Conclave could be lengthy, no obvious frontrunner [CNAU]

  • Thread starter Thread starter Catholic_Press
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
C

Catholic_Press

Guest
Mar 10, '13 6:00 am
The conclave to elect a new pope will begin tomorrow at 6pm Rome time. Most observers believe the lack of strong leading candidates suggests the process is likely to take longer than just two days, as happened in 2005, reports The Tablet. One common scenario is that it will boil down to a choice between a candidate backed by Roman Curia cardinals, and a candidate put forward by cardinals intent on radically reforming the Curia.http://feeds.feedburner.com/~r/cathnews/RSS/~4/RDbY6sI5b6g

More…
 
Catholic_Press said:
Mar 10, '13 6:00 am
The conclave to elect a new pope will begin tomorrow at 6pm Rome time. Most observers believe the lack of strong leading candidates suggests the process is likely to take longer than just two days, as happened in 2005, reports The Tablet. One common scenario is that it will boil down to a choice between a candidate backed by Roman Curia cardinals, and a candidate put forward by cardinals intent on radically reforming the Curia.http://feeds.feedburner.com/~r/cathnews/RSS/~4/RDbY6sI5b6g

More…
Click to expand...
The Curia represents the nation state of the Vatican. The reformers desire to de-politcize the Curia. Isn’t that a contradiction?

Jesus said that his kingdom is not of this world. Is it not a contradiction for the Church of God to be represented by a nation state?

Is the Holy Spirit moving in our midst, or will it be political maneuvering as usual?

Just one nobody speaking.

God’s peace, and may His will be done.
 
I know that the media has widely stated that there is no obvious front runner (which seems true enough), but I really don’t think the conclave isgoing to be that long. I would be surprised if it’s not finished before the weekend. 🤷

The cardinals already have been meeting for over a week now. Even though things don’t look much clearer to us, I’m sure they are much clearer for the cardinals.
 
I know with watching videos, when Pope Paul VI was elected and Pope John Paul I were elected they were front runners to be elected pontiffs by a long shot which ended up happening. If we all remember, when Blessed Pope John Paul II was elected a lot of ppl didn’t know who he was, he was not in the radar of possible candidates. With Benedict XVI I think we all knew that he would be the guy, now it is true it is wide open, but I think the Cardinals have mentioned in their meetings that it will be best to have a new Pope by Sunday.
 
mercytruth said:
The Curia represents the nation state of the Vatican. The reformers desire to de-politcize the Curia. Isn’t that a contradiction?

Jesus said that his kingdom is not of this world. Is it not a contradiction for the Church of God to be represented by a nation state?

Is the Holy Spirit moving in our midst, or will it be political maneuvering as usual?

Just one nobody speaking.

God’s peace, and may His will be done.
Click to expand...
The city state does not control the Holy See. The Governorate of the Vatican City State and the Holy See and Roman Curia are two completely different things, operated separately. Thank God the Church does have sovereign territory in which the Holy See largely operates. It affords a level of independence and freedom for the Pope that could otherwise never be guaranteed.
 
YoungTradCath said:
The city state does not control the Holy See. The Governorate of the Vatican City State and the Holy See and Roman Curia are two completely different things, operated separately. Thank God the Church does have sovereign territory in which the Holy See largely operates. It affords a level of independence and freedom for the Pope that could otherwise never be guaranteed.
Click to expand...
Thank you for pointing out the distinction. Eventhough the President of the Vatican City State is H.E. Card. Giuseppe Bertello
[vaticanstate.va/content/vaticanstate/en/stato-e-governo/struttura-del-(name removed by moderator)ato/presidenza.html](http://www.vaticanstate.va/content/vaticanstate/en/stato-e-governo/struttura-del-(name removed by moderator)ato/presidenza.html)

Does not the Holy See and the Roman Curia oversee the Vatican Bank (IOR), properties and finances of the Holy See?

**6.2 The Administration of the Patrimony of the Apostolic See
6.3 The Prefecture for the Economic Affairs of the Holy See **

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Curia#The_Administration_of_the_Patrimony_of_the_Apostolic_See

God’s peace be with you
 
Gricken said:
6pm rome time? What would that be est?
Click to expand...
1pm. With Daylight Saving Time kicking in this past weekend here in the U.S., the Eastern time zone is 5 hours different from Rome. Last week, it would have been a six hour difference.

In three weeks, when Italy begins their Daylight Saving time, we’ll be back to a six hour difference.
 
Joe_5859 said:
1pm. With Daylight Saving Time kicking in this past weekend here in the U.S., the Eastern time zone is 5 hours different from Rome. Last week, it would have been a six hour difference.

In three weeks, when Italy begins their Daylight Saving time, we’ll be back to a six hour difference.
Click to expand...
Darn. I wanted to be home all day while they vote, darn public education system. Ah well. I’m sure I won’t miss anything in 2 hours.
 
Some Italian observers have surmised that Cardinals Sodano and Tarcisio Bertone - bitter rivals inside the Roman Curia for the last several years - have made a sort of non-belligerence pact to keep the non-curialists from capturing the papacy.

Am I the only one that finds this disturbing? A pact between Cardinals on who should or shouldn’t be pope? Sounds political to me. Yep, that’s how we want to go forward. :rolleyes:

Someone please tell me this is just gossip.
 
