Church without community

[TheLittleLady]

Have you offered to coordinate an evening or Sunday Afternoon of singing/music/fellowship?

Or look at doing Lessons and Carols next year (ours is Thursday evening).

 

[TC3033]

I think they try to have fun…they actually try to do stuff, but when the parish eliminated the biggest fellowship the parish had, I think that everyone went their separate ways and everything after that just feels forced.

Then like I said before, I was going to volunteer to usher before and according to the website I can’t…because not confirmed Catholic. With that I’m not looking at anything else…(and I just bought a new Les Paul…)

 

[Irishmom2]

Your parish won’t even let you be an usher?

 

[Viki63]

I come from a non-denominational background and after being married to my wife for 16 years now…I’ve found it very interesting the lack of “community” there is in the two parishes she’s been a member at.

I raised my first two kids in a non-denominational church, and I think it must depend on where you are and who is in the church. I was alone with 2 small kids, and a couple offered to be sort of godparents to my kids, but we rarely saw them again (they later apologized). We weren’t invited to anything, but we went to church-wide events when people could be bothered to help us get there.(No car) I don’t want to sound whiny, but it was lonely and tough. I have much more fellowship in my Catholic church, as I’ve made friends in my Bible study.
It just really depends.

I can’t…because not confirmed Catholic

I hope you will be able to be confirmed soon. That might solve some of your difficulties,

 

[Peeps]

What was the fellowship in your old church that cannot begin in your new one?

It’s hard to explain Evangelical Protestantism “fellowship” to people who aren’t Catholic. It wasn’t really specific “events,” although there were plenty of these. It was the “family feeling,” .

The Evangelical Protestant church where I play piano on Sunday mornings has a “breakfast gathering” after their Sunday school class and before the worship service (obviously this isn’t an option for Catholics). They bring in pastries, casseroles, fruit, etc. and eat together and talk, talk TALK!

Many Protestant Bible studies and classes are times to talk, talk, TALK! Of course there are “heavy” Bible studies with teachers who have the class flipping all through the Bible and writing notes (many Evangelical Protestants take notes during sermons and other studies)–these studies are one reason why so many Evangelical Protestants can run circles around Catholics.

But many of the Bible studies and prayer meetings involve a lot of discussion, where people share what’s happening in their lives, talk about their besetting sins, give personal testimonies about what God is doing in their lives, and receive prayer and encouragement, and also givemany practical suggestions that don’t involve “studying the saints” but instead, involved getting together with fellow Christians for accountability and help.

Recently my father-in-law was rushed to the Emergency Room and ended up having heart surgery (he’s 84). In our Evangelical Protestant churches, there would have been a crowd of friends from the church gathering at the ER within an hour of the crisis, and they would have sat with us, brought us food, offered to drive us back to the house to pick up items that were needed, and of course, prayed for us. And throughout the week, they would have called us every day to ask how things are going and if they can help by taking my mother-in-law for a few hours (she has been staying with us because of her Alzheimers).

But I don’t think Catholics do that kind of thing with people that they haven’t known since childhood. Sigh.

Anyway, I think it’s a “cultural” thing. Catholicism is not Protestantism, and for all of you who wonder why people don’t come flocking into the Catholic Church because Jesus is there, Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity–well, Jesus didn’t ask anyone to go it alone. The New Testament makes it clear that the Church was constantly together for apostle’s teaching, fellowship, Holy Communion, and prayers. FELLOWSHIP is listed along with teaching, Holy Communion, and prayers–it’s NOT an extra, and it’s NOT a “Protestant thing.”

 

[Peeps]

I’m sorry you’re still having trouble with this.

Do either of you have time to attend daily Mass? That can be a good source of making friends as the same people tend to go every day. As they are leaving they will chat about how they are doing and so forth.

Are there any prayer groups to join, especially any charismatic ones that aren’t too “out there”? Charismatic folk tend to be friendly. Sometimes I have to put them off, they’re so friendly.

Thanks for good wishes–you are always so kind-hearted towards me and others!

Daily Mass isn’t an option as we both work full-time. When I am off work, I often attend Daily Mass, but to be honest, the majority of the people who are friendly are also 20 years older than me and live in the Senior Housing next to the church. The younger people closer to my age seem to be out the door fast–I’m guessing that they work and attend Mass before their workday starts. I don’t have that option as I work a shift job that starts at 7:00 a.m.-

No prayer groups that we know of. I agree that the charismatic Catholics are friendly, and since my husband grew up in the Assemblies of God, we both feel comfortable with them. But we don’t hear about any on-going prayer groups.

