Communion at Protestant churches

[peary]

It’s not “hard feelings.” It’s just that we are not allowed to make it look as though Protestant communion has anything at all in common with Catholic Communion. It would be totally dishonest to do that. As Catholics, we are supposed to be honest people.

I do not think that I am making it look as though their communion has anything at all in common with Catholic communion. They have a different theology of it than the Church. They knows this; I know this. But, as I said, it is an ‘open’ communion service offered to everybody from any denomination. It is a symbolic service for them. Like I said, where two or more or gathered, HE IS THERE. And I also said, I do not encourage protestants to receive communion in a Catholic Church because of their rejection of the priesthood and use of invalid materials. There are more important matters to attend to and fences to mend with our separated brethren than attending a symbolic communion service. That’s just my opinion. Take it or leave it.:dts:

 

[Kitty_Chan]

It’s not “hard feelings.” It’s just that we are not allowed to make it look as though Protestant communion has anything at all in common with Catholic Communion. It would be totally dishonest to do that. As Catholics, we are supposed to be honest people.

Well they certainly appear hard, Im not going to stick my neck in because it was a love fest going on

Peary has said she has made it clear there is differences, I dont know why you cant take her for her word.

Having said that I take objection to at least one part your stating above. You said your not allowed to make it look like there is anything at all in common.

What about Jesus? I guess its a different Jesus in a Catholic church then a protestant one. Maybe its a trick done with mirrors.

sigh

 

[LilyM]

I do not think that I am making it look as though their communion has anything at all in common with Catholic communion. They have a different theology of it than the Church. They knows this; I know this. But, as I said, it is an ‘open’ communion service offered to everybody from any denomination. It is a symbolic service for them. Like I said, where two or more or gathered, HE IS THERE. And I also said, I do not encourage protestants to receive communion in a Catholic Church because of their rejection of the priesthood and use of invalid materials. There are more important matters to attend to and fences to mend with our separated brethren than attending a symbolic communion service. That’s just my opinion. Take it or leave it.:dts:

Different theology? WRONG theology. Christ instituted ONE Eucharist at the Last Supper, in which was contained His Real Presence. Full stop. He didn’t institute two separate Eucharists, one real and one symbolic. Any symbolic bread and wine is in no way a Eucharist. Yet Protestants purport it to be such. Instead it is a mockery and a sham of the Real Presence.

And you’re saying by your actions that this wrong theology, this false eucharist, is as valid as the Catholic theology and the Catholic Real Presence?

And by taking communion in a Protestant Church you are agreeing with, condoning and endorsing their rejection of the Catholic priesthood and their use of invalid materials and all the other things you’ve acknowledged are barriers to their receiving Catholic communion!

 

[jmcrae]

Well they certainly appear hard, Im not going to stick my neck in because it was a love fest going on

There are such things as love feasts (church suppers) in the Catholic Church, to which everyone is welcome to attend, including Protestants and unbelievers - they are much more substantial than just a cracker and grape juice, though.

Peary has said she has made it clear there is differences, I dont know why you cant take her for her word.

Well, obviously there are differences. The differences are why we are not allowed to inter-commune.

Having said that I take objection to at least one part your stating above. You said your not allowed to make it look like there is anything at all in common.

What about Jesus? I guess its a different Jesus in a Catholic church then a protestant one. Maybe its a trick done with mirrors.

sigh

Even Protestants will freely admit that Jesus is not substantially present in their service of Holy Communion. They don’t believe that He is any more present to them there than He is in ordinary prayer - you can see this by how they treat the “left-overs,” which are either thrown out, or used for something completely unrelated to Holy Communion. (The ladies at my Protestant church used to take them home and use them for turkey stuffing, and for making croutons for salad.)

 

[snowfly]

I have often heard that Protestants should not receive holy Communion at Catholic Mass, and totaly agree that they should not…But is it permissable for us Catholics to participate in Protestant communion services???

No !

 

[Kitty_Chan]

There are such things as love feasts (church suppers) in the Catholic Church, to which everyone is welcome to attend, including Protestants and unbelievers - they are much more substantial than just a cracker and grape juice, though.

Thats wonderful you have love fests at your church, great I picked a name of something, rather than a description. I was commenting on the boards here. It isnt a love fest. I will try to explain it again. I jumped in because it wasnt a love fest and you can all say what you will, but there is hard feelings. Or else I would not have felt compelled to jump in.

Edited to add
as for the love fest being more substantial than communion at a protestant church, you mean to say at love fests protestants can take Eucharist? because thats whats more substantial. The body and blood, which I happen to believe I may add.

Or is it just cake and cookies at a informal gathering to find out more about the church is more substaintial than protestants partaking communion on a sunday.??

Well, obviously there are differences. The differences are why we are not allowed to inter-commune.

no you did not speak to differences you said

your not allowed to make it look like there is anything at all in common.

