Church Exorcist and Pro Life Priest Warns Against Harry Potter

[Cracker_Mom]

I would like to add that there is nothing wrong with a person being a homosexual as far as the Church is concerned. The causes of homosexuality are probably multi-faceted and I don’t think most people choose to be attracted to others of their own gender.

It’s not a sin to be a homosexual. The sin is in homosexual behavior such as engaging in sex with a person of one’s own gender.

Homosexuals are given a heavy cross to bear. There are good homosexual Catholics who do not engage in homosexual behavior and have accepted their cross with dignity. Unfortunately many are ridiculed just for being who they are. That’s not right.

I understand that having a homosexual character in a book may raise a red flag and perhaps rightly so. But I wanted to add this clarification.

My reservations were concerning the author’s intent when she made this statement.What purpose would it serve? I guess publicity could be the answer, but it seems an odd thing to say, especially re children’s literature. So it made me a bit wary of the whole series.That plus all the occult stuff.
I did actually enjoy the first film, though.
There are many things in the world that are obviously dangerous for kids.And then others we might be more careful about. Not paranoid, just careful.
Just my thoughts.
And I don’t think jumping all over folks who disagree is helpful.Nor the priest who’s had experience with dark side.I’d give him a bit of credit based on his experiences.Listening to each source & making an educated decision is generally a safe course in parenting.And life in general.

 

[Mumbles140]

My reservations were concerning the author’s intent when she made this statement.What purpose would it serve? I guess publicity could be the answer, but it seems an odd thing to say, especially re children’s literature. So it made me a bit wary of the whole series.That plus all the occult stuff.
I did actually enjoy the first film, though.
There are many things in the world that are obviously dangerous for kids.And then others we might be more careful about. Not paranoid, just careful.
Just my thoughts.
And I don’t think jumping all over folks who disagree is helpful.Nor the priest who’s had experience with dark side.I’d give him a bit of credit based on his experiences.Listening to each source & making an educated decision is generally a safe course in parenting.And life in general.

Precisely why I made the point of letting folks know that the statement was made after all of the books had been written. As someone who has read all of the books AFTER finding out about her statement regarding the headmaster, I did try to see if there was any truth to it. As noted before, NOTHING in the books would lead one to this conclusion. He is grandfatherly and caring for his students, but in no way inappropriate or sexually interested.

Furthermore, I think people are respecting the opinions of Fr. Eutenener. However, the common argument has not been that there isn’t ‘danger’ by exposing children to the ‘occult’ but people overreacting to Harry Potter without actually reading it. As is always the case, the movies aren’t exactly like the books, but even they carry on the basic themes that we should hope for in young adult literature.

I remember an episode of the Simpsons where Ned Flanders is reading Harry Potter to his children. He says “And Harry Potter, and all his wizard and witch friends, are burning in Hell for practicing magic!” Let us all not be so dense and so quick to judge. As you talk about listening to each source, perhaps you should give them a read and determine for yourself whether the Harry Potter saga is truly ‘a work of evil’ or simply a great, easy read with some strong, moral themes.

 

[Cracker_Mom]

Precisely why I made the point of letting folks know that the statement was made after all of the books had been written. As someone who has read all of the books AFTER finding out about her statement regarding the headmaster, I did try to see if there was any truth to it. As noted before, NOTHING in the books would lead one to this conclusion. He is grandfatherly and caring for his students, but in no way inappropriate or sexually interested.

Furthermore, I think people are respecting the opinions of Fr. Eutenener. However, the common argument has not been that there isn’t ‘danger’ by exposing children to the ‘occult’ but people overreacting to Harry Potter without actually reading it. As is always the case, the movies aren’t exactly like the books, but even they carry on the basic themes that we should hope for in young adult literature.

I remember an episode of the Simpsons where Ned Flanders is reading Harry Potter to his children. He says “And Harry Potter, and all his wizard and witch friends, are burning in Hell for practicing magic!” Let us all not be so dense and so quick to judge. As you talk about listening to each source, perhaps you should give them a read and determine for yourself whether the Harry Potter saga is truly ‘a work of evil’ or simply a great, easy read with some strong, moral themes.