I think that’s part of the problem–our big parish bulletin only allows submissions that are part of the official parish activities. I understand the caution–it could be very bad if they publicize something that is not “Catholic” and may cause someone’s faith to waver. But in a parish of several thousand, it makes it hard to know what’s going on outside of the parish.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I understand your frustration. However, I think it needs to be said that there are also many, many Protestant churches that don’t have that kind of fellowship. My father-in-law was a member of his Protestant church for many years, he was also active in the community and belonged to various service organizations, and he volunteered a lot in town, etc . When he became ill, I don’t remember any person from his church or community group really bothering to do much. Nobody visited (either at home or the hospital). My brother-in-law and his wife, who was herself a lifelong member of a different Protestant church where everybody knew her, pretty much were handling everything largely on their own (my husband helped some but he was working and living several hours away and couldn’t do much). When my FIL finally passed away, the minister who came from his church, who was fairly new, clearly didn’t even know who he was or that he’d been so active in the church and said some things during the service that made my in-laws upset (rightly so).

I think there are a lot of churches, not just Catholic, where whole groups of members don’t get all involved in the personal ups and downs of the members. I am also aware of some Catholics, such as members of my prayer group, who become ill or end up in the physical rehab center and have large numbers of Catholics from the prayer group visiting them. One guy had a stroke and had dozens of visitors, they were all reporting back how he was on a daily basis, because he was friends wiht everyone through the prayer group activities.

It’s all about whether you get into some group of people who do regard the group as a “family” or close enough to be all up in their business.

I hope you are able to make some connections with people in any event.

 

[Irishmom2]

Other than changing breakfast to after mass, I don’t see anything there that couldn’t be done at a Catholic Church. Someone, (maybe you? ) just needs to start it up.

And do not rule out friends that are older than you. Currently, my friends are all 20 years older than me and I enjoy my time with them immensely. I have learned a lot from them and their life experience.

 

[TheLittleLady]

I hope you will be able to be confirmed soon. That might solve some of your difficulties,

@TC3033 is committed to his faith and has not talked about converting. His spouse is Catholic

 

[TheLittleLady]

it could be very bad if they publicize something that is not “Catholic” and may cause someone’s faith to waver. But in a parish of several thousand, it makes it hard to know what’s going on outside of the parish.

As the bulletin person in a large parish, we have a strict rule about what gets printed in the bulletin due to space available, this is the priority:

Things REQUIRED by the Diocese
Things happening on our parish grounds, social, liturgical, fund raisers, fellowship, etc.
Things from the School.
Other things from the Diocese.
Things from neighboring parishes
Things that are “extracurricular” for instance advertising life insurance from the Knights.

We rarely have things from # 4, 5 or 6 because there is no room.

Those things go on our Facebook page, Website, etc.

We have an online google calendar that lists everything. At a large parish, I’d imagine they have a social media presence.

 

[TC3033]

It just really depends.

I guess it could. From my experience the two parishes my wife has been doesn’t have a whole lot of “community”. I remember shortly after our “family” joined there I wasn’t invited to help with the biggest event of the year. The next year came and gone and the same thing…finally I asked my wife why. “You’re not Catholic, so you’re not a member”.

I hope you will be able to be confirmed soon. That might solve some of your difficulties,

Probably not I’m comfortable with my faith. Why should I being a confirmed Catholic now have me “in” on more volunteering or being part of the “community”.

 

[Viki63]

Sorry, I assumed you wanted to be part of the community. If you did become Catholic, you could join more easily in events and volunteering. People may be assuming that you don’t want to.

 

[LisaB]

For those who recommend volunteering, it doesn’t always lead to community. I used to volunteer in my parish’s nursery, and while I met some women who served with me and we talked, I still didn’t feel a part of any community. Now I teach confirmation at another parish, and not only is there no community, but I haven’t even met the other teachers. Everyone just comes, teaches class and leaves.

I also went through a year long adult catechism class at my parish a few years ago, and again, we came, learned and left. No community outside class.

 

[Peeps]

For those who recommend volunteering, it doesn’t always lead to community. I used to volunteer in my parish’s nursery, and while I met some women who served with me and we talked, I still didn’t feel a part of any community. Now I teach confirmation at another parish, and not only is there no community, but I haven’t even met the other teachers. Everyone just comes, teaches class and leaves.

I also went through a year long adult catechism class at my parish a few years ago, and again, we came, learned and left. No community outside class.

