Communion in the Hand

[Jimmygill88]

You haven’t been received into the church yet and you are already questioning practices and are already involved with the Pius X society. Are you quite sure that you have been instructed correctly or that you are quite ready

 

[agnes_therese]

Is the pastor who will receive you into the Church aware that you have such grave doubts about the authority of the Church? Especially her authority to determine the form of the sacraments and the Order of the Mass?

Hello.
I’m being received into the Catholic Church shortly, but I’m having very grave difficulties with ‘communion in the hand’. I’d describe myself as a traditionalist & I’d attend the Tridentine Mass, increasingly strongly the SSPX, whom I have a great deal of sympathy for, but the nearest SSPX chapel is four hours drive away, the nearest Tridentine Mass is about three hours and two ferry trips away. Both of these are practically impossible as I can’t drive! The Novus Ordo parish, which I presently attend though of course do not receive, I am told, is a thoroughly reverent one as they go (no EMHC, no guitars, no liturgical abuses save communion in the hand).

I know the SSPX considers the Novus Ordo an objective sacrilege and a sin that ought to be confessed (vide their American website). I do not know about this - I’d have surely to fulfill the obligation on Sundays?, but I have grave difficulties with the practice of ‘communion in the hand’. I cannot shake a very strong suspicion it is sacrilegeous. I’ve asked; and been given what I am told is the official defence of the practice, that it was the practice of the Primitive Church, or more accurately of the Apostles. I cannot quiet my conscience in this regard - knowing I am having doubts about whether the Novus Ordo is a sacrilege (that is, they teach it is valid but displeasing to God) as the SSPX teach; and having grievous doubts about Communion in the Hand, what should I do? My instruction has been very orthodox, I’m very lucky, but I am still gravely, gravely concerned.

 

[HillbillyHermit]

I fail to understand what seems to be the never ending debate about Communion in the hand vs. on the tongue. We are allowed to receive either way, why knock those who prefer the other way? Maybe I’m a little cranky because the first cup of coffee hasn’t been consumed yet, but…geez! I thought this was settled by the Church years ago.

 

[coachdennis]

Is the pastor who will receive you into the Church aware that you have such grave doubts about the authority of the Church? Especially her authority to determine the form of the sacraments and the Order of the Mass?

As others have said you may choose to receive communion either way.

But, I also agree with this poster. There seems to be underlying issues that go deeper than how to receive.

 

[coachkfan1]

Ok, so I believe that receiving on the tongue from the priest is the most reverent way to receive the precious Body of Christ. However, as Catholics we are to be obedient to the Pope and the Magisterium. If the Pope has deemed it acceptable for those in America to receive in the hand, then why are so many here and elsewhere judging those who choose to do so???

 

[Patrick_Gray]

In answer to the last post - because I cannot shake it from my mind that to receive in the hand possibly is sacrilegous. The possibility of even the least crumb of the Host (that is, the Body and Blood of Christ) falling on the floor, getting mixed with dust, possibly even insects, trampled upon and so on.

Thank you all. I’m not actually deeply involved with the FSSPX, but I have, by way of an interest in the older rite(I’m in Scotland, not in the USA) read their apologetic material and been very badly shaken by it, particularly by the sheer extent of the changes - it looks very like a victory for the Modernists condemned by Pope after Pope. This thread, if you like, can be deleted now - I will pray very hard to Our Lady.

 

[CB_Catholic]

Hello.
I’m being received into the Catholic Church shortly, but I’m having very grave difficulties with ‘communion in the hand’. I’d describe myself as a traditionalist & I’d attend the Tridentine Mass, increasingly strongly the SSPX, whom I have a great deal of sympathy for, but the nearest SSPX chapel is four hours drive away, the nearest Tridentine Mass is about three hours and two ferry trips away. Both of these are practically impossible as I can’t drive! The Novus Ordo parish, which I presently attend though of course do not receive, I am told, is a thoroughly reverent one as they go (no EMHC, no guitars, no liturgical abuses save communion in the hand).

I know the SSPX considers the Novus Ordo an objective sacrilege and a sin that ought to be confessed (vide their American website). I do not know about this - I’d have surely to fulfill the obligation on Sundays?, but I have grave difficulties with the practice of ‘communion in the hand’. I cannot shake a very strong suspicion it is sacrilegeous. I’ve asked; and been given what I am told is the official defence of the practice, that it was the practice of the Primitive Church, or more accurately of the Apostles. I cannot quiet my conscience in this regard - knowing I am having doubts about whether the Novus Ordo is a sacrilege (that is, they teach it is valid but displeasing to God) as the SSPX teach; and having grievous doubts about Communion in the Hand, what should I do? My instruction has been very orthodox, I’m very lucky, but I am still gravely, gravely concerned.