I don’t generally enjoy reading fiction, especially hundreds of pages of it.I wouldn’t imagine a child would pick up on a character’s sexual preference if it’s hidden that well.I’ll assume I can’t discern it either because I don’t want to spend hours looking for it.
I don’t have an opinion on whether Harry Potter’s a “work of evil” or not. I rather doubt it is, but I’m still feeling cautious.
In a post in one of the Harry Potter threads Fr. Euteneuer was compared to the Taliban which seems disrespectful.If he’s the same priest who was in charge of Human Life International I think he’s highly credible.At least from everything I’ve heard.
I’d like to remain skeptical about most of the media available to kids today.And its sources.But not paranoid.

 

[curlycool89]

“Harry Potter and these Twilight vampires glamorize the power of evil,”

That’s a load of poppycock if I ever heard some. There’s a pretty clear distinction between good and evil in HP, and evil is portrayed in the worst way possible. Here’s a hint, the evil ones are the ones who look like magical Nazi’s (by the way, I’m not trying to tip Goodwin’s Law. Rowling herself said she modelled the Death Eaters on the Nazi’s. They went way over the top with it in the new movie to spell it out to the people who didn’t figure that out by now).

The Death Eaters and Voldemort are the evil guys, and it’s very black and white. They want to enslave the non-“pure blooded” people because they’re “lesser people”. The main characters are completely horrified by this and everyone who’s portrayed as a “good guy” hates them and what they stand for. Rowling makes sure that you understand who’s evil and she makes you hate them. Evil is evil. The last book in the series really couldn’t get any clearer about who’s good and who’s evil and how evil they are and how they need to be defeated/overthrown/taken down.

 

[Suni_Moon]

Oh look. Another Catholic taking what ONE PRIEST says, and making it out to be the belief of the Vatican as a whole, because this one priest happens to share said Catholics beliefs. So they are obviously more right than anyone else in the Church who disagrees with the said Catholics views.

Here we have a classic case of picking and choosing, to suit the OP’s required needs.
OP also makes the post as blunt as possible, pretty much saying at the start “I AM RIGHT, AND YOU ARE WRONG” leaving no room for debate.

Because the OP cannot debate the matter.

Gee. I’ve never seen this before.

Harry Potter is not a childrens guide book to witchcraft, it’s a story of good and evil that uses a magical world setting as a plot device, not the most important focus.
The magic in HP bears pretty much no similarities to actual witchcraft. At all.

The magic in the HP world is a basic fact of life. It’s not entirely different then super hero stuff.
The HP world is NOT our world, it is an alternate reality. In this reality, some people have special powers. The majority do not. It’s not like “witchcraft” is represented as something everyone can go learn.

In the Harry Potter world, some people are just born with this powers. They go to a school to learn to use them. HP also has Christian elements, another thing that people conveniently ignore.

But the OP would not know any of this, because the OP has not actually read the books.
The OP has only based their judgment on what others say of the matter.
Which is totally foolish. Even if you are against Harry Potter, you should know your enemy, and actually do the research.

But you people don’t.

And before you call be a fan who’s too blinded and deepset in their ways… I am a casual “fan”

I read the books. I thought they were enjoyable. I haven’t bothered with the latest movies.
I stand a middle ground. A middle ground called common sense.
Which, sadly, so many people lack.

 

[curlycool89]

Harry Potter is not a childrens guide book to witchcraft, it’s a story of good and evil that uses a magical world setting as a plot device, not the most important focus.

Very true. The turing point in the series was really book 4. After that, the magic really played nothing more than a background role in a tale of good vs. evil.

 

[Dymphna82]

The most dangerous part about the Twilight series is now the glamorization of vampires, but the glamorization of teenage girls getting in controlling, emotionally abusive relationships with guys that are willing to watch them while they sleep. The girls swoon over Edward Cullen but his behavior is just creepy.

I understand fear of the growing theme of “everything dark can be safe,” but I don’t think this has a strong factor in turning children to the occult. I can’t think of any books I had as a kid that interested me in the occult, except maybe Greek mythology and that was an extremely small factor. I think Liberalism in our schools and culture is more dangerous. Our culture is so obsessed with tolerance that it’s easy to be too accepting.

