Christians VS Pagans

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Hastrman said:
Isn’t Hrolf “Ralph,” plus ou moins? “Ulf” also means wolf, as in ulfhedhnar, one of those wolf-themed berserkers (Berserkers liked bears, not wolves).

Zen, and Confucianism. Ever hear of hara-kiri? Granted, they’re not really non-violent; Zen’s got the only Buddhist monks who shed blood (they invented gong fu, don’t let’s forget). And it is a form of “compassion” to kill a man before he can do evil. But those are still positive religions, and they approve of suicide. All religions except Christianity value dignity more than life, so suicide is permitted, even encouraged, if it’s to preserve honor.
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:banghead:
look, I’m not even gonna bother answering to you.

you’re obviously just trolling:whacky:

ps. is “gong fu” some sort of instrument…or did you mean Kung Fu?😛
After that I’m not gonna take anything else you have to say seriously…
 
You tell me, Medbh. The Creator is indeed referenced in Celtic mythology as being above the “god” and “goddess” but that deity does not play a part other than being the creator. I ask you, what creator would abandon his creation? Is the act of creation a random act? Worlds created and then left on their own to be claimed by “lesser dieties”? My argument is not Catholic but anthropological.
 
Hastrman said:
Isn’t Hrolf “Ralph,” plus ou moins? “Ulf” also means wolf, as in ulfhedhnar, one of those wolf-themed berserkers (Berserkers liked bears, not wolves).

Zen, and Confucianism. Ever hear of hara-kiri? Granted, they’re not really non-violent; Zen’s got the only Buddhist monks who shed blood (they invented gong fu, don’t let’s forget). And it is a form of “compassion” to kill a man before he can do evil. But those are still positive religions, and they approve of suicide. All religions except Christianity value dignity more than life, so suicide is permitted, even encouraged, if it’s to preserve honor.
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Yes, Hrolf is the equivalent of Rudolph, Ralph, Rolf, etc. But to call someone wolf would be the functional equivalent of calling me (by my given name) “lion heart”. It was just me being picky.
 
brotherhrolf said:
You tell me, Medbh. The Creator is indeed referenced in Celtic mythology as being above the “god” and “goddess” but that deity does not play a part other than being the creator. I ask you, what creator would abandon his creation? Is the act of creation a random act? Worlds created and then left on their own to be claimed by “lesser dieties”? My argument is not Catholic but anthropological.
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I told you already I’m NOT a Celtic Pagan. And in my belief the world was created by the Gods, which represent the male and female principle which is in everything and in everyone. She’s our Mother and He’s our Father. She is the Bearer of Life, He is what makes the development of Life possible. How could they abandon us?
They are a part of us, there is a part of Them inside each one of us, and in the animals, in the trees and plants, in the water and in everything that has ever been created. And we are part of Them, for we are not “the Creature”, but we are part of their Great Creation. They will never abandon us.
 
Medbh, have you done any historical research? Have you heard of the Indo-Europeans? Have you found out that the gods of India, Rome, Greece, Ireland, France, etc. are but variations upon a common theme? All of us, European and Indian types (yes, India), all come from the central Eurasian plain about 5 or 6,000 years ago. We share common languages and a common mythology. I’m not going to brow-beat you on this but please, do some research on this and remember that 5-6,000 years ago there were far fewer people on the face of the Earth and we are to this day related. (Six degrees of separation).

