Combining Last Names for Marriage?

[gardenswithkids]

Thank you. My intention was to see which of the names were most popular and if anyone had any special insight into this new idea it was welcome. I should have lowered my expectations for politeness and kindness on the internet though

Some of you have been wonderful. Thank you for your wise words. Others have been, well, less so. But this foray back onto this site has made me remember why I quit coming here. I get harshly judged enough in person. There’s no need for me to come onto the internet to have it here too.

Selfish, ridiculous feminist over and out

LOL, I repeatedly try to leave this site, only to come back again. It’s addictive. If you’re like me, you can try to escape, but you’ll be back.

It’s hard. On the one hand we as Catholics should be warm and welcoming to others. But…not every idea and new thing that people want to embrace is good. :shrug:We shouldn’t be welcoming of evil, but some ideas are neither good nor bad on moral grounds. Things-- like names --are usually morally neutral, but there is lots of meaning and emotions surrounding names. Your suggestion of chaning family names that go back many generations strikes me as something that is morally neutral, yet it has implications that you haven’t considered. It struck my emotions, even though I recognize it’s morally neutral and you didn’t have bad intentions.

Both you and your fiance have family names that sound nice to my ears. Setting aside any symbolism (good or bad) of changing the names, none of those sound as nice as your original names. And the meanings of the names would change. Names means things and taking a syllable or group of letters out of order changes their meaning. In English the suffix “est” is a superlative so “Bennest”–could mean “The most Ben”? For is an English preposition…I’ll stop there, but you get the idea. You change the meaning of the names when you tear them apart. Your family names have* wonderful* original meanings.

Since you don’t have a love for geneology and I do, I did a bit of digging for you. Have you ever looked at the meaning of your fiance’s family name? I did. searchforancestors.com/surnames/origin/b/benoit.php It’s a French surname that means “blessed”. ** “Benoit” strikes me a highly desirable family name. You could be part of The Blessed Family, (but changing it to the English translation sounds a bit too self-righteous.)

Forrest is also a nice name. surnames.meaning-of-names.com/forrest/ “Keeper of the royal forrest”-that’s really nice. Might I suggest that “Forrest” would make a fabulous middle for yourself and/or for your children?

 

[AthenaC]

It’s hard. On the one hand we as Catholics should be warm and welcoming to others. But…not every idea and new thing that people want to embrace is good. :shrug:We shouldn’t be welcoming of evil, but some ideas are neither good nor bad on moral grounds.

Part of the issue is that it’s not as obvious to everyone what is evil (and thus deserving of all the righteous indignation we can throw at it) and what is morally neutral, or even what is good. Some posters see the failure of a woman to take her husband’s name as an evil, cancer-on-the-soul-of-society type issue, and there will be no convincing these individuals that a name is morally neutral.

But back on topic, I just remembered something (been a while since I gave this issue thought). Back when I got married for the first time, I didn’t want to get rid of my maiden name. I am very proud of it and it has a rich heritage (in my humble opinion of course). So my solution was to drop my middle name and adopt my maiden name as my middle name, while taking my husband’s name as my last name. To me, this satisfied both objectives of two people becoming one family but not losing the heritage I was born with. Also, I hated my birth middle name. If you like your middle name, there’s nothing wrong with four names. I learned from experience that if you go to the Social Security Administration with a marriage certificate, you can literally change your name to whatever you want. No one seemed to care either time I went in.

So here’s what my name looks like:

At birth: Athena Brunhilda Richardthelionheart
At marriage: Athena Richardthelionheart Carson
Common form of address: Mrs. Carson
Name on business cards and work email signature: Athena Richardthelionheart Carson

So I use both my maiden and married name reasonably frequently. As a general rule, I will use the whole thing in writing (such as my email signature and business cards) but when speaking I just go by Mrs. Carson or Athena Carson. Fewer syllables that way and doesn’t catch on the tongue quite as frequently.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

Why don’t you both hyphenate your names? That’s what my fiance and I are doing. We will both have each others names added to our own. We will be giving our kids a hyphenated last name. I’m not too concerned about the practicality of it for future generations, because they will all eventually change their last names too. But FH and I are forever. Even after the kids are grown and have families of their own.

But for us we liked the symbolism. I’m not joining his family. We are coming together to start a new one, both of us bringing our heritage, knowlwdge, experiences, pasts, etc to the table. We wanted to show that in our names.