Lucky7 said:
Some Italian observers have surmised that Cardinals Sodano and Tarcisio Bertone - bitter rivals inside the Roman Curia for the last several years - have made a sort of non-belligerence pact to keep the non-curialists from capturing the papacy.

Am I the only one that finds this disturbing? A pact between Cardinals on who should or shouldn’t be pope? Sounds political to me. Yep, that’s how we want to go forward. :rolleyes:

Someone please tell me this is just gossip.
Click to expand...
I find it very disturbing.

There is an old saying that who goes in as the new “pope” comes out as a cardinal.

I am praying very hard that the Holy Spirit prevails in spite of all of the political maneuvering that appears to be going on.
 
Lormar said:
I find it very disturbing.

There is an old saying that who goes in as the new “pope” comes out as a cardinal.

I am praying very hard that the Holy Spirit prevails in spite of all of the political maneuvering that appears to be going on.
Click to expand...
I’m really hoping that key word here is “appears”. I’m thinking the last thing our Church needs is a Pope chosen based on pure politics. That would be just another can of worms waiting to be opened.
 
Lucky7 said:
I’m really hoping that key word here is “appears”. I’m thinking the last thing our Church needs is a Pope chosen based on pure politics. That would be just another can of worms waiting to be opened.
Click to expand...
Three of the five cardinals that make up the **Commission of Cardinals **of the IOR, (the Vatican Bank) are prelates of the Curia. Cardinal Bertone (the president of the Commission and Secretary of State), Cardinal Tauran ( President of the Pontifical Council for Interreligious Dialogue) and Cardinal Calcagno (President of the Administration of the Patrimony of the Apostolic See (APSA),

Cardinal Scherer of Brazil, (a leading candidate for Pope) and Cardinal Toppo of India are the other two Commission members.

This is the Commission of Cardinals that fired the past President of the IOR and nominated the present President of the IOR

news.va/en/news/renewal-of-commission-of-cardinals-for-the-ior

zenit.org/en/articles/commission-of-cardinals-appoints-new-ior-president

zenit.org/en/articles/commission-of-cardinals-appoints-new-ior-president

It would seem to me that there is a desire for greater transparency among the American Cardinals regarding the oversight of the IOR.
 
Lucky7 said:
I’m really hoping that key word here is “appears”. I’m thinking the last thing our Church needs is a Pope chosen based on pure politics. That would be just another can of worms waiting to be opened.
Click to expand...
That’s why I used it. Politics has played a part in the election of popes many times in the history of the Church as I am sure you well know.
 
Lucky7 said:
Some Italian observers have surmised that Cardinals Sodano and Tarcisio Bertone - bitter rivals inside the Roman Curia for the last several years - have made a sort of non-belligerence pact to keep the non-curialists from capturing the papacy.

Am I the only one that finds this disturbing? A pact between Cardinals on who should or shouldn’t be pope? Sounds political to me. Yep, that’s how we want to go forward. :rolleyes:

Someone please tell me this is just gossip.
Click to expand...
This is just gossip.
 
Lormar said:
That’s why I used it. Politics has played a part in the election of popes many times in the history of the Church as I am sure you well know.
Click to expand...
Yes, unfortunately. It’s really importnat that they fight that urge though…or we will regret it.
 
Lucky7 said:
Am I the only one that finds this disturbing? A pact between Cardinals on who should or shouldn’t be pope? Sounds political to me. Yep, that’s how we want to go forward. :rolleyes:Someone please tell me this is just gossip.
Click to expand...
Anyone who thinks the conclave is somehow apolitical is naive. It’s a group of men, many of whom have strong ideas on which individual, or what category of individual, is best suited to lead the Church. I think “pact” is a bit strong, but I’m sure many cardinals have come to agreement that particular candidates are good choices, or that certain classes of candidates would be desirable.

If you look at members here on this board, many people have agreed that for instance a third world candidate would be good, or that an insider would be the best choice to be able to reform the curia. You don’t need a “pact” to come to agreement on a shared goal. But naturally, other cardinals will have opposite values and goals that they hold strongly. How does the College of Cardinals come to a consensus shared by 2/3 of those present? Politics!
 
mercytruth said:
Thank you for pointing out the distinction. Eventhough the President of the Vatican City State is H.E. Card. Giuseppe Bertello
[vaticanstate.va/content/vaticanstate/en/stato-e-governo/struttura-del-(name removed by moderator)ato/presidenza.html](http://www.vaticanstate.va/content/vaticanstate/en/stato-e-governo/struttura-del-(name removed by moderator)ato/presidenza.html)

Does not the Holy See and the Roman Curia oversee the Vatican Bank (IOR), properties and finances of the Holy See?

**6.2 The Administration of the Patrimony of the Apostolic See
6.3 The Prefecture for the Economic Affairs of the Holy See **

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Curia#The_Administration_of_the_Patrimony_of_the_Apostolic_See

God’s peace be with you
Click to expand...
Thanks for the links.
 
Joe_5859 said:
I know that the media has widely stated that there is no obvious front runner (which seems true enough), but I really don’t think the conclave isgoing to be that long. I would be surprised if it’s not finished before the weekend. 🤷

The cardinals already have been meeting for over a week now. Even though things don’t look much clearer to us, I’m sure they are much clearer for the cardinals.
Click to expand...
I read something that Pope John Paul II once said about his election. While it was an utter shock to the media, he was not terribly surprised, because he had received a good number of votes at the conclave in which John Paul I was elected, only a couple of months before. God’s ways are not our ways.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top