixing it (or if I should quit babysitting for this child.)

About 6-8 weeks ago, the 3.5 year old I babysit about 35 hours a week began hitting or otherwise physically lashing out. At least once a day, he slaps, punches, kicks, shoves, or pinches either his older brother, who I watch after school, or one of kids (one is the same age he is, my younger is 20 months old). At first it was usually in response to some kind of direct provoking - a toy was grabbed away, his block tower got knocked down - but now it seems that the littlest thing will set him off. The usual consequence is a time-out, then a required apology. My sense is that at home there is very little discipline of any kind.

Here are a few things that concern me, besides the behavior itself:
  1. He now only does it if he thinks I can’t see him.
  2. When I tell him to go to the time-out spot, he denies wrongdoing (this could actually be a sign of developmental progress, but no idea how to address it.)
  3. He rolls his eyes at me, turns his back, and yells things at me like, “you’re not the boss!” These are not behaviors I’m keen on my kids seeing and repeating.
  4. If he was going through a growth spurt or some other “grumpy” stage, I’d have expected it to end by now. If anything, the behavior is escalating.
One possibility I’ve considered is just how much less physical activity goes on here. Any day that is above 25 degrees (F) and not sopping wet I take the kids outside. I also play physical activity games with them, they have a large well childproofed area to run in inside, and I’ve taken them a few times to an indoor playground. The other kids seem to be coping well with that, but it doesn’t seem to be helping with this hitting issue. (Also, and this may be affecting my outlook unfairly because it only happened once on my watch, but this child bit my same-aged son over the summer. No blood drawn, but visible teethmarks.)

I’ve also been teaching about sharing and turn-taking, and I use a timer for turns with specific items that seem to be the toy “du jour.”

Other things I can try? Is this developmentally normal? My son who is the same age hardly ever hits, though he did a bit more when he was younger. I have had other concerns about this child’s development, but don’t know if this could be related to any of those.

Right now the money is really important, but I’m frustrated enough that I’m thinking about giving the parents my notice. Even if it developmentally normal, it’s not fun watching someone else’s kid hit yours and feeling like what you can do to address it isn’t enough.
 
Before you think about giving them notice, have you told them that he has started doing this? Just tell them that you thought they would probably want to know he was doing this. Tell them that you have put him in time out but that it isn’t really helping much, that you really want it to stop altogether. If they respond that they know, or act like it’s no big deal, then rethink watching him, because as you say, you do not want your own children thinking this behavior is okay.
 
Before you think about giving them notice, have you told them that he has started doing this? Just tell them that you thought they would probably want to know he was doing this. Tell them that you have put him in time out but that it isn’t really helping much, that you really want it to stop altogether. If they respond that they know, or act like it’s no big deal, then rethink watching him, because as you say, you do not want your own children thinking this behavior is okay.
Yes, they do know. They said they had a “big talk” with him a few weeks ago (and after that it did lessen for a few days before starting up again). Apparently he is doing it at home, too, but I have made sure they know it is happening here. Sorry, that would have been important info to include in the OP!

I probably could offer some kind of warning to them before actually giving notice - “Hey, this is getting worse instead of better, and if it continues I’m not going to be able to continue babysitting for you.” One thing I don’t know is if they realize that I think it’s serious. I have been upfront with them that I don’t like it and don’t want it to continue, but I haven’t given any kind of ultimatum yet - just kept them informed on what’s been happening and how I’ve been trying to correct it.
 
He may improve when spring comes and he can get more outdoor time, but will you last that long?

I wonder if (on some subconscious level) he realizes that you’re in a weakened state due to your pregnancy and he feels like he can get away with more. I never had this sort of situation with the toddler I babysat when my oldest was a toddler, but my oldest herself was very difficult to manage when she was a toddler and I was pregnant and also after her baby brother was born. It was like night and day dealing with her before I got pregnant and after–before the pregnancy, I felt like I had everything well in hand, but as soon as I got pregnant, everything was too much for me. It might be that with your pregnancy, either he’s pushing the boundaries, or you might be just a little slower at averting trouble than you used to be.

Good luck!
 