Since you have been so blunt, I’m going to be blunt.

Communion in the hand is NOT a liturgical abuse and it is not sacrilegious. The OF of the Mass is NOT sacrilegious. You have a very poorly informed conscience if you think this way. If you want to be a Catholic you will have to learn to accept what the Church teaches and not put your own spin on it. The SSPX found themselves in trouble because of disobedience and still cannot come to an agreement with Rome to regularize themselves–why would anyone want to join the Church and then hook up with a society that is not in full communion with her and who encourage other Catholics to take a disobedient stance by their attitudes toward some practices they don’t like?

It is not up to you, as an individual, to decide that what the Church teaches and practices is abusive or sacrilegious. You don’t have to take CITH (I don’t),-- just stick out your tongue and they will give it to you, they are not allowed to deny giving it that way–but you also don’t have to judge what the Church teaches as wrong. That is not your place and not the place of the SSPX. Stay away from them until they come to their senses and recognize the authority of Rome and reunite. Remember, Jesus gave the Keys to Peter and his successors and the authority to bind and loose rests with them, not us or any other group that doesn’t like what the Church teaches.

As to those who suggested the Eastern Churches–that is wrong. They don’t want or need people to join them just because they don’t like some things in the Latin Church. That often is how Latin practices creep into the Eastern Churches. One should truly be attracted to Eastern spirituality and theology and tradition, not join them because one is questioning the authority of the Latin Church in regulating it’s practices. They are Catholic and under the Pope, too, and don’t appreciate disobedience any more than the Latin Church does.

 

[Patrick_Gray]

I am deeply ashamed for daring to question the Pope and for how I am thinking - although I was quoting the SSPX position on the NO being sacriligeous, which I have not firmly decided upon myself - the doubts and being tossed about by it are a bit of a torture for my conscience. I started my instruction with submission and I do try to be obedient, but as I read more and more I am wracked with doubt - simply, taking only one rather egregious example, how can the Church in 1961 be the same as that of Assisi? Would any of the Popes from Saint Peter to now have permitted pagans and heretics to ‘pray’ in a Catholic church? This is from a Traditional Catholic website and rather sums up my doubts:

fisheaters.com/traditionalcatholicism.html

I will delay being received until I have settled this, as you are quite right and it goes far deeper than merely how to receive - I find the Second Vatican Council very hard to accept. I must remain loyal to the Pope, of course, but I find it extremely hard to accept such radical changes and what appears to me the loss of so very much in the '70s and '80s.
Thank you.

 

[Bballer32]

Being in the state of Mortal sin is the real issue. and that again needs to be taught, and reeducated to the people in a big way.
A good comparison is the Ark of the Covenant was the true presence of God, and if you touched it in improper or unworthy way, you died. Reverence for the Ark was exact and precise, no exception, for it held the Ten Commandments and God.
People, Communion is of the exact same Presence of the Exact same God as the Ark was…
Communion Replaced the Ark.
understanding is ascribed to God and the angles. reason of comparison of the Ark to Communion is our best reasoning, that the New Covenant of God broght by Jesus was to bring God to All men as the chosen people through Communion…

I second this comment. A couple weeks ago i gave a report in school about receiving communion in the state of mortal sin (Catholic school not public ). It’s a very grave matter as Paul clearly states not to do it!

[BIBLEDRB]1 Corinthians 11: 27-29[/BIBLEDRB]

This and many other reasons are why i stopped receiving on the hands. My hands have sinned but so has my tongue. So, which is better: going from sinful hand to sinful tongue, or priests hands to sinful tongue? (Just a little gateway hahahaha)

There is only one problem about this teaching: People who learn it will judge others as they go up to communion. I’m guilty of it, but i’ve become better at focusing. Other people who don’t practice their faith a whole lot, it may be harder for them

Just my :twocents:

 

[coachdennis]

I am deeply ashamed for daring to question the Pope and for how I am thinking - although I was quoting the SSPX position on the NO being sacriligeous, which I have not firmly decided upon myself - the doubts and being tossed about by it are a bit of a torture for my conscience. I started my instruction with submission and I do try to be obedient, but as I read more and more I am wracked with doubt - simply, how can the Church in 1961 be the same as that of Assisi? Would any of the Popes from Saint Peter to now have permitted pagans and heretics to pray in a Catholic church? This is from a Traditional Catholic website and rather sums up my doubts:

fisheaters.com/traditionalcatholicism.html

I will delay being received until I have settled this, as you are quite right and it goes far deeper than merely how to receive - I find the Second Vatican Council very hard to accept. I must remain loyal to the Pope, of course, but I find it extremely hard to accept such radical changes.
Thank you.

