Climate Change News 4

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Peebo said:
Great Barrier Reef headed for ‘massive death’

I don’t know much about climate change but when the worlds leading authority on coral reefs sounds an alarm at least I’m willing to see what he has to say unless I have a level of scientific knowledge to counter his
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How is he an expert on planetary catastrophes? He sounds like an alarmist rather than a scientist.

It’s not unprecedented


Other scientists also believe a LOWERING of sea level cased much of the warming. The lowering (not rising) was caused by el nino (not Man) which resulted in abnormal temperatures.
https://www.biogeosciences.net/14/817/2017/
 
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So he’s a former chief scientist at the Australian Institute of Marine Science…and spent 45 years studying the Great Barrier Reef and has personally discovered nearly a quarter of the worlds coral species…but to your expert scientific knowledge he’s more an alarmist than a scientist…perhaps you’ll allow us your own scientific studies so we can evaluate and decide who to believe…
 
Peebo said:
So he’s a former chief scientist at the Australian Institute of Marine Science…and spent 45 years studying the Great Barrier Reef and has personally discovered nearly a quarter of the worlds coral species…but to your expert scientific knowledge he’s more an alarmist than a scientist…perhaps you’ll allow us your own scientific studies so we can evaluate and decide who to believe…
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None of that makes him an expert on world ending catastrophes, as the article indicated.

I provided you with evidence it’s hardly the first time for their barrier reef to go through a similar crisis.
 
Theo520 said:
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Peebo:
So he’s a former chief scientist at the Australian Institute of Marine Science…and spent 45 years studying the Great Barrier Reef and has personally discovered nearly a quarter of the worlds coral species…but to your expert scientific knowledge he’s more an alarmist than a scientist…perhaps you’ll allow us your own scientific studies so we can evaluate and decide who to believe…
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None of that makes him an expert on world ending catastrophes, as the article indicated.
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But that does make him an expert on catastrophes of coral reefs, which you dispute when you go on to say…
I provided you with evidence it’s hardly the first time for their barrier reef to go through a similar crisis.
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Theo520 said:
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LeafByNiggle:
But that does make him an expert on catastrophes of coral reefs, which you dispute when you go on to say…
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How do you imagine I’m disputing that the GBR coral is in serious trouble?
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Because you cite previous catastrophes from which the coral recovered. I cannot image why you would cite such results other than to diminish the seriousness of the present situation. But perhaps I misunderstood why you cited those past incidents? (I don’t dispute that they happened just as you say. I just wonder why you cited them in relation to the current debate.)
 

CO2, Global Warming and Coral Reefs: Craig Idso: 9780971484580: Amazon.com: Books

CO2, Global Warming and Coral Reefs [Craig Idso] on Amazon.com. *FREE* shipping on qualifying offers. CO2, Global Warming and Coral Reefs
www.amazon.com

This little book is quite deceptive in that its 67 pages of text provide a very wide ranging review of the research on coral reefs. The amount of detail is so great that I read many paragraphs multiple times and felt at the end that I had read a much longer book.

Dr. Idso is to be commended for this excellent review of the research on the state of these fascinating underwater ecosystems. Those 23 additional pages listing the many references are no joke. I was surprised at the amount of detailed research being done on coral. I don’t even want to try and count the number of researchers involved. Or the many fine experiments and observational studies carried out.

As CO2 increases in the atmosphere it of course also increases in the ocean (some have suggested at a 1 to 50 ratio). There have been predictions that increased ocean temperature and acidity will reduce rates of coral calcification, weaken coral skeletons and cause coral death.

Dr. Idso reports that contrary to the models predictions there is no simple link between high ocean temperatures and coral bleaching, and that corals adapt and respond to their environment. Many times this is a replacement of the zooxanthellae during stress induced bleaching by varieties that are more tolerant of that particular stress.

Coral reefs have persisted through geologic time (about 200 million years for scleractinian corals, much, much longer than humans have existed) and in sea temperatures 10-15 degrees C warmer than at present. They have also survived periods when CO2 concentrations were 2 to 7 times higher. Thus coral survival seems to be more closely related to the rate of external change and their ability to adapt.

Predicted rises in sea level likewise are well within the growth rates of coral and will in fact allow for the expansion of coral in many areas.

Coral is bleaching in some areas and thriving in others. Its overall health appears very good with real world observations contradicting the results of the climate models and often refuting their predictions.

There is too much in this book to even list the major topics, but readers will be well rewarded if you have any interest in the effects of additional CO2 and the state of research in the marine world.
 