You don’t have to be a Celtic pagan. You are an Indo-European pagan reverting to the gods and godesses which our ancestors worshiped. If you were an adherent of a different belief system, you would not have used Celtic knotwork or the triskelion in your signature. If you are not a Celtic pagan, then don’t use obvious Celtic symbols which identify you as such. I’m not being mean, I am simply telling you that the symbols you use do have meaning and that there are folks who interpret what you say through the lens of that symbol. Symbols have meaning - concrete meaning - in all religions, all across the globe.
 
brotherhrolf said:
Medbh, have you done any historical research? Have you heard of the Indo-Europeans? Have you found out that the gods of India, Rome, Greece, Ireland, France, etc. are but variations upon a common theme? All of us, European and Indian types (yes, India), all come from the central Eurasian plain about 5 or 6,000 years ago. We share common languages and a common mythology. I’m not going to brow-beat you on this but please, do some research on this and remember that 5-6,000 years ago there were far fewer people on the face of the Earth and we are to this day related. (Six degrees of separation).
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Yes, as a matter of fact I worship the archetypes.

What’s the point of your argument anyway?:confused:
You don’t have to be a Celtic pagan. You are an Indo-European pagan reverting to the gods and godesses which our ancestors worshiped. If you were an adherent of a different belief system, you would not have used Celtic knotwork or the triskelion in your signature. If you are not a Celtic pagan, then don’t use obvious Celtic symbols which identify you as such. I’m not being mean, I am simply telling you that the symbols you use do have meaning and that there are folks who interpret what you say through the lens of that symbol. Symbols have meaning - concrete meaning - in all religions, all across the globe.
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Please don’t put me in a box, or stick a label on me. I didn’t do it with you and I would like you to avoid doing it with me.
You know absolutely nothing about me on top of things, therefore you really can’t say what I am.

I didn’t know there was a copyright on these symbols.
I admire them and I will continue to use them.
If you are getting into the point of symbols…what about the ancient Christian monks using Celtic symbols?
 
Hastrman said:
All religions except Christianity value dignity more than life, so suicide is permitted, even encouraged, if it’s to preserve honor.
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Misleading. This is more often a cultural outlook than a religious one.
 
Medbh said:
If you are getting into the point of symbols…what about the ancient Christian monks using Celtic symbols?
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Medbh, knotwork is at it’s very essence Ethiopian in nature. Lots of studies which show that Celtic monks went to Ethiopia to study. Betcha didn’t know that.

Dissemble all you want. I asked you a simple question. I expected an answer based upon your beliefs. I asked you a question which you could ask me (and get a cogent reply) and I get the same kind of response I have gotten from my so-called pagan friends back in the 70s and 80s which is no response at all.

I repeat: a faith which cannot be challenged is no faith at all. I don’t want to be confrontational but you can be any kind of pagan you want to be - just be honest. You used obvious Celtic symbols not me. Forgive me if I recognize those symbols for what they are. I am not trying to pigeon hole you in any category. You use Celtic symbols, you proclaim yourself to be pagan, one plus one equals two.

One can’t invoke the Supreme Being and follow a god and goddess. You have not answered my question.

Liberalsaved? I am not arguing this from anything but an anthropological point of view. Of course it is cultural! Everything is cultural! Culture and religion are not contrasting, they are complementary.
 
Choosing to be pagan rather than Catholic Christian is like taking a baloney sandwich to a banquet. Certainly a matter of choice, but what is the point? Also, I would concur with the other posters when I say that paganism can open the door to evil and unimaginable horror.
 
brotherhrolf said:
Medbh, knotwork is at it’s very essence Ethiopian in nature. Lots of studies which show that Celtic monks went to Ethiopia to study. Betcha didn’t know that.

Dissemble all you want. I asked you a simple question. I expected an answer based upon your beliefs. I asked you a question which you could ask me (and get a cogent reply) and I get the same kind of response I have gotten from my so-called pagan friends back in the 70s and 80s which is no response at all.

I repeat: a faith which cannot be challenged is no faith at all. I don’t want to be confrontational but you can be any kind of pagan you want to be - just be honest. You used obvious Celtic symbols not me. Forgive me if I recognize those symbols for what they are. I am not trying to pigeon hole you in any category. You use Celtic symbols, you proclaim yourself to be pagan, one plus one equals two.

One can’t invoke the Supreme Being and follow a god and goddess. You have not answered my question.