 

[sweetpetunia]

In the same way that I won’t let the Westboro Baptist church take the word “Christian” away from me

This made me lol. I hope nobody actually tried to say this to you! Anyone who would attempt to conflate a waning cult consisting of only two biological families with a religious movement that consists of billions of followers is either a) profoundly ignorant or b) intellectually dishonest. Unfortunately, “Feminists for Life” is about as mainstream as “Catholics for Choice”*. Case in point, look at any mainstream university’s description or course outline for women or feminist studies. (e.g., stanford.edu/dept/femstudies/ ) I highly doubt that Mulieris Dignitatem is going to find its way to the reading list.

(*Disclaimer; I fullly realize that every analogy limps, and that historical feminists were able to fully reconcile pro-life, pro-family views with the feminist agenda (e.g., women’s vote and other first-wave issues). I further recognize that “Catholics for Choice” is inherently a contradiction in terms, whereas “Feminists for Life” should not be, considering the (albeit contrary to mainstream feminist) view that abortion actually harms women. The point of the analogy is, that in terms of fungiblity, Feminists for Life (or feminists in the JPII sense of the word) is not interconvertible with the feminist movement. Mainstream feminism values “sexual expression” and “reproductive freedom” in a way that is incompatible with the tenets of Catholicism.)

 

[ThyKingdomCome]

Of course, do what you want to do, but many of the objections that people have raised bring up valid points. I suggest you think in depth about what it will be like in 30 years, depending on what choice you make.

I have a friend who hyphenated her last name along with her husband. So they are now both knowns as “Smith-Jones” (name changed for privacy). They made that decision at the time of their wedding for similar reasons that you are describing. She regrets it now, some 20+ years later. But think about her children. What happens to Johnny Smith-Jones when he marries Sally Sanchez-Rosenberg. Do they become Johnny and Sally Sanchez-Smith-Roseberg-Jones? What about THEIR children??? Of course, no one would do that to themselves, and the children of said couple would just come up with their own idea. One problem with that is that there is a continuity loss. Also, think about it. If your daughter is Sally Sanchez-Rosenberg, and she marries Bob White, you’re almost guaranteeing that your grandchildren will have the last name “White” because it’s just easier that way.

Also think about if you would like your own children and grandchildren to carry on your family name at all. You might not be looking at it from that perspective, because you don’t have children and grandchildren yet. But if you find yourself thinking you’d like it, consider keeping your original names.

I like the idea of using your maiden name as a middle name. My maiden name is now a second middle name. I didn’t want to lose it altogether, but I also don’t feel at all “defined by my husband” just because I now have his last name. If you and your husband would like to share a last name, adding a middle name to both of your names is a great idea. Or using your last name as the middle name of your children, or even a first name, would be fine.

My married last name is a common first name as well as a last name. My sister in law (who no longer goes by that name), gave one of her children that name as a first name. Two of her sisters (who also have different last names) have used the same family name as middle names of their children. They all feel a strong sense of identity associated with their family name, and have found ways to keep it in the family.

 

[chevalier]

Without the benefit of reading all the other posts, I’d like to say it’s your decision, there is no specific, overwhelming reason not to, and various things have been done like that by people already. I’m a man and my name is a much weirder case than what you’re talking about.

On the other hand, I would like to ask you to consider what Dakota has said:

I hope you realize that combining names makes it extremely hard for genealogical research, for the sake of posterity please don’t.

Well the guy doesn’t get to define himself, he was defined by his father and his father didn’t get to define himself, he was defined by his father.

Basically make sure the guy isn’t going along with your plan because he wants to be nice while he feels like he’s being emasculated. (It’s easy to overlook people’s reservations when they aren’t voicing them aloud and we’re very enthusiastic about something. So be careful especially if it’s your idea and not his.)

As someone who has some experience with genealogy and such stuff, I suggest you do spend some time thinking about how it will feel 30 years from now, like another poster has suggested. “Eccentric” (and I don’t mean it in a bad sense necessarily) things are easier to do than to undo.

Why don’t you both hyphenate your names? That’s what my fiance and I are doing. We will both have each others names added to our own. We will be giving our kids a hyphenated last name. I’m not too concerned about the practicality of it for future generations, because they will all eventually change their last names too.

With all due respect and all, you don’t know that.

I’d generally think long and hard before giving children hyphenated names or something that sounds like an aristocratic pretence in a middle-class neighbourhood, especially in a democratic society. Even though I’m a guy with a hyphenated name myself.

My thought is that the idea is ridiculous.

I also think the rationale behind it smacks of feminist programming.

I would inded suggest examining the reasons for the incentive to ignore the old ways and do something else. Including feminist programming.

For the record, please don’t find this to be an attack, insult, or anything demeaning. I task myself with a review of my own motivations like this from time to time too, including some not particularly great motivations too. And sometimes I find those in me and have to deal with them then. Anyway, don’t make a guy take pains for the sake of a feminist feeling. Keep him strong and manly.

