Children leaving the faith.... a Dad's dilemma

[cerad]

Those of you in this situation can take comfort in the fact that eventually God will solve the problem.

In time you will be in heaven, sitting on your cloud, strumming your golden harp and singing the praises of god over and over and over and over and…

Meanwhile your kids will be burning in hell getting red hot pokers shoved up their bums over and over and over and over and over…

Maybe if you are really lucky God will allow you a break in your monotony by letting you pour vinegar down the throats of your kids when they cry for something to quench their thirst.

Enjoy eternity

 

[HiggDo]

Letting me learn that if I stay up til 4 AM it is hard to get up for work the next day, learning that if I do not budget my money I will be broke, that if I eat bad food I will be fat… sure.

The MOST dangerous thing a person can do is to walk away from God.

Maybe it is that evangelical upbringing, I KNEW that if I sinned and walked away from God - if I died, I would go to hell. I would not have renounced my faith, I knew what the alternative was.

It is odd that I see so many Catholic young people who don’t have that same
“fear of God”.

Thanks for your great replies!

In a short space, attempting to express myself, this is what I was trying to say… We can teach them that eating McDonalds everyday is bad, in fact it is our responsibility, but when they grow up and move out, we can no longer as closely micromanage their lives, nor should we… We can however, to an extent, while they are still under our roofs.

Are you saying that no children of Evangelicals ever walk away from their faith?

I have former Evangelicals in my Diaconate Formation class.

Did I see correctly that you said you were a convert to Catholicism?

I myself am a convert from non-practicing Baptist and Lutheran parents, God called me from the non-religious secular world and I said YES, despite having no religious or faith-based upbringing. I did not know God, but He knew me. So, How can I not trust?

What if walking away from God is part of one’s journey to learn to walk back to him with whole-heartedness? Why does God allow people to do evil in the world, if not only to bring a greater goodness out of it? i.e. The wood of the Cross defeating the wood of Adam’s sin?

Maybe I just tend to place more trust in God’s plan for them… I am only a worker in the vineyard. I can pull weeds, lay down fertilizer, water the garden for His glory but ultimately, God is the one that causes the miracle of bearing fruit to happen.

Example- My business is struggling mightily right now, as it has been for the last year. I can work hard, try and execute smart moves but I must realize that ultimately I have no real control over what happens. Markets go flat, people decide not to pay their bills because of their own struggles, people within their entities decide to quit spending money on projects, etc… I do KNOW however, that God has promised to provide for me (in whatever form He wills) and I trust completely in that. Its all I need. So whether I continue running this 30 year old business or do something else, my hope springs eternal because my Creator is far more loving and caring than I could ever be.

Same for my child who might decide to walk away from their faith, against everything he or she has been taught and knows.

Let hope be your happiness, have faith in your troubles and pray always. (Romans 12:12 paraphrased poorly)

On another note, If I may ask… What does “fear of God” mean to you?

Have a great day!

 

[graceandglory]

My 19 year old son just said that he is not attending church today, and doesn’t want to anymore. I tried convincing him of the importance of staying. He can’t be convinced. This is just heartbreaking to me.

I have two daughters who did the same basic thing. I have an 18 year old son and a 12 year old son, and a wife who still attend.
My faith is very important to me, and the fact that my 3 oldest children have all fallen away, is tearing me up.

I feel like a failure as a father.
What have others done in this situation?

Jon

Pray and believe.

As a kid who grew up in what I call a “nominal” Catholic family, in that we attended Mass every Sunday, except for my home was marked by violence and alcoholism, definitely not a Christian environment, I can tell you that “they will know we are Christians by our love.”

Love them back to Christ’s true Church. It took me 20 yrs.

 

[HiggDo]

Those of you in this situation can take comfort in the fact that eventually God will solve the problem.

In time you will be in heaven, sitting on your cloud, strumming your golden harp and singing the praises of god over and over and over and over and…

Meanwhile your kids will be burning in hell getting red hot pokers shoved up their bums over and over and over and over and over…

Maybe if you are really lucky God will allow you a break in your monotony by letting you pour vinegar down the throats of your kids when they cry for something to quench their thirst.

Enjoy eternity

What a cruel and unloving thing to say. Can’t you see how the hurt and pain in this world comes from human hands? Why contribute to it? Rather, be more loving.

I wish you peace.

 

[cerad]

What a cruel and unloving thing to say. Can’t you see how the hurt and pain in this world comes from human hands? Why contribute to it? Rather, be more loving.

I wish you peace.