I “liked” your post not because I agree that it’s a good thing, but because I agree that what you are saying is true. It’s the way things really are in 2019 in the U.S…

I don’t “like” this aspect of Catholicism, but I think it’s the way things are in many parishes.

My husband and I have hopes of retiring to a small town in Northern Illinois, and we have visited the parish there for Mass. We have hopes that perhaps in a small town, we will have more friends in the parish who are interested in getting together outside of the church building.

But I have to admit that I am doubtful. I think it’s just “Catholic Culture” at this time in history. Everyone is in their own busy life and there is hardly enough time for that life, let alone adding someone else to the life.

 

[Irishmom2]

I just want to throw this out there.

Just because you belong to a group at church, or volunteer at church does not mean you will make friends. It is the same as anywhere. If you want to make a friend, be a friend. Sometimes people are afraid to reach out and say, here, I brought cookies for everyone. Or let’s all go for coffee next week afterward. Little things like that are appreciated and can get things moving toward conversations not directly related to the group which can develop into friendships.

 

[Peeps]

Other than changing breakfast to after mass, I don’t see anything there that couldn’t be done at a Catholic Church. Someone, (maybe you? ) just needs to start it up.

And do not rule out friends that are older than you. Currently, my friends are all 20 years older than me and I enjoy my time with them immensely. I have learned a lot from them and their life experience.

Thanks. Not likely that I will “start anything up” on Sundays or Saturday evenings, at least until I retire (hopefully five years from now). I work. Two Sundays a month, sometimes more. I attend a Saturday or Sunday evening Mass.

Our parish has tried to start up “fellowships” before and after Mass, and they have all failed to attract any interest.

Evangelical Protestant “fellowship” is not about events, activities, programs, Bible studies, etc. It’s a “Culture” that is part of Evangelical Protestantism that is simply NOT part of Catholic Christianity.

I play piano regularly in an Evangelical Protestant church, and when I am there, I am part of their fellowship and their “family.” I have been included in everything they do and all their activities (although I can’t always attend or take part). I will be presenting a workshop at one of the denominational women’s conferences this spring–can you even imagine an Evangelical PROTESTANT on the speaker’s roster for a CAF conference!!!

It’s just the way Evangelical Protestantism is, although I have to say that it seems to be disappearing as many of the Evangelical Protestant churches keep experiencing splits, scandals (yes, there are plenty of “sex” scandals in non-Catholic churches), and conflicts. There is an interesting article in the current issue of Christianity Today (for 50 years, the un-official magazine of Evangelical Protestantism) about how “church life” has not been “passed on” to children, who are now leaving organized Christianity in droves. (We have seen this in Catholicism, too, at least here in the U.S.).

But it’s not “activities” that create fellowship. It’s fellowship that creates activities.

 

[TC3033]

Sorry, I assumed you wanted to be part of the community.

Well, my wife and kids are all parish members…so if they’re part of the community it would be kind of nice to be included.

If you did become Catholic, you could join more easily in events and volunteering.

This is my point, why should I have to be a confirmed Catholic to be part of events and volunteering???

People may be assuming that you don’t want to.

I guess that’s a big assumption to make.

 

[Irishmom2]

Well then, I really am more confused than ever by what you see as fellowship. You may need to define it for me because if you are saying that activities don’t create fellowship, but that fellowship creates activity, where is the fellowship originating from? It is not some undefinable quality that only Protestant churches have, but that is what some people seem to imply. So please define it so that I can understand it better.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I’m guessing that Peeps’ experience was with a smaller Protestant church, where there is a big focus on personal contact and visiting and shared activities both as a way of keeping the church going and keeping people in the church.

It’s not uncommon for those types of churches to function as extended social clubs. Things like meals and hospital visitation are considered important parts of the church ministry. Catholic churches are sometimes like this, especially when they are serving a homogenous community such as recent immigrants from one country. When Catholic churches get bigger and less homogenous, the groups tend to fragment and you don’t get the same kind of response unless you happen to be involved in some particular prayer group, moms or womens’ group, social ministry group etc that treats its members more like an extended family and keeps up with what’s happening with them.

 

[hoping4more]

So the lesson is…
You will not get that much out of your church unless it is one you went to your whole life?

We are attending the same church my wife attended since she was 12, and she might know two women her age as acquaintances.

As I said in the op volunteering for 1.5 years has yielded nothing in this regard. I guess if I do this another 20 years the kids I am teaching will be adults with their own kids…ugh