And for the record, since somebody mentioned a totally new, non-hyphenated name, like taking a syllable from here and a syllable from there. Think long and hard before doing anything like that. Don’t cut your roots, don’t make things hard on your family and friends. Unless your really know what you’re doing.

Surnames are not really sacred, they haven’t always been around, they generally go back to late middle ages in western Europe (and by extension the USA), depending on the region. People have changed them. You can too. But it’s a very hard decision, hard to get used to. Hard to undo. Results in a new mess with every new change. Not a decision to be taken on a romantic or other emotional impulse.

 

[maryjk]

Surnames are not really sacred, they haven’t always been around, they generally go back to late middle ages in western Europe (and by extension the USA), depending on the region. People have changed them. You can too. But it’s a very hard decision, hard to get used to. Hard to undo. Results in a new mess with every new change. Not a decision to be taken on a romantic or other emotional impulse.

I just can’t imagine having to explain it to everyone.

Yes, my name used to be Jones, but I married Sue Smith and we both changed our last name to Smones.

I guess it would be okay if you didn’t have any family or friends before you got married. Otherwise the comments you go on this site are just the beginning.

 

[AllSeasons]

Just speaking personally as a guy, if I changed my last name or combined it with my future wife’s last name or whatever, my dad would probably be very, very upset. I’d be okay with my wife not taking my last name, but I’m not going to change mine. It’s a personal preference, but a very, very firm one.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

With all due respect and all, you don’t know that.

I’d generally think long and hard before giving children hyphenated names or something that sounds like an aristocratic pretence in a middle-class neighbourhood, especially in a democratic society. Even though I’m a guy with a hyphenated name myself.

I’m not going to make decisions for my family based on whether or not someone will find them pretentious. It makes sense for us to take each other’s names, and as our children will be a part of our family they will get the family name. If they have an issue with that they can change it at 18, or when they get married and start their own families. But my husband and I are stuck together for life. We are becoming one and we wanted something that really reflected that.

 

[EasterJoy]

Thank you. My intention was to see which of the names were most popular and if anyone had any special insight into this new idea it was welcome. I should have lowered my expectations for politeness and kindness on the internet though

Some of you have been wonderful. Thank you for your wise words. Others have been, well, less so. But this foray back onto this site has made me remember why I quit coming here. I get harshly judged enough in person. There’s no need for me to come onto the internet to have it here too.

Selfish, ridiculous feminist over and out

The Original Poster has left the building…

 

[Tietjen]

Thank you. My intention was to see which of the names were most popular and if anyone had any special insight into this new idea it was welcome.

By “special insight” did you mean only if it was in favor of creating a new name?

I should have lowered my expectations for politeness and kindness on the internet though

Some of you have been wonderful. Thank you for your wise words. Others have been, well, less so. But this foray back onto this site has made me remember why I quit coming here. I get harshly judged enough in person. There’s no need for me to come onto the internet to have it here too.

Selfish, ridiculous feminist over and out

I have to say that my original reply, made when the OP began the thread, was basically that she should reconsider her decision. I still stand by that, yet I’m sorry that she feels beat up by posters when she asked for opinions. If she would have just stated at the beginning that she only wanted opinions in support of her decision, perhaps she’d have been happier. If I come on here and said that I have made a decision to buy a Volkswagen and want opinions about the color, I can’t imagine getting hurt or upset if posters gave me their opinions about the car itself too. Why be a victim? I stayed silent after posting my original reply but I kept reading the other posts and I didn’t see anything that should have been viewed as insulting… just people’s opinions, which is what the OP asked for.

 

[Debora123]

The Original Poster has left the building…

…And I don’t blame her.

 

[adrift]

By “special insight” did you mean only if it was in favor of creating a new name?

I have to say that my original reply, made when the OP began the thread, was basically that she should reconsider her decision. I still stand by that, yet I’m sorry that she feels beat up by posters when she asked for opinions. If she would have just stated at the beginning that she only wanted opinions in support of her decision, perhaps she’d have been happier. If I come on here and said that I have made a decision to buy a Volkswagen and want opinions about the color, I can’t imagine getting hurt or upset if posters gave me their opinions about the car itself too. Why be a victim? I stayed silent after posting my original reply but I kept reading the other posts and I didn’t see anything that should have been viewed as insulting… just people’s opinions, which is what the OP asked for.

I was curious about her reaction. She signed off as selfish feminist. The only time selfish was used was in her post. Feminist was used in the sense of where the idea of not taking yours husband’s name originated.

It also seemed to me that those who questioned the wisdom of what she was doing was attacked.