And I’d also like to add that I’ve read Harry Potter and seen all the movies. Never once, never once did I suspect that Dumbledore is gay. His character is very non-sexual in nature. He’s a mentor and guardian figure. I believe Rowling did it because a lot of the fan fiction writers out there are obsessed with making the HP characters gay in their writings.

 

[faithfully]

Well, I never once got the idea that Dumbledor was gay. But if he was, I guess he’s doing as he should. Leading a chaste life. There’s ZERO inference that he’s in any sort of relationship at all, or ever has been. At least that I can remember.

So, given the title of this thread… Are there Pro Choice or Pro Abortion Priests out there (Who have not been excommunicated)?

Do priests see the need to identify themselves as Pro Life? As if it’s not an ABSOLUTE given?

Just curious…

I’m not going to Debate the whole HP issue. If a person can not discern between right and wrong… and then later that the Church does not approve WHITE or Black magic… the books should be avoided… along with a LONG list of others… inclusive of Greek Mythology, Shakespear and most of Disney…

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

The most dangerous part about the Twilight series is now the glamorization of vampires, but the glamorization of teenage girls getting in controlling, emotionally abusive relationships with guys that are willing to watch them while they sleep. The girls swoon over Edward Cullen but his behavior is just creepy.

I understand fear of the growing theme of “everything dark can be safe,” but I don’t think this has a strong factor in turning children to the occult. I can’t think of any books I had as a kid that interested me in the occult, except maybe Greek mythology and that was an extremely small factor. I think Liberalism in our schools and culture is more dangerous. Our culture is so obsessed with tolerance that it’s easy to be too accepting.

And I’d also like to add that I’ve read Harry Potter and seen all the movies. Never once, never once did I suspect that Dumbledore is gay. His character is very non-sexual in nature. He’s a mentor and guardian figure. I believe Rowling did it because a lot of the fan fiction writers out there are obsessed with making the HP characters gay in their writings.

I agree with you about the Twilight Books.

 

[Mumbles140]

I don’t generally enjoy reading fiction, especially hundreds of pages of it.I wouldn’t imagine a child would pick up on a character’s sexual preference if it’s hidden that well.I’ll assume I can’t discern it either because I don’t want to spend hours looking for it.
I don’t have an opinion on whether Harry Potter’s a “work of evil” or not. I rather doubt it is, but I’m still feeling cautious.
In a post in one of the Harry Potter threads Fr. Euteneuer was compared to the Taliban which seems disrespectful.If he’s the same priest who was in charge of Human Life International I think he’s highly credible.At least from everything I’ve heard.
I’d like to remain skeptical about most of the media available to kids today.And its sources.But not paranoid.

1. No one can discern the sexuality because there isn’t ever any mention of, or even allusion to, Dumbledore’s sexual orientation.
2. It is good to be cautious, but you came into this thread in opposition to it. For those of us good, strong Catholics who have decided to read the series, we wanted to let those who have not read it, including yourself and the OP, to know that the series is not about witch craft. As was previously noted, the wizardry is a plot device to deliver a deeper message that promotes morals and virtues. I’m not trying to convince you to read the books or support them, but I don’t think you should speak ill against them without experiencing them when other Catholics support the books.
3. I do not support any comparison to the Taliban, or any other disreputable person/organization for that matter, even if it is on a very specific dimension.
4. It is perfectly fine to be skeptical - in fact, my job requires me to maintain ‘professional skepticism.’ But when you have first-hand accounts from Catholics that this series of books is not dangerous, especially in comparison to what is out there on other forms of media (television, music, movies, and video games), I think it is okay to accept it as neutral until you have actually read the series.

 

[LittleSoldier]

Oh look. Another Catholic taking what ONE PRIEST says, and making it out to be the belief of the Vatican as a whole, because this one priest happens to share said Catholics beliefs. So they are obviously more right than anyone else in the Church who disagrees with the said Catholics views.

