Concealed Carry in Church?

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vppoole said:
While I can see how a person has the right to CC, I do not see a significant reason why someone (other than an officer on-duty) would feel the need to take their weapon into a church during Mass.

Even if handguns would have been available back then, I don’t think anyone present at the Last Supper would have CC during the meal.🤷

Pax!
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Well, Peter had the handgun of that day, a sword, at his side immediately after (and probably during) the very first communion at the last supper (John 18:10). Once they left the upper room supper, they went directly to Gethsemane, where Judas betrayed Jesus. Peter used his sword to cut the ear of Malchus. Jesus advised Peter to put it away, as those who live by the sword die by the sword. Peter would have been justified in using the sword to defend anyone else, but he was attempting, without knowing, to prevent scripture from being fulfilled.

So, the lesson is not that weapons were prohibited, but that we should not live by them. Consider Luke 22:38, where Jesus told the disciples that two swords “was enough”. So, Jesus did not prohibit his disciples from arming themselves, but clearly advised them to use discretion in their use.

A handgun, in the possession of a licensed carrier, is a weapon of defense. In sections 2263-2265 of the Catechism, defense of innocent life is specifically addressed and authorized.
 
I have had a license to carry a handgun for about 20 years. I used to live in a rather rough neighborhood and carried regularly then. About 10 years ago I moved and stopped carrying regularly until I married. Carrying a weapon does not automatically guarantee survival, but I choose to carry because I want to have as much of a chance, and to have as much of a chance to protect my wife as possible.

Chances of ever having to draw that weapon as a civilian are probably slim, but if that situation ever occurs, then I will try to be ready. Situations where deadly force may be justified don’t limit themselves to “bad” neighborhoods. In fact, “bad” nieghborhoods may be less of a target for some criminals than “good”. Recent events have demonstrated that even churches are not exempt from violence.

I carry a .45 auto and I practice regularly. I am proficient with using it. Before entering a church, I remove the cartridge from the chamber and carry the pistol with an empty chamber and the hammer down. In that condition the gun is totally safe. The weapon is concealed and nobody knows I have it except my me, my wife, and our Lord - nobody would even have the notion to try to take it from me if they can’t tell that I have it. I am aware that even if the unlikely situation occured at my church, that even then my ability to respond would be limited, especially if an innocent person were in the line of fire. But if it does, at least the innocent will have more of chance than if the only person in the church with a gun was the criminal.

I see no conflict with my faith in being prepared to defend my wife’s life or my own, or another member of my parish. I am a responsible law-abiding citizen.
 
I support the right to keep and bear arms and have no problem with lawful carry anywhere, including churches. Personally, I would let the pastor, or at least the priest on duty, know out of respect and courtesy before I did so.
 
I don’t see why anyone would think that you should inform the priest that you are carrying. Really. Just don’t get it at all. For a while at least that was against the law in Texas. It had to be CONCEALED, and if you told someone about it you had broken the law. I believe that has changed now, maybe not, and other states may be the same.
 
white_sheep said:
I don’t see why anyone would think that you should inform the priest that you are carrying. Really. Just don’t get it at all. For a while at least that was against the law in Texas. It had to be CONCEALED, and if you told someone about it you had broken the law. I believe that has changed now, maybe not, and other states may be the same.
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Because it’s the House of the Lord, and that we are subject to Him. Priests are essentially “married” to Christ and keep house for Him. It’s a matter of respect, in my opinion.

Well, I can’t speak for Texas, but there’s a big difference between disclosing that you’re armed and actually brandishing a firearm. Concealment is a physical issue, whether you’re running your mouth or not.

I get you, though. It’s stupid to carry and then let everyone know. It eliminates the element of surprise and makes you a potential target. But pulling a priest to the side and telling him privately isn’t a big deal to me.
 
The priest at my local church know I am in law enforcement; I don’t tell them when I am carrying in church, which is most of the time now. They expect it. A priest in another location I know is glad that I do and is comfortable with it. I have a duty act if there was a need to do so; otherwise I would not broadcast that I am armed. For those who indicate that carrying a firearm can interfere with faith; I disagree. Those who exercise the right to carry concealed recognize the need to think tactically, yet still be mentally relaxed and engaged. This can and should be done in all places, even, and especially, in church. :onpatrol:
 
bearer said:
Because it’s the House of the Lord, and that we are subject to Him. Priests are essentially “married” to Christ and keep house for Him. It’s a matter of respect, in my opinion.