Im simply stating that there is something common and thats Jesus.

Even Protestants will freely admit that Jesus is not substantially present in their service of Holy Communion. They don’t believe that He is any more present to them there than He is in ordinary prayer.

So now youre saying Jesus is there but only in second rate ordinary prayer. Hes there or Hes not.

Some see the wine and bread and some see the body and blood, but each sees Jesus.

• you can see this by how they treat the “left-overs,” which are either thrown out, or used for something completely unrelated to Holy Communion. (The ladies at my Protestant church used to take them home and use them for turkey stuffing, and for making croutons for salad.)

Im sorry the ladies at your old church were irreverant towards the left overs. I have never seen it. In fact the Pastor at my sons church takes care of it himself. You have said that before as proof. All it is is proof of one bunch in a whole lot act poorly. Its not charitiable to paint a organization by the actions of 1 is it??

 

[jmcrae]

As for the love fest being more substantial than communion at a protestant church, you mean to say at love fests protestants can take Eucharist?

It’s not the Eucharist. They can partake of the food and drink freely, and chat with people, and sing and dance.

because thats whats more substantial. The body and blood, which I happen to believe I may add.

You might like to ask your pastor what the official teaching of your church is about Holy Communion.

I have never heard of any Protestant church that officially taught the doctrine of Transubstantiation. Most of them consider it merely symbolic, and the rest consider it to be various different kinds of spiritual experience, but the bread and wine itself is still always just bread and wine, and once you’ve partaken of Christ’s spirit in the elements, the elements no longer serve a religious purpose, and you can do anything you want with them.

Im sorry the ladies at your old church were irreverant towards the left overs. I have never seen it. In fact the Pastor at my sons church takes care of it himself. You have said that before as proof. All it is is proof of one bunch in a whole lot act poorly. Its not charitiable to paint a organization by the actions of 1 is it??

My point is, they were not being irreverent. They were sincerely following the official teaching of that Church, which is that the elements themselves are nothing more than what they appear to be - once the service of Holy Communion is over, you can do anything you want with them, because they are not substantially the body and blood of Jesus Christ.

 

[Kitty_Chan]

It’s not the Eucharist. They can partake of the food and drink freely, and chat with people, and sing and dance.

Then what you said about “they are much more substantial than just a cracker and grape juice, though.” means the love fests are better than the protestant communion?? Thats how its coming across.

You might like to ask your pastor what the official teaching of your church is about Holy Communion.

I have never heard of any Protestant church that officially taught the doctrine of Transubstantiation. Most of them consider it merely symbolic, and the rest consider it to be various different kinds of spiritual experience, but the bread and wine itself is still always just bread and wine, and once you’ve partaken of Christ’s spirit in the elements, the elements no longer serve a religious purpose, and you can do anything you want with them.

Dont have a particular Pastor. my sons Pastor on Sunday was clear it was symbolic. However it was not** merely **symbolic, there is a huge difference.

I have no confusion, I see things differently thats all. He said symbolic I see body and blood. But thats only part of it.

I mention the ladies because youve mentioned them quite a few times, it obviously bugs you and to that Im sorry, but I still say in the circles Ive been in I havent seen people stuffing with turkeys. You have to admit that is a little over the top even if one doesnt believe in real pressence. If nothing else its in bad form.

When wording like stuffing with turkeys, merely, the same as ordinary prayer and more substantial than just a cracker and grape juice are used. The over all impression is clear. That somehow God dresses up nice on Sunday goes to the Catholic church then phones it in to the Baptists down the street.

Hes there or not, we may precieve Him differently, but Hes still there. The purpose is to examine our hearts and look to Him.

 

[LilyM]

Then what you said about “they are much more substantial than just a cracker and grape juice, though.” means the love fests are better than the protestant communion?? Thats how its coming across.

Not better - just means a love fest is (as it always was) an actual proper meal, entirely distinct from the Eucharist and never just bread and wine/grape juice.

I mention the ladies because youve mentioned them quite a few times, it obviously bugs you and to that Im sorry, but I still say in the circles Ive been in I havent seen people stuffing with turkeys. You have to admit that is a little over the top even if one doesnt believe in real pressence. If nothing else its in bad form.

That’s the point - for a Catholic to do so would never just be ‘bad form’, it’d be outright sacrilege and a grave sin - and if the bread and wine of your communion is in any sense the Real Presence for you, you’d believe exactly the same.

The over all impression is clear. That somehow God dresses up nice on Sunday goes to the Catholic church then phones it in to the Baptists down the street.

Hes there or not, we may precieve Him differently, but Hes still there. The purpose is to examine our hearts and look to Him.

We believe that our Eucharist is His true and real and transubstantial presence. You don’t believe the same of yours. Of course there’s a difference between the two then.