Here we have a classic case of picking and choosing, to suit the OP’s required needs.
OP also makes the post as blunt as possible, pretty much saying at the start “I AM RIGHT, AND YOU ARE WRONG” leaving no room for debate.

Because the OP cannot debate the matter.

Gee. I’ve never seen this before.

Harry Potter is not a childrens guide book to witchcraft, it’s a story of good and evil that uses a magical world setting as a plot device, not the most important focus.
The magic in HP bears pretty much no similarities to actual witchcraft. At all.

The magic in the HP world is a basic fact of life. It’s not entirely different then super hero stuff.
The HP world is NOT our world, it is an alternate reality. In this reality, some people have special powers. The majority do not. It’s not like “witchcraft” is represented as something everyone can go learn.

In the Harry Potter world, some people are just born with this powers. They go to a school to learn to use them. HP also has Christian elements, another thing that people conveniently ignore.

But the OP would not know any of this, because the OP has not actually read the books.
The OP has only based their judgment on what others say of the matter.
Which is totally foolish. Even if you are against Harry Potter, you should know your enemy, and actually do the research.

But you people don’t.

And before you call be a fan who’s too blinded and deepset in their ways… I am a casual “fan”

I read the books. I thought they were enjoyable. I haven’t bothered with the latest movies.
I stand a middle ground. A middle ground called common sense.
Which, sadly, so many people lack.

I think you are being way too harsh regarding the OP. He expected to be flamed and I don’t blame him one bit. Although it’s not appropriate to flame anyone, that is common practice on any forum.

And I notice you also have basically asked to not be flamed yourself, when you state “…before you call be a fan who’s too blinded and deepset in their ways…” At least that’s what I think you are doing because that sentence must have a typo or something.

Fortunately this thread seems to be progressing in a charitable manner.

If you don’t like the OP’s post why don’t you start your own thread? This is the OP’s thread, whether you agree with him or not. I’m sorry if you see this as being blunt or uncharitable but I don’t understand why anyone would go into a thread and knock the OP in the way you have. The OP has the right to open a thread in any way he/she finds appropriate as long as it doesn’t go against forum rules. And I don’t see any rules being broken here.

 

[FrCorey]

sounds like the times of the book burnings again. It’s called fantasy.
otherwise all the fairy tales are true too.

 

[LittleSoldier]

Addition to Post 32:

Where does the OP state that he won’t or can’t debate the issue? It seems to me like you have just assumed that he can’t. Your assertion is unfounded.

People jumping to conclusions and making unfounded assertions. Gee, I’ve never seen that before!!

BTW, I agree with you re the Harry Potter books. It’s your remarks about the OP that I find troublesome.

 

[Mumbles140]

Where does the OP state that he won’t or can’t debate the issue? It seems to me like you have just assumed that he can’t. Your assertion is unfounded.

LS, I totally agree with you that it is wrong to jump at someone for letting their opinion be known and trying to foster discussion on it. As for the quoted statement, though, I believe (and please correct me if I’m wrong) that this is in reference to the fact that the OP has not read the Harry Potter books, and therefore can only cite other people’s opinions rather than Brooklyn’s own personal opinion.

At least for me, there is a certain frustration when someone argues to ‘read the source and make their own opinion’ in reference to their argument, but admits to not reading the source of the opposition. This in no way excuses one from being charitable, but the thread was not started as a discussion on the statements made by a priest, but rather a condemnation of Catholic Harry Potter fans. The following quote is taken from the original post, and I do find it of an attacking nature:

For all you die-hard fans, I know it’s hopeless. It’s scary how much of a hold these stories have over some people so that they won’t even consider that there might be something wrong with them. If only people would hold to the dogma of the Church as rigidly.

All we are arguing is that if you haven’t read the books, you shouldn’t say they are dangerous. You could easily say that certain religious figures believe them to be dangerous, but they are not speaking with any authority. Furthermore, Brooklyn is also assuming that we do not hold to the dogmas of the Church. I’m sorry, but I was unaware my reading list affected the strength or depth of my faith. Because I have read and own many of C.S. Lewis’ technical works, does that mean I’m drifting towards Anglicanism? Or do we trust educated, ‘of age’ Catholics to read works, whether fiction or non-fiction, and pick out the appropriate material. Just as there is great value to Catholics in Lewis’ belief in Purgatory by the Scriptures and reason, so is there in having teens, young adults, or any appropriate reader reading stories of good triumphing over evil in a moral, courageous way.