Well, I can’t speak for Texas, but there’s a big difference between disclosing that you’re armed and actually brandishing a firearm. Concealment is a physical issue, whether you’re running your mouth or not.

I get you, though. It’s stupid to carry and then let everyone know. It eliminates the element of surprise and makes you a potential target. But pulling a priest to the side and telling him privately isn’t a big deal to me.
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If you tell someone you have it and it is still “concealed” it is no longer concealed as it is known. Also, there could be no discernible ruffling or bulging of your clothing whatsoever. It had to be entirely unnoticeable.
 
white_sheep said:
If you tell someone you have it and it is still “concealed” it is no longer concealed as it is known. Also, there could be no discernible ruffling or bulging of your clothing whatsoever. It had to be entirely unnoticeable.
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In legal terms, no; at least not in the states I frequent. And printing happens to the best of us from time to time, unless deep cover is more important than quick access.

Besides, do you really think a priest is going to run out and tell the rest of the congregation that I’m armed? I’m not sure why you’re belaboring your point here. If you want to keep secrets from the Church, fine. That’s not the way I do things.
 
bearer said:
If you want to keep secrets from the Church, fine. That’s not the way I do things.
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So if you are married, you also tell the priest every time you have relations with your wife? Do you also summit receipts from every time you eat out? How about every time you disagree with someone?

I know those aren’t the same as concealed carry, but none of the them are illegal.

Simply by not telling someone you are carrying concealed, doesn’t mean that you are keeping secrets.
 
maryjk said:
So if you are married, you also tell the priest every time you have relations with your wife? Do you also summit receipts from every time you eat out? How about every time you disagree with someone?

I know those aren’t the same as concealed carry, but none of the them are illegal.

Simply by not telling someone you are carrying concealed, doesn’t mean that you are keeping secrets.
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Those are not secrets, and I certainly don’t do any of those things in church. Besides, I confess my sins to a priest. I have no qualms about discussing other, more mundane topics with him.

To many, many priests, bringing a weapon into the House of the Lord is a very big deal, and to some, an offense to God Himself. I don’t understand why people would advocate what I believe to be disrespect to the Church. I’m not so proud and self-righteous that I feel justified in doing something simply because the law permits me, especially when it may cause offense to the Church.
 
I wonder if the “tell the priest” crowd think I should also tell him I carry a pocket knife with me everywhere I go.
 
bearer said:
If you carry it outside of church, what business of his is it?
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I go to church at least every week, therefore everywhere I go includes inside church. I carry a knife with me when I go to church. There, that’s good and clear, sorry if I was imprecise.
 
If you don’t pack heat at church how can you protect yourself from its other members? What if the quiet guy in the back hears a certain psalm, goes crazy, and begins shooting people? You’ll be glad you had that gun then, so you can shoot him. I can’t think of any place I wouldn’t need ol’ Betsy 😃
 
bearer said:
Those are not secrets, and I certainly don’t do any of those things in church. Besides, I confess my sins to a priest. I have no qualms about discussing other, more mundane topics with him.

To many, many priests, bringing a weapon into the House of the Lord is a very big deal, and to some, an offense to God Himself. I don’t understand why people would advocate what I believe to be disrespect to the Church. I’m not so proud and self-righteous that I feel justified in doing something simply because the law permits me, especially when it may cause offense to the Church.
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Simply because you believe it to be disrespectful, doesn’t mean that it is disrespectful.🤷
 
maryjk said:
Simply because you believe it to be disrespectful, doesn’t mean that it is disrespectful.🤷
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That’s up to the priest to decide, isn’t it?

I’ll live my life according the Word of God and my conscience. Feel free to do the same.
 
bearer said:
LOL, you are classic. Why do I get the feeling you’re an American Catholic?
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Who has the final call on the property? The bishop does, the properties of the Church in his diocese are his assets and at his disposal. He is ultimately in charge of them. Also, if my bishop told me not to carry a firearm to mass I wouldn’t.

This concept of walking up to the priest and telling them you have a gun is insanity. It’s just crazy people! Why on earth would you do that? It’s legal, normal, a church is open to the public and it is to be expected that some of the people would be carrying.

What’s weird is how the mind of anti-gunners works.

You never answered about whether or not I should tell the priest if I am carrying my pocket knife.
 
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