Hey I’m not the one worshiping a being that enjoys sending bears after children to rip them apart. Just feel the love in that.

 

[HiggDo]

Maybe it is that evangelical upbringing, I KNEW that if I sinned and walked away from God - if I died, I would go to hell. I would not have renounced my faith, I knew what the alternative was.

What about the two criminals flanking Jesus on their crosses? Didn’t the one who repented at the last moment receive salvation?

What about the worker that only worked a couple of hours but received a “full day’s wage”?

How many times could you have walked away? 1? 10? 100? And upon returning, how many times would God have forgiven you?

Don’t we in a sense walk away from our faith with each sin we commit?

I don’t see God as a guilting or threatening God. I think guilt is an imperfect control method used by parents to try and achieve what they desire to be good.

God is all-loving and He loves us so much, in fact we are each precious in His sight, that He allows us our free will- even to misuse it and walk away from Him. And, his mercy far exceeds our greatest ability to sin- but we have to genuinely seek His forgiveness.

 

[HiggDo]

Hey I’m not the one worshiping a being that enjoys sending bears after children to rip them apart. Just feel the love in that.

Good things and Peace to you.

 

[wcknight]

We have to keep the lines of communications open. We have to trust in the Lord that He will never abandon His lost sheep. And we have to be the best Catholic parents that we can be.

Our kids have to make their own decisions now. They have to decide for themselves what is right and wrong and what role faith has in their lives. When my kids were young we took them to mass every week, they were are sent to Catholic schools, including high school. They received the sacraments and were well grounded in the faith BUT they came to a point when they became responsible for their own decisions. They each went to a university and stayed on campus.

I would guess that even IF they had stayed at home, there would inevitably come a time when they would make their own decisions. You can not force anyone to continue to believe against their own free will.

As with most young folks the harder you push an issue, the more likely they are to resist and rebell more vehemently. Rather than alienate your kids completely, the wiser course is to keep the lines of communications open and continue to be the best parent and example of a devout Catholic that you can be.

Kids do mature and grow up eventually (I hope). At this point we can only gently prod and hope and pray that they come to their senses, sooner rather than later.

I’m happy that other than losing their faith, they have become at least loving and caring young adults. They are all concerned with social justice, law biding citzens and in general great kids. I would love for them to return to the Church but for now I just have to be patient and keep praying.

 

[wcknight]

Those of you in this situation can take comfort in the fact that eventually God will solve the problem.

In time you will be in heaven, sitting on your cloud, strumming your golden harp and singing the praises of god over and over and over and over and…

Meanwhile your kids will be burning in hell getting red hot pokers shoved up their bums over and over and over and over and over…

Maybe if you are really lucky God will allow you a break in your monotony by letting you pour vinegar down the throats of your kids when they cry for something to quench their thirst.

Enjoy eternity

We’ll be sure to pour a little vinegar down your throat too.

The thing is no one knows who gets into Hell. Folks who have people praying for them all the time, probably don’t.

But is spite of your less than charitable remark, I’ll pray for you so you don’t end up where you are most probably headed.

May God prove to you that He exists, and may He give you a charitable heart which you are most sorely lacking.

 

[wcknight]

Hey, bears have to eat too ! He probably only does that to kids of atheists.

Sorry, I could not resist. The devil made me do it.

 

[HouseArrest]

What about the two criminals flanking Jesus on their crosses? Didn’t the one who repented at the last moment receive salvation?

What about the worker that only worked a couple of hours but received a “full day’s wage”?

How many times could you have walked away? 1? 10? 100? And upon returning, how many times would God have forgiven you?

Don’t we in a sense walk away from our faith with each sin we commit?

I don’t see God as a guilting or threatening God. I think guilt is an imperfect control method used by parents to try and achieve what they desire to be good.

God is all-loving and He loves us so much, in fact we are each precious in His sight, that He allows us our free will- even to misuse it and walk away from Him. And, his mercy far exceeds our greatest ability to sin- but we have to genuinely seek His forgiveness.

Higg Do, what you say is true, but the fact of the matter is that some don’t make it in the end. We parents are afraid when our kids stray we won’t get them back. It doesn’t always turn out positive. There are some people in hell.

I think there are a lot of different reasons why young adults stray from the church, all of which require different reactions from parents.

Some are rebelling which means they may not see anything at all wrong with their faith, they are just trying to shock their parents or assert their independence. In this case maybe forcing them to go to Mass may not be the best idea. In this case I think I’d treat them as non Christians. There certainly wouldn’t be any Christmas presents for non Christians under the tree. (Okay I think I’d still require Mass, but that’s just me.)