You may be on to something - that wonderful all-day queasy feeling showed up today! :o

My attitude has kind of been souring on these kids since before I was pregnant (after the honeymoon period of babysitting wore off, I suppose :p), but I kind of wanted to stick it out until baby was born. But the kids do have some really unfortunate habits and are both emotionally immature for their ages, and I don’t like what my kids are picking up from them. I know I can’t keep the world out forever, but I feel like starting out with younger kids might be better. They’re more hands-on, but then they learn my rules and expectations from the start. For what amounts to full-time care, that matters to me a lot.
 
You may be on to something - that wonderful all-day queasy feeling showed up today! :o

My attitude has kind of been souring on these kids since before I was pregnant (after the honeymoon period of babysitting wore off, I suppose :p), but I kind of wanted to stick it out until baby was born. But the kids do have some really unfortunate habits and are both emotionally immature for their ages, and I don’t like what my kids are picking up from them. I know I can’t keep the world out forever, but I feel like starting out with younger kids might be better. They’re more hands-on, but then they learn my rules and expectations from the start. For what amounts to full-time care, that matters to me a lot.
30 day notice?

If you can financially swing it, of course.
 
I know it’s not the most unheard of thing in the world for kids to hit each other when they are frustrated, especially when they are young. But I need help figuring out if what I’m seeing here is unusual, and how to go about fixing it (or if I should quit babysitting for this child.)

About 6-8 weeks ago, the 3.5 year old I babysit about 35 hours a week began hitting or otherwise physically lashing out. At least once a day, he slaps, punches, kicks, shoves, or pinches either his older brother, who I watch after school, or one of kids (one is the same age he is, my younger is 20 months old). At first it was usually in response to some kind of direct provoking - a toy was grabbed away, his block tower got knocked down - but now it seems that the littlest thing will set him off. The usual consequence is a time-out, then a required apology. My sense is that at home there is very little discipline of any kind.

Here are a few things that concern me, besides the behavior itself:
  1. He now only does it if he thinks I can’t see him.
  2. When I tell him to go to the time-out spot, he denies wrongdoing (this could actually be a sign of developmental progress, but no idea how to address it.)
  3. He rolls his eyes at me, turns his back, and yells things at me like, “you’re not the boss!” These are not behaviors I’m keen on my kids seeing and repeating.
  4. If he was going through a growth spurt or some other “grumpy” stage, I’d have expected it to end by now. If anything, the behavior is escalating.
One possibility I’ve considered is just how much less physical activity goes on here. Any day that is above 25 degrees (F) and not sopping wet I take the kids outside. I also play physical activity games with them, they have a large well childproofed area to run in inside, and I’ve taken them a few times to an indoor playground. The other kids seem to be coping well with that, but it doesn’t seem to be helping with this hitting issue. (Also, and this may be affecting my outlook unfairly because it only happened once on my watch, but this child bit my same-aged son over the summer. No blood drawn, but visible teethmarks.)

I’ve also been teaching about sharing and turn-taking, and I use a timer for turns with specific items that seem to be the toy “du jour.”

Other things I can try? Is this developmentally normal? My son who is the same age hardly ever hits, though he did a bit more when he was younger. I have had other concerns about this child’s development, but don’t know if this could be related to any of those.

Right now the money is really important, but I’m frustrated enough that I’m thinking about giving the parents my notice. Even if it developmentally normal, it’s not fun watching someone else’s kid hit yours and feeling like what you can do to address it isn’t enough.
You know, I am a man who stays home with my kids and the idea comes up every once in a while if I would watch others. Once I was even asked to open a corporate day care for my wife’s work. Now, my situation has other factors in it. I am a man, which is just asking for trouble with childcare. And I would never be able to adequately care for other kids when it came to my own children because of things like you describe. I would be defensive with my own kids and obviously care for them more, and better. But the moment other kids behavior started influencing my kids, I would be out with zero notice. Because it would not be right for me to agree to protect, educate, and love a child I thought was damaging my family. And honestly that is what we should agree to do when we watch other’s children.
 
30 day notice?

If you can financially swing it, of course.
2 weeks is all I would give if it got to the point I couldn’t do it anymore. It’s a job after all. No need to drag it out any longer. 🙂
 
He’s doing it because he gets away with it at home. Of course, they’re not going to say that. I found when watching children that parents who choose to leave their children with someone else (for whatever reason) deep down feel bad about it. And they tend to “let things go” to keep peace in the few hours they have together. Two weeks notice. yup.
It will send a powerful message to the others. Those who don’t play well with others? Don’t get to play anymore. Also, that you are not willing to cave on standards for the $$.
God bless you!
 