Again, I do not at all condone being uncharitable, and I hope that the tone of my statements does not come off that way. I am simply saying that the OP made several ‘unfounded’ assertions as well, so let’s step back and focus on the subject matter.

 

[Cracker_Mom]

1. No one can discern the sexuality because there isn’t ever any mention of, or even allusion to, Dumbledore’s sexual orientation.
2. It is good to be cautious, but you came into this thread in opposition to it. For those of us good, strong Catholics who have decided to read the series, we wanted to let those who have not read it, including yourself and the OP, to know that the series is not about witch craft. As was previously noted, the wizardry is a plot device to deliver a deeper message that promotes morals and virtues. I’m not trying to convince you to read the books or support them, but I don’t think you should speak ill against them without experiencing them when other Catholics support the books.
3. I do not support any comparison to the Taliban, or any other disreputable person/organization for that matter, even if it is on a very specific dimension.
4. It is perfectly fine to be skeptical - in fact, my job requires me to maintain ‘professional skepticism.’ But when you have first-hand accounts from Catholics that this series of books is not dangerous, especially in comparison to what is out there on other forms of media (television, music, movies, and video games), I think it is okay to accept it as neutral until you have actually read the series.

Actually, Harry Potter hadn’t crossed my mind til I saw these threads, especially this one mentioning Fr. Euteneur whose work at HLI I’ve admired.We’ve supported Human Life International from the beginning & if their former head thinks there’s an issue with Harry Potter or any other media I’d want to at least take a second look.Not condemn the books as dangerous, but just try to understand what the priest is saying & what his experiences were.
I admire J.K.Rowling’s sucess as a single mom & think fantasy is OK for kids but would want to take into account the culture the author’s coming from.Britain today is not the Britain of C.S. Lewis or Tolkien.Or George MacDonald. I read the BBC News online every day & it’s a whole different world over there.For the most part indifferent or even hostile to religion.
Harry Potter may very well be simple fantasy & perfectly harmless.And as you & others point out, there’s a whole lot of worse stuff out there for kids.

 

[Mumbles140]

Actually, Harry Potter hadn’t crossed my mind til I saw these threads, especially this one mentioning Fr. Euteneur whose work at HLI I’ve admired.We’ve supported Human Life International from the beginning & if their former head thinks there’s an issue with Harry Potter or any other media I’d want to at least take a second look.Not condemn the books as dangerous, but just try to understand what the priest is saying & what his experiences were.
I admire J.K.Rowling’s sucess as a single mom & think fantasy is OK for kids but would want to take into account the culture the author’s coming from.Britain today is not the Britain of C.S. Lewis or Tolkien.Or George MacDonald. I read the BBC News online every day & it’s a whole different world over there.For the most part indifferent or even hostile to religion.
Harry Potter may very well be simple fantasy & perfectly harmless.And as you & others point out, there’s a whole lot of worse stuff out there for kids.

I understand Fr. Eutenener’s work at HLI is very special, as is his past experiences. I think our point, with no disrespect to the Father, is that we choose to disagree with his opinion as Catholics who have read the series.

Also, I don’t quite understand how Britain’s culture today is relevent to the matter at hand. I, for one, did not read the series in the mindset of their role in British society. I read it as a story that I was hoping would entertain me, and I found it contained some deep moral themes along the way (universally moral, not ‘relatively’ moral as our culture tends towards). Our argument is simply that, as Catholics, we did find it to be ‘perfectly harmless’ when read by those at a proper age, which becomes older as the series does as well!

As for Britain’s culture again, perhaps there is more to it. Maybe by basing it in something like witch craft, Rowling can ‘fly under the radar’ by carrying religious themes in the series. For the sake of those who have read them, I will not go into specifics, but for those who have, you know what I’m talking about…

 

[Barbkw]

For all you die-hard fans, I know it’s hopeless. It’s scary how much of a hold these stories have over some people so that they won’t even consider that there might be something wrong with them. If only people would hold to the dogma of the Church as rigidly.