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LeafByNiggle said:
Because you cite previous catastrophes from which the coral recovered. I cannot image why you would cite such results other than to diminish the seriousness of the present situation. But perhaps I misunderstood why you cited those past incidents? (I don’t dispute that they happened just as you say. I just wonder why you cited them in relation to the current debate.)
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Can’t both be true, that the coral is in serious trouble and that it has recovered from similar catastrophes in the past?

I cited the article because the OP indicated the occurrence was catastrophic for the globe, not just the GBR.
 

CLIMATE CHANGE DOESN’T DOOM CORAL REEFS​

Two more recent papers indicate coral reefs are much more adaptable to environmental changes than global warming alarmists claim.

One paper, published in Frontiers in Marine Science, finds coral bleaching has been common off and on for at least the last 400 years, long before humans began adding significant carbon dioxide emissions to the atmosphere. Examining 44 core samples from Australia’s Great Barrier Reef (GBR), researchers from the University of Glasgow and the University of Edinburgh were able to reconstruct a history of bleaching events since 1620.

Bleaching occurs when one or a combination of stressors disrupt the symbiotic relationship between coral and the tiny algae living inside it, causing the coral to expel the algae, leaving it a stark white. While algae can be reabsorbed when the stressors are reduced or corals adapt, corals will die if this separation lasts too long. The stressors the researchers found instigate bleaching alone or in combination include sharp increases or decreases in ocean temperatures, solar irradiance extremes, disease, and freshwater runoff.

The researchers reconstructed GBR bleaching patterns and frequencies decade by decade since approximately 1620, finding the number and extent of bleaching events increased between 1620 and 1753, decreased from 1754 to 1820, and increased again between 1821 and 2001.

This research indicates GBR corals have been able to acclimatize to and recover from both temperature-induced and non-temperature-induced bleaching events over time.

A second study, published in the journal Current Biology , examines the relationship between corals, their symbiotic micro-algae, and climate over a much longer period of time, “finding coral-algal partnerships have endured numerous climate change events” for at least 160 million years.

Using genetic evidence, “including DNA sequences, phylogenetic analyses and genome comparisons,” the researchers determined the coral/micro-algae partnership has waxed and waned since the time of the dinosaurs, when ocean temperatures were much warmer than today.

“Our research indicates that modern corals and their algal partners, … [d]uring their long existence, … have faced severe episodes of environmental change, but thanks to their biological characteristics have managed to bounce back after each,” said Christian Voolstra, Ph.D., a coauthor of the study, who is an Associate Professor of Marine Science in the Red Sea Research Center at King Abdullah University of Science and Technology.

SOURCES: [Terra Daily](http://click.icptrack.com/icp/relay.php?

Reef_corals_have_endured_since_age_of_dinosaurs_and_may_survive_global_warming_999.html); [Global Warming Policy Foundation](http://click.icptrack.com/icp/relay.php?

coral-bleaching-goes-back-four-centuries-new-study%2F); [Frontiers in Marine Science]
Freef-corals-have-endured-since-the-age-of-dinosaurs-and-may-survive-global-warming)
 

click here google youtube green

Stossel examines the wisdom of recycling programs and the sustainability movement.
 
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The Simpsons made the point better when Principal Skinner said the money they got from the paper drive was not enough to pay for the gas to go the store to buy the string they used to tie up the papers.
 
I watched this guy’s video. I totally disagree with his personal conclusions, of which there are many. Also note the deceptive vertical scale on the graph at 9:00 into the video. He seems to have a personal axe to grind.
 
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Theo520 said:
I think a massive shift to replace coal/NG with nuclear electricity generation is the only one that makes sense economically and could work in developing world. In 60 yrs we could stabilize if not reverse the trend in CO2 output levels.
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Maybe. But I think this country still doesn’t know what to do with its nuclear waste. I read recently where France, after all these decades, is going to bury it in deep tunnels soon. To my understanding, France presently ships it to Russia where it goes somewhere-or-other-that-nobody-knows.
 
Useful newsletter

http://www.sepp.org/the-week-that-was.cfm

excerpt:

TWTW does not consider that there is a need to abandon fossil fuels, but the recommendations give some idea of what consumers may face as politicians force more erratic “green energy” onto the grid, which must be subsidized by all consumers on the grid to be made reliable. See links under Energy Issues – Australia.

http://joannenova.com.au/2018/09/40...es-100m-profit-and-will-run-another-30-years/

And also:

All that CO2 in the last 50 years and droughts are less common in Australia

By Jo Nova, Her Blog, Sep 7, 2018

http://joannenova.com.au/2018/09/all-that-co2-in-the-last-50-years-and-droughts-are-less- common-in-australia/
 
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