Liberalsaved? I am not arguing this from anything but an anthropological point of view. Of course it is cultural! Everything is cultural! Culture and religion are not contrasting, they are complementary.
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Sorry but where is your question. Questions usually start with what, where or how and end with a question mark like this ?

I guess you have a long list of types of Pagans you downloaded from the internet to try and link me to but we could go on all day with this and you probably still won’t be able to link me to one.

I can see where this is going, you are attempting to put a label on me so its easier to work your words of conversion. It’s difficult to convert something you don’t pin down 😛

“If you take [a copy of] the Christian Bible and put it out in the wind and the rain, soon the paper on which the words are printed will disintegrate and the words will be gone. Our bible IS the wind and the rain.” Herbalist Carol McGrath as told to her by a Native-American woman

religioustolerance.org/witchcra.htm
 
Medbh said:
Hi guys…
just a question.
on a few occasions I noticed that Christians often have a negative attitude towards pagans.
This can be shown more or less openly, by actions, by words, by behaviours,by many different things.
My question is: why do some Christians hate Pagans so much?
Why do they despise them?
It tends to become something personal…like for instance, you don’t know me and I don’t know you, but as soon as you know I’m Pagan, you take it personally.Why?
This is what I can’t figure out…because it is normal to disagree, and even to despise people’s opinions at times. But why taking it personally? I have seen Christians who refused to talk to some people just because they were of a Pagan belief.
Would those people, or any other Christian that can recognize himself/herself in this description, act as such with a Muslim or with a Jew?
Would you push somebody away and end up being rude with someone because of their faith? Why?
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It would be interesting for you to know that Christians have problems with very Jews for centuries even though Jesus himself was a Jew. And what Jews say about Jesus privately is another serious problem.

And when a Christian missionary goes to a pagan country such as India to convert pagans, he can burned to death alive by the pagans nowadays because pagan learned how their fellow pagans are being Christianised.
 
brotherhrolf said:
Unfortunately, the authentic cults of Cerunnos, Brighit, Llyr et al vanished around 1500 years ago.
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Is it really unfortunate? Didn’t the ancient Celtic cults practice human sacrifice?

The Truth echoes throughout human history and mythology, and so every religion contains part of it. But why would you want only part of the Truth, when you can have all of it?
 
Medbh said:
Please don’t put me in a box, or stick a label on me. I didn’t do it with you and I would like you to avoid doing it with me.
You know absolutely nothing about me on top of things, therefore you really can’t say what I am.
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If you are so sure you’ve hit on the truth with your belief system, why won’t you share it? And why should you strive so hard to protect it from being questioned? The real Truth can stand up to the most withering scrutiny.

Earlier, you said you have no need of mercy. Frankly, I shudder at the thought of a soul standing before God on the brink of eternity and telling Him that. Everybody needs mercy. Anyone who thinks differently is a prisoner of pride.
 
**I don’t hate anyone, if I can avoid it.
**
My sister is wiccan, but that’s the least of why she’s not welcomein my home or around my children.
I think many associate paganism with satanism.
**As christians, that’s often a natural reaction. It isn’t hate. It’s just a desire to avoid perceived (real or not) evil influences. **
Maybe the pagan is taking it too personal?
 
Medbh said:
“If you take [a copy of] the Christian Bible and put it out in the wind and the rain, soon the paper on which the words are printed will disintegrate and the words will be gone. Our bible IS the wind and the rain.” Herbalist Carol McGrath as told to her by a Native-American woman

religioustolerance.org/witchcra.htm
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NO, We Christians have the incarnate Word of God, in fact God himself incarnate and walking among us, in the form of Jesus Christ. The true creator of the wind and rain that Ms McGrath seems to worship.

The Bible is a poor second best written well after he died. But he is still present among us in person, real and entire, in the Eucharist.

How else do you think Christianity survived for 1900 or so years where the vast majority of the world’s people were completely or mostly illiterate?
 
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