Then there are those who are truly searching and questioning the faith. I can’t imagine why this group would have any problem still attending Mass. A lot of discussion and reading together to find answers would be what I would prescribe here.

There are other situations - each parent needs to assess and react accordingly. In all situations we can pray.

My kids are all 13 yo and under. I’m so full of advice now - you may see a post from me in 5 - 10 years crying the same thing.

 

[zaramarie81]

Why is it considered “normal” for Catholic young people to leave the Faith?

Growing up in the evangelical Christian world, had a parent come with a question like this it would have been a shocking rare tragedy, and the entire community would be helping to bring this young person back to Christ.

In the Catholic world, the common reaction is “oh, that is normal”.

Sorry, but this convert does not understand how this is normal

Actually, research shows that many, if not most, evangelical Christians walk away from the faith (at least for a time) in their 20s. Protestants and Catholics alike face this problem. I think it’s “normal” not because it’s right, but because it’s common for the culture we live in which challenges the Christian faith heavily. Also, there is always a time - regardless of your upbringing - where a young person has to embrace the faith as their own, internalize it as their’s and not just their parents.

 

[kage_ar]

Are you saying that no children of Evangelicals ever walk away from their faith?

I have former Evangelicals in my Diaconate Formation class.

Did I see correctly that you said you were a convert to Catholicism?

!

I speak of Christianity when I say walking away from Faith. Stating one would rather play video games than go to Church is stating that the game is above God, and is deserting Christianity.

In my experience with hundreds of Evangelical families, when a teen rejects Christianity, it is considered a time for intervetion by all family, friends and community. No sitting around saying “that is just how they grow” or “maybe they will come back on the death bed”. It is code red, no holds barred, do something to keep this child from throwing away their immortal soul.

Converting to the Catholic Church is not walking away from Christianity, it is walking toward the fullness of the Truth.

That child was given to me by God, it is my duty as a parent to do all I can go get that child to heaven.

In no way a lack of faith in God, I know that Faith without works is dead.

On another note, If I may ask… What does “fear of God” mean to you?

!

That is an entire thread. I’d suggest first to read Aquinas on Nature and Grace.

%between%

 

[zaramarie81]

Letting me learn that if I stay up til 4 AM it is hard to get up for work the next day, learning that if I do not budget my money I will be broke, that if I eat bad food I will be fat… sure.

The MOST dangerous thing a person can do is to walk away from God.

Maybe it is that evangelical upbringing, I KNEW that if I sinned and walked away from God - if I died, I would go to hell. I would not have renounced my faith, I knew what the alternative was.

It is odd that I see so many Catholic young people who don’t have that same
“fear of God”.

Again, I don’t think this is a Catholic/Protestant issue. Many evangelicals believe in “once saved, always saved” and this unfortunately has a negative affect on some because they twist that and believe they can sin and never have to worry about hell at all. I know many young Catholics who fear hell almost to the point of scruples, are constantly in Confession, because they are keenly aware that mortal sin can send you straight to hell. As one who has been both evangelical and Catholic, who is a young adult, and who works on a national level with both evangelicals and Catholics, I really don’t think this is a reflection of just Catholic culture. Teens and young adults walk away from the faith all the time. Visit a family forum in an evangelical Protestant website… you’ll find parents writing similar posts as this dad.

 

[HiggDo]

Higg Do, what you say is true, but the fact of the matter is that some don’t make it in the end. We parents are afraid when our kids stray we won’t get them back. It doesn’t always turn out positive. There are some people in hell.

My kids are all 13 yo and under. I’m so full of advice now - you may see a post from me in 5 - 10 years crying the same thing.

Yes, the world amply demonstrates that things don’t always turn out for the positive (thereby demonstrating our ultimate lack of control over life) but this must not deter us from following God in prayer, faith, hope and love.

It is true, and painful, and worrysome that some may not make it in the end. St Teresa of Avila once said that “souls are falling into hell like snowflakes”, as a result of peoples self-condemnation. And it is this fear for our loved ones that causes us such angst, because we instinctively always want the very best for our children. We just ultimately come to realize that we cannot control the outcome, thus, we must surrender completely to the will of God.

It is such a great mystery and because it remains a mystery of God’s, we must continue to have hope and faith in God.

May God bless you and your family…

 

[HiggDo]

I speak of Christianity when I say walking away from Faith. Stating one would rather play video games than go to Church is stating that the game is above God, and is deserting Christianity.