This is from the very website you linked:

The site-owner claims no ecclesiastical authority or special credentials other than those of a laywoman who loves and studies the Faith and strives to pass it on accurately.

you will be better served to utilize websites such as the Vatican website and those of your official diocese.

As others as stated the Latin Rite of the Church recognizes the EF and NO as valid. Your doubts and struggles are no doubt sincere, but you need to have greater clarification before you make your decision. As a previous poster said,

If you want to be a Catholic you will have to learn to accept what the Church teaches and not put your own spin on it.

 

[Mrs_Sally]

A simple first step is to stop reading from those types of websites. I find fisheaters very helpful for some definitions and descriptions of traditional practices like “what are ember days?”, but since other material on the site is causing you problems, I would stop going there and certainly stop going to SSPX related pages.

Go to the priest who is preparing you and speak to him about your concerns and possible scrupulosity. Thousands of people are received into the Catholic Church each Easter who are obedient to the magisterium and ready to be faithful and orthodox Catholics. Do your best to be one of them.

We are not called to worry about meetings in Assisi or how the Pope conducts ecumenical talks. We each have enough to do with conducting our own lives and becoming holy. Read a few of Br JReducation’s posts on this forum to learn a bit more about obedience and detachment from issues that we don’t have control over.

I will be praying for you.

Yes, I accept unreservedly. I am deeply ashamed for daring to question the Pope - although I was quoting the SSPX position on the NO being sacriligeous, which I don’t accept myself, but which is a bit of a torture for my conscience. I started my instruction with submission and I do try to be obedient, but as I read more and more I am wracked with doubt - simply, how can the Church in 1961 be the same as that of Assisi? Would any of the Popes from Saint Peter to now have permitted pagans and heretics to pray in a Catholic church? This is from a Traditional Catholic website, not SSPX, and rather sums up my doubts:

fisheaters.com/traditionalcatholicism.html

I will delay being received until I have settled this, as you are quite right and it goes far deeper than merely how to receive - I find the Second Vatican Council very hard to accept. I suppose I must, but it seems in many places to contra-dict a thousand years o the Church and has been accompanied, whether part of it or not, with a deep ‘loss of the sacred’ -
Thank you.

 

[april32010]

fisheaters is a dangerous site if one is new to to the Church and an occasion of sin for some others . they present the faith in a very crude and and i would say borderline pornographic manner .they seem very proud of allowing the use of the F-bomb and racist language .

 

[zenith15]

Who are you to touch Him at all - with any part of your body? Your tongue is at least as impure and unclean and unconsecrated and therefore unworthy to touch Him as your hands or any other portion of your anatomy. Neither are any of our tongues.

We touch Him because He invites us, not because we are worthy. And He never said ‘take and eat - but only with your tongue and never your hands’

I agree.

 

[HillbillyHermit]

you will be better served to utilize websites such as the Vatican website and those of your official diocese.

This could easily be on the top 10 list of good advice given on a Catholic forum. There’s a ton of info on the Vatican site. One of the best things IMO is that the Bible and Catechism are on it. It even loads easily with a dial-up connection, which I was stuck with until about a year ago.

 

[CB_Catholic]

I am deeply ashamed for daring to question the Pope and for how I am thinking - although I was quoting the SSPX position on the NO being sacriligeous, which I have not firmly decided upon myself - the doubts and being tossed about by it are a bit of a torture for my conscience. I started my instruction with submission and I do try to be obedient, but as I read more and more I am wracked with doubt - simply, taking only one rather egregious example, how can the Church in 1961 be the same as that of Assisi? Would any of the Popes from Saint Peter to now have permitted pagans and heretics to ‘pray’ in a Catholic church? This is from a Traditional Catholic website and rather sums up my doubts:

fisheaters.com/traditionalcatholicism.html

I will delay being received until I have settled this, as you are quite right and it goes far deeper than merely how to receive - I find the Second Vatican Council very hard to accept. I must remain loyal to the Pope, of course, but I find it extremely hard to accept such radical changes and what appears to me the loss of so very much in the '70s and '80s.
Thank you.