And Jesus ISN’T ‘there’ in exactly the same way in all places and times. He’s not ‘there’ in your church or in my private prayer group exactly as He was on Calvary. In our Catholic Churches He IS ‘there’ precisely as He was on Calvary! Physically present under the forms of bread and wine.

 

[Kitty_Chan]

Not better - just means a love fest is (as it always was) an actual proper meal, entirely distinct from the Eucharist and never just bread and wine/grape juice.

point is why bring it up in the same sentance as a protestant communion. and highlite that its more than bread and grape juice. Thats all Im getting at, comes across harsh.

That’s the point - for a Catholic to do so would never just be ‘bad form’, it’d be outright sacrilege and a grave sin - and if the bread and wine of your communion is in any sense the Real Presence for you, you’d believe exactly the same.

Yes I agree about for a Catholic its wrong. The example of turkey stuffing is over the top, **even if **they didnt believe in real pressence. One doesnt act badly.

Clean up and toss out, fine, but turkey stuffing??

Thats why I said I appreciated my sons Pastor was taking care of things himself. If you want I could ask, I have a feeling he doesnt toss the cracker bits. Which yes, I do appreciate if he did’nt. I may just ask him, as it is a sensitive topic for me.

All Im trying to impress here is they took the entire service and it was about communion, not a last minute stick in, they are treating it quite seriously. Its not merely anything.

And Jesus ISN’T ‘there’ in exactly the same way in all places and times. He’s not ‘there’ in your church or in my private prayer group exactly as He was on Calvary. In our Catholic Churches He IS ‘there’ precisely as He was on Calvary! Physically present under the forms of bread and wine.

So if I get this right Hes the same everywhere, save for Eucharist time when Hes like He was on Calvary.

So Hes spiritually and physically present in Eucharist
and spiritually present in communion

?? That what you are saying?

 

[jmcrae]

point is why bring it up in the same sentance as a protestant communion. and highlite that its more than bread and grape juice. Thats all Im getting at, comes across harsh.

The reason I highlight that is because most Protestants who practice “open communion” say that it is not really Jesus (thus, there is nothing that can be profaned if an unbaptized person or an unbeliever receives it) - it is a “love fest” about Jesus, and the point of it is not to join the believer physically with Jesus, but to be welcoming, and to practice sharing.

Yes I agree about for a Catholic its wrong. The example of turkey stuffing is over the top, **even if **they didnt believe in real pressence. One doesnt act badly.

Clean up and toss out, fine, but turkey stuffing??

If you thought it was really Jesus, you wouldn’t “clean it up and toss it out,” either. They use it for turkey stuffing because they believe it is a sin to throw food away.

Thats why I said I appreciated my sons Pastor was taking care of things himself. If you want I could ask, I have a feeling he doesnt toss the cracker bits. Which yes, I do appreciate if he did’nt. I may just ask him, as it is a sensitive topic for me.

Yes, ask him what he does with them. Get his reaction to the idea of reserving them in a Tabernacle so that people can worship them, or taking them to the sick so that Jesus can heal them. (This is what we Catholics do with ours.)

So if I get this right Hes the same everywhere, save for Eucharist time when Hes like He was on Calvary.

Yes, that’s right.

 

[peary]

Well they certainly appear hard, Im not going to stick my neck in because it was a love fest going on

Peary has said she has made it clear there is differences, I dont know why you cant take her for her word.

Having said that I take objection to at least one part your stating above. You said your not allowed to make it look like there is anything at all in common.

What about Jesus? I guess its a different Jesus in a Catholic church then a protestant one. Maybe its a trick done with mirrors.

sigh

Thank you for the support, Kitty. BTW, I’m a ‘guy’

 

[LilyM]

So if I get this right Hes the same everywhere, save for Eucharist time when Hes like He was on Calvary.

So Hes spiritually and physically present in Eucharist
and spiritually present in communion

?? That what you are saying?

Not quite - for Catholics, since the bread and wine BECOME Christ in a real, literal, physical way, he’s both spiritually and physically present in our Eucharist and our communion (they’re not really separate things for us).

He isn’t, however, physically present in Protestant communion.

 

[Kitty_Chan]

The reason I highlight that is because most Protestants who practice “open communion” say that it is not really Jesus (thus, there is nothing that can be profaned if an unbaptized person or an unbeliever receives it) - it is a “love fest” about Jesus, and the point of it is not to join the believer physically with Jesus, but to be welcoming, and to practice sharing.

Are you saying the protestants call communion a love fest? Or your church has loves fests??

Now, I would say that open communion still requires a person to be a believer, otherwise how can you confess to a God you dont know? And your not going to take communion unless youve confessed. I dont know what your former church did perhaps between stuffing turkeys and regarding the Lord flippently, its no wonder you left. Ive just not run across that and you certainly shouldnt judge other churches to be like that one.