“Playing vidoe games”, etc, instead of going to church is a typical human inclination that we must constantly seek to overcome. Hec, sometimes I’m too tired to get up and go to 7am Mass to Lector, but I get up anyway. We can demonstrate the right thing to do by the way we live but it is no guarantee that someone won’t leave their faith

In my experience with hundreds of Evangelical families, when a teen rejects Christianity, it is considered a time for intervetion by all family, friends and community. No sitting around saying “that is just how they grow” or “maybe they will come back on the death bed”. It is code red, no holds barred, do something to keep this child from throwing away their immortal soul.

You’re not giving much credit to Catholic families and treating the matter with a rather broad brushstroke as if they don’t care, which the original poster in this thread has amply demonstrated is not the case, just by the fact that he posted and is looking for help.

So if the child that the Evangelical community went after did not come back, did the community fail in the eyes of God?

Converting to the Catholic Church is not walking away from Christianity, it is walking toward the fullness of the Truth.

I just meant that if you yourself became Catholic, you yourself walked away from the Evangelical Christian faith. Do those you left fear for your salvation and well-being? Are they still doing everything they possibly can to bring you back?

That child was given to me by God, it is my duty as a parent to do all I can go get that child to heaven.

Of course, but you don’t get to control the outcome.

In no way a lack of faith in God, I know that Faith without works is dead.

Thanks and bless you!

That is an entire thread. I’d suggest first to read Aquinas on Nature and Grace.

%between%

I was just asking for your opinion, thanks for the links!

 

[Sheeniac]

Think of St. Monica and start praying him back in the Church. Also, start a dialog to find out what he thinks/believes and why.

I was raised a ‘lapsed Catholic’, so to speak. Became a serious atheist at 25, an was absent from God and His Church until the age of 40. I have some Catholic friends that I believe spent time advocating for my behalf with God. And now. just turned 43, I am filled with joy at being home again.

I will pray for you!

 

[wcknight]

Sheeniac

What convinced you to come back ?? Whar made you change your opinion about God ?

 

[upbeatjonm]

Think of St. Monica and start praying him back in the Church. Also, start a dialog to find out what he thinks/believes and why.

I was raised a ‘lapsed Catholic’, so to speak. Became a serious atheist at 25, an was absent from God and His Church until the age of 40. I have some Catholic friends that I believe spent time advocating for my behalf with God. And now. just turned 43, I am filled with joy at being home again.
Yes, I also pray asking St. Monica for intercession. I presume she is able to help. I was already praying to her before this happened. I have to trust.
I will pray for you!

 

[Sheeniac]

Sheeniac

What convinced you to come back ?? Whar made you change your opinion about God ?

I dabbled in several eastern philosophies for awhile looking for meaning in my life. I read a book called a Case for Christ (and then a Case for Faith) which negated my intellectual arguments. At the end of the Case for Christ, the author states that intellect can only take you so far, that at the end, you need the leap of faith which only the Holy Spirit can give.

So there I was, back to square one with the eastern religions/schools of thought and Christianity potentially showing the way, but still no firm conclusion.

So I was flipping through the channels one day, and happened across an old black and white TV show with some guy dressed funny standing in front of a blackboard discussing the differences between Buddhism and Christianity. I stopped and was captivated, and decided to catch this man’s show whenever I could. I now think of Fulton Sheen as ‘my archbishop’.

Then one day, I was watching something about the Pope, and he made me think of my archbishop. I realized that it was pure Love shining on his face, as I had seen on Abp. Sheen’s face. And it was other-worldly… I thought - if this Love is shining so strongly on their faces, how great must God, the source of the reflected Love, must be. And with that, the Holy Spirit sealed the deal.

Telling this story, I guess I do have some additional words of advice.

Don’t think for a minute that the ‘call’ is gone from someone’s soul, atheist, pagan, whatever. People still search for the Truth, for meaning. Now, when people first leave, the wounds are very raw, and I wouldn’t suggest discussing things with them.

People leave for a gazillion reasons, and at some point, it will come out.

And as we know, many times they attack the Church. Don’t play defense too much. Acknowledge what is true, and share your pain. And eventually, share your doubts that you may have had in the past. Once the person’s bitterness and anger has subsided, it’s possible that they will be open to talking. As an atheist, for the longest time I believed Christians to be mindless sheep, just swallowing what they were told. I had no ideas that many people had questions and doubts, but were able to believe anyway. I know - how arrogant…

One thing that stands out in my search for the truth is that Taoism is probably the closest you can come to Christianity/Judaism without the external ‘trappings’. If they land there, you have a good chance of lessening their resistance (slowly, over years) to God and Christ.