Perhaps I agree with the 2 weeks as well. But I would cringe doing it. But it would not be fair to a family who depends on the daycare for employment to just drop them. But that would be a long uncomfortable 2 weeks in my house. And you should also be aware that it seems TONS of complaints could come from that 2 weeks. I’m not sure I would expose my family to that risk. And before you say “they are not the type of people who would do that” I would just tell you that the courts are FULL of the type of people who would not do that.
I’d videotape the entire two weeks…
 
Perhaps I agree with the 2 weeks as well. But I would cringe doing it. But it would not be fair to a family who depends on the daycare for employment to just drop them. But that would be a long uncomfortable 2 weeks in my house. And you should also be aware that it seems TONS of complaints could come from that 2 weeks. I’m not sure I would expose my family to that risk. And before you say “they are not the type of people who would do that” I would just tell you that the courts are FULL of the type of people who would not do that.
I’d videotape the entire two weeks…
Very true. but it can itself be a powerful motivator to get the child to understand that while at her house? what she says is law. She will not tolerate the hitting, and they as parents stand with her in this. It could happen…
:whistle:
 
…“Hey, this is getting worse instead of better, and if it continues I’m not going to be able to continue babysitting for you”…
Yep. Not “some kind of warning,” but rather a very clear warning that this cannot and will not be tolerated. I would include a date by which the problem needs to have cleared up or the child will not be accepted as a client any more. (Not “if he isn’t better in two weeks, I’ll give you 30 days notice,” but “If within two weeks his acting out doesn’t come down to level typical for his age group and something he no longer tries to get away with when my back is turned, you’ll have two weeks at most to find something else for him. If he ramps it up, I may unfortunately have to suspend him that same day, because I am very concerned about what he might do” or something like that.)

This is what a larger child-care provider would be forced to do. They’d be protecting their other clients and their reputation as a provider that keeps all their children safe. You are protecting your own children and your reputation with them as someone who protects them. That is fine. It is what adults are supposed to do for the children who trust them to take good care of them.
 
You know, I am a man who stays home with my kids and the idea comes up every once in a while if I would watch others. Once I was even asked to open a corporate day care for my wife’s work. Now, my situation has other factors in it. I am a man, which is just asking for trouble with childcare. And I would never be able to adequately care for other kids when it came to my own children because of things like you describe. I would be defensive with my own kids and obviously care for them more, and better. But the moment other kids behavior started influencing my kids, I would be out with zero notice. Because it would not be right for me to agree to protect, educate, and love a child I thought was damaging my family. And honestly that is what we should agree to do when we watch other’s children.
Well, that’s why I am curious if what I am dealing with falls under the umbrella of “normal developmental behavior.” The only thing that this kid has done that my kids haven’t is the biting, and that was a one-time incident. Where this differs is frequency - my kids have gotten over their “hitting phases” quickly and while they still argue and fight, they do it with words (another thing I wonder about with development - the other 3.5 year old is not very verbal and doesn’t express himself well at all - he hits first instead of saying, “I don’t like that,” or “Stop.” When he does verbalize frustration, it’s usually just screaming, no words.) But he hasn’t drawn blood, and nothing that he has done is outside the realm of normal kid stuff - it just happens a lot more than either of my kids ever did it. When I first started babysitting, I did turn away a family after their 18 month old attacked my then 12 month old in the face with a wooden block and was positively gleeful when my 12 month old started crying. This situation is not like that.
 
Perhaps I agree with the 2 weeks as well. But I would cringe doing it. But it would not be fair to a family who depends on the daycare for employment to just drop them. But that would be a long uncomfortable 2 weeks in my house. And you should also be aware that it seems TONS of complaints could come from that 2 weeks. I’m not sure I would expose my family to that risk. And before you say “they are not the type of people who would do that” I would just tell you that the courts are FULL of the type of people who would not do that.
I’d videotape the entire two weeks…
I think I’d combine the warning that the behavior has to change with the warning that this talk constitutes warning that he is on probation and could be expelled with no notice, if the violation is bad enough.

It is not a bad idea to videotape your care of other people’s children, but the lack of evidence that you did anything is not proof that the camera was always running. It would only give evidence that yes, this kid was violent with other kids. Usually, though, parents do not have a right to have their childcare provider give them notice when there are behavior problems. It is worth asking with whoever answers this kind of questions in your county, which is probably the inspector for day care centers.