 

[Cracker_Mom]

I understand Fr. Eutenener’s work at HLI is very special, as is his past experiences. I think our point, with no disrespect to the Father, is that we choose to disagree with his opinion as Catholics who have read the series.

Also, I don’t quite understand how Britain’s culture today is relevent to the matter at hand. I, for one, did not read the series in the mindset of their role in British society. I read it as a story that I was hoping would entertain me, and I found it contained some deep moral themes along the way (universally moral, not ‘relatively’ moral as our culture tends towards). Our argument is simply that, as Catholics, we did find it to be ‘perfectly harmless’ when read by those at a proper age, which becomes older as the series does as well!

As for Britain’s culture again, perhaps there is more to it. Maybe by basing it in something like witch craft, Rowling can ‘fly under the radar’ by carrying religious themes in the series. For the sake of those who have read them, I will not go into specifics, but for those who have, you know what I’m talking about…

Sure, Father could be wrong & J.K. Rowling could be using the stories as a device to get a Christian message across in a “post-Christian culture.” Both are possibilities.(Looking at BBC news from Scotland I see that over 75% of Scots supposedly are in favor of a euthanasia law that would apply to folks over 16 yrs. of age.)

It’s always good to keep an open mind.(Skeptical but open.)
I learn quite a bit on CAF.I had no idea Father was an exorcist & had to check on HLI’s site to see he’d moved back to Florida.And in reading more, he’s very much opposed to Harry Potter because he sees it as a step in the process of desensitizing youth to the occult.Maybe his experiences have radicalized his views a bit.I don’t know but it would make me put up my listening antennae a bit.

 

[Barbkw]

Fr. Euteneuer is the priest being required to perform exorcisms on young adults. Proof that this debate, is neither a false dilemma nor scaremongering.

 

[Mumbles140]

Sure, Father could be wrong & J.K. Rowling could be using the stories as a device to get a Christian message across in a “post-Christian culture.” Both are possibilities.(Looking at BBC news from Scotland I see that over 75% of Scots supposedly are in favor of a euthanasia law that would apply to folks over 16 yrs. of age.)

It’s always good to keep an open mind.(Skeptical but open.)
I learn quite a bit on CAF.I had no idea Father was an exorcist & had to check on HLI’s site to see he’d moved back to Florida.And in reading more, he’s very much opposed to Harry Potter because he sees it as a step in the process of desensitizing youth to the occult.Maybe his experiences have radicalized his views a bit.I don’t know but it would make me put up my listening antennae a bit.

I am not a parent. However, I have been raised by two wonderful parents for 26 years, and have seen my brother raise his 5 kids over the past 4 1/2 years. I think skepticism is good, and the Father’s concerns should raise flags, but I believe those flags should be not letting your child read it until you have read it (obviously until they reach a certain age at which point they can make that decision for themselves), not condemning the whole series.

Obviously, as noted by the poster above, he performs exorcisms on teens, and so is fighting the Devil directly. We all know the occult is a device of the Devil. However, as someone who read the entire series, I do not think reading Harry Potter desensitizes children to the occult. As was previously pointed out, there ‘spells’ are based in Latin and are merely words and a flick of a wand. As another poster pointed out, after reading The Egypt Game, they pretended to be Egyptians, but they knew it was pretending.

Also, I again don’t see how the current events of the United Kingdom affect this discussion. I’m not saying it is Christian allegory, but what I am saying is that she is taking certain religious ideas (sacrifice, strong moral code, hatred of evil) and placing them in her back, pretty forward at times.

I understand ‘putting your antenna up’, but until you read the books, try to understand that some of these comments and allegations made by certain posters make it appear that those who have read the series are ‘playing with the occult’ or ‘don’t follow Church dogmas.’ Again, with all due respect to Fr. Eutenener, his opinion is not authority. It certainly carries some weight, but I do not think it should be taken as rule in matters such as this.