I think that you need to stay away from SSPX, Sedevacantist, and ultra traditional websites for now as they seem to be unduly influencing you. There is a plethora of good, orthodox reading material and websites for you to investigate, and they are in communion with Rome.

There are many good Catholic apologists and authors also who have written good orthodox articles and books for you to read. This forum’s website has many for sale and many articles to read. The documents of Vatican ll are also available online so that you can read them yourself rather than through the filter of others. Also remember that this is not the worst period in Church history–in 2000 years we have been through a lot and the loss of faith has been far worse at times.

God bless you.

 

[paperwight66]

Every fragment of the Host, no matter how minuscule, contains Jesus Body and Blood, Soul and Divinity.
How can we be sure that there are not particles of our Lord left on our hands after receiving? (This has been discussed on these forums in the past.)

Dominus tecum, Reg.

You are forgetting that the Church teaches that when there is no longer the appearance of bread, there is no more Real Presence.
If you are saying that the altar-breads your parish uses break off recognisable pieces in the hand, then you must have a word with whoever buys in supplies and get them to order altar-breads with properly sealed edges. Similarly with any dust-like particles - it sounds to me as if the sacristan is being careless when putting out the altar-breads and is including some of the floury bits from the bottom of the plastic bag they usually come in. They do need a bit of sifting, not just tipped out of the bag, especially when the bag is nearly empty.
So there’s two remedies in your hands, two things you can do.

But if you are identifying dust-motes you might see in the air as the Real Presence = you are not following the Church’s teaching.

 

[TimothyH]

but I have grave difficulties with the practice of ‘communion in the hand’. I cannot shake a very strong suspicion it is sacrilegeous. I’ve asked; and been given what I am told is the official defence of the practice, that it was the practice of the Primitive Church, or more accurately of the Apostles. I cannot quiet my conscience in this regard - knowing I am having doubts about whether the Novus Ordo is a sacrilege (that is, they teach it is valid but displeasing to God) as the SSPX teach; and having grievous doubts about Communion in the Hand, what should I do? My instruction has been very orthodox, I’m very lucky, but I am still gravely, gravely concerned.

Your concern about sacrilege is completely unfounded.

Sacrilege is when someone intentionally profanes the sacred. The intent to profane the sacred has to be there. If there is no intent, then it is an oversight, a mistake or an accident but it is not sacrilege.

Communion is allowed by the Church. The ordinary form of the Mass was given to us by the Church. The Church herself therefor has to intend to profane that which is sacred for either to be sacrilege.

People throw around the word sacrilege without even understanding what it means. You have asked what you should do. My advice is to form your understanding based on what the Church teaches and thinks. My advice is not to make up your own rules based on an incorrect understanding of what the Church herself teaches.

-Tim-

 

[maltmom]

Your concern about sacrilege is completely unfounded.

Sacrilege is when someone intentionally profanes the sacred. The intent to profane something sacred has to be there.

Communion is allowed by the Church. The ordinary form of the Mass was given to us by the Church. The Church herself therefor has to intend to profane that which is sacred for either to be sacrilege.

You have asked what you should do. My advice is to think with the mind of the Church instead of making up your own rules.

-Tim-

^^^^this^^^^

 

[mikelionheart]

Whilst, contrary to what some posters have said, there is nothing wrong whatsoever with communion in the hand, you should not, and must not, be denied it on the tongue.

 

[LightBound]

fisheaters is a dangerous site if one is new to to the Church and an occasion of sin for some others . they present the faith in a very crude and and i would say borderline pornographic manner .they seem very proud of allowing the use of the F-bomb and racist language .

Exactly! The language used on that site is quite vulgar and I wonder if those that behave like that on there would let their true colors show and dare to speak those colorful words in front of their SSPX or sedevantist priest and chapel members. If I was unaware of what kind of site it was and stumbled on to it, I would leave thinking that Catholics are crude, racist, and have no class. Thankfully, I am well aware of that site and the one that’s even more vile than FE and I stay away from both! The OP needs to do the same and also not be involved with a group whose status in the Church is murky, at best!!