Also, if the OP looks for child care provider resources on the internet, she will turn up things like this that might offer ideas:

kidsgrowth.com/resources/articledetail.cfm?id=851
 
Well, that’s why I am curious if what I am dealing with falls under the umbrella of “normal developmental behavior.” The only thing that this kid has done that my kids haven’t is the biting, and that was a one-time incident. Where this differs is frequency - my kids have gotten over their “hitting phases” quickly and while they still argue and fight, they do it with words (another thing I wonder about with development - the other 3.5 year old is not very verbal and doesn’t express himself well at all - he hits first instead of saying, “I don’t like that,” or “Stop.” When he does verbalize frustration, it’s usually just screaming, no words.) But he hasn’t drawn blood, and nothing that he has done is outside the realm of normal kid stuff - it just happens a lot more than either of my kids ever did it. When I first started babysitting, I did turn away a family after their 18 month old attacked my then 12 month old in the face with a wooden block and was positively gleeful when my 12 month old started crying. This situation is not like that.
I think it’s probably a speech delay thing.

When kids can’t express themselves verbally, they tend to express themselves physically.

Maybe insist on an evaluation? A 3.5-year-old ought to be very verbal.
 
A few years ago, I babysat a few times for a 4 (?) year old that needed a sitter because he’d been booted out of school. (Probably some sort of early intervention public program.)

I was all alone at home at the time (it was school hours for my big kids) so it was just him and me, but I quickly learned why he’d been booted out of school. He was fine as long as he was allowed to roam about and do his own thing, but as soon as I tried to physically direct him toward the potty or snack time, there’d be a fist flying toward my face. That kid had the hardest and fastest right hook I have ever seen, but I eventually learned to make sure that his fist did not connect with my face. There was one episode that still makes me cringe to think about where I took him to the zoo and a kid grabbed at his toy and the kid I was watching punched the grabber in the face. I really, really wish that hadn’t happened but I just wasn’t thinking and moving fast enough.

I never heard what the kid’s exact diagnosis was (speech delay was all I heard), but I strongly suspect autism spectrum.

If pensmama87’s daycare kid is anything like the kid I watched, it would be a kindness to the family to steer them toward evaluation and early intervention. There can be a lot of embarrassment and denial with regard to disabilities.
 
Ask the parents to get the child an evaluation for autism. Hitting and throwing things were my son’s first signs, and praise the Lord for the daycare director who sent us to have him checked out! He went to a therapeutic preschool that helped immediately. Today, my 16-year-old Aspie can fix anything with moving parts and is on his way to university in mechanical engineering. 👍
 
I am not an expert, but I don’t think it’s likely he has an autism spectrum disorder. He really likes to involve me in what he is doing, and doesn’t like playing alone (which unfortunately is a cause for some of the tension because sometimes the other kids want to do what they are doing by themselves, or there is disagreement when they play on what they will do. He doesn’t react well to that.)

He was very snuggly this late afternoon (on really bad days, which today was, I notice he is a lot “sweeter” toward the end of the day - asking for hugs, wanting to sit on my lap while we do a puzzle or watch a movie, etc.) But I made sure I told dad that the hitting couldn’t continue, and that I was giving him two weeks to make significant improvement, and if that didn’t happen then I could no longer provide care. Dad actually seemed like he was expecting it when I told him, and told me he absolutely understood.

Sooooo…we’ll see if there’s some progress. I looked over the link EasterJoy provided about biting, and a lot of that is what I am already doing - just not seeing a lot of progress. I don’t know what the parents will be able to accomplish in this time frame to affect his behavior here. But I’m giving them a shot at it.
 
You said this behavior began 6-8 weeks ago. How long had you been caring for this child before this behavior began?

Has anything changed in the child’s home life? Tension between his parents? New baby?

Is your relationship with the parents close enough to ask if anything has changed at home?

Maybe the child is having an adjustment issue to something.
 
You said this behavior began 6-8 weeks ago. How long had you been caring for this child before this behavior began?

Has anything changed in the child’s home life? Tension between his parents? New baby?

Is your relationship with the parents close enough to ask if anything has changed at home?

Maybe the child is having an adjustment issue to something.
That’s a good thought.
 
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