I will ask my sons Pastor, I will accept he does it on his own to keep people from being like the turkey stuffers, when I find out I will let you know.



ps its a good thing I wasnt in the kitchen on the day of the stuffers, I would have given em 2 bucks and said stop at safeway.

 

[jmcrae]

Are you saying the protestants call communion a love fest?

Yes, they say that it is a love fest, and that’s why anyone can come.

Or your church has loves fests??

My parish church has big church suppers that everyone is invited to attend - I am saying that this is much more like a “love fest” than the Protestant idea of holy communion.

Now, I would say that open communion still requires a person to be a believer, otherwise how can you confess to a God you dont know?

If they required that people confess their sins to God ahead of time, then it would not be open to everyone, but only to the believing members of that congregation.

And your not going to take communion unless youve confessed.

We both agree, on that one. That’s part of why non-Catholics can’t receive Holy Communion in the Catholic Church - because, as non-members, they can’t go to Confession to a priest.

I will ask my sons Pastor, I will accept he does it on his own to keep people from being like the turkey stuffers, when I find out I will let you know.

Yes - and also find out what he does with it.

ps its a good thing I wasnt in the kitchen on the day of the stuffers, I would have given em 2 bucks and said stop at safeway.

That’s not the point. They really did believe that it is a sin to throw food away, because of all the starving people in the world who have to eat out of the garbage can. It had nothing to do with money - those people had lots of money.

It would not have occurred to them to reserve it in a Tabernacle or to give it to the sick, because they did not believe at all that it was really Jesus.

 

[Theodore]

If a friend is away on a holiday and you say that person was with you in Spirit then that is all it is, nothing else, no matter what you say and how much you try to convince yourself differently. It is only when that person comes back to you in the flesh that you can say, he or she is truely back with me.
As Catholics we aways encourage our seperated brothers and sisters to come back to the fold, then and only then you won’t have to play make beleive, because our priesthood offers the Real Body and Blood of Our Lord Jesus Christ. So why settle for anything less, the chose is yours.
Peace

 

[Grace_Seeker]

If a friend is away on a holiday and you say that person was with you in Spirit then that is all it is, nothing else, no matter what you say and how much you try to convince yourself differently. It is only when that person comes back to you in the flesh that you can say, he or she is truely back with me.
As Catholics we aways encourage our seperated brothers and sisters to come back to the fold, then and only then you won’t have to play make beleive, because our priesthood offers the Real Body and Blood of Our Lord Jesus Christ. So why settle for anything less, the chose is yours.
Peace

But of course if one believes in a spiritual world that is just as real as a physical world, then experiencing a friend being with you in spirit would be just as meaningful as a friend being with you physically. By your analogy it sounds like you are saying that Catholics don’t think that the Spiritual presence of Jesus is as Real as his Physical presence in the bread and wine?

 

[Theodore]

But of course if one believes in a spiritual world that is just as real as a physical world, then experiencing a friend being with you in spirit would be just as meaningful as a friend being with you physically. By your analogy it sounds like you are saying that Catholics don’t think that the Spiritual presence of Jesus is as Real as his Physical presence in the bread and wine?

Next time a friend invites you over, tell your friend you will be there in Spirit. So will you also turn away…

 

[Kitty_Chan]

Yes, they say that it is a love fest, and that’s why anyone can come.

You would have to bring me proof that because its open communion its a love fest so anyone can come

Ive never heard communion being called a love fest.

And you keep saying that a big old church supper in a catholic church is comparable to a protestant communion. The analogy is not very charitable.

If they required that people confess their sins to God ahead of time, then it would not be open to everyone, but only to the believing members of that congregation.

Open communion does not require church membership in all churches, some but not all. They just accept others from different denominations to partake.

And to correct you, they do require people to confess their sins to God ahead of time. In fact spend the whole service speaking to just that. Including the songs sung, and scripture read.

That’s not the point. They really did believe that it is a sin to throw food away, because of all the starving people in the world who have to eat out of the garbage can. It had nothing to do with money - those people had lots of money.

It would not have occurred to them to reserve it in a Tabernacle or to give it to the sick, because they did not believe at all that it was really Jesus.

Like I said thats the most lamest deal I have ever heard that they have to save the left over bread crumbs for turkey stuffing because there is starving people in the world. If they really wanted to be thrifty they should have frozen it and used them for next time. And not wasted church resources to stuff their turkeys.

Even if they didnt believe it was Jesus what they were doing was in bad form. And I still say that just because they acted poorly gives no excuse to continualy bring it up as a example of what protestants do with left overs. Like I said before its not right to judge a group by a few of its own.

 

[Kitty_Chan]

Thank you for the support, Kitty. BTW, I’m a ‘guy’

no problem Dude