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C794
Guest
Recently someone tried to disprove the practice of confession by citing James 5:16. How would I explain how this does not contradict Catholic theology? Thanks.
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COPLAND_3
Guest
This is commentary from Bishop John McEvilly
The words may mean, acknowledge your offences against one another, and mutually beg pardon of each other. Similar is the precept in the Gospel (Matt, 5), “if your brother shall sin against thee,” &c. Others understand the words to have reference to the confession of our faults to our brethren, for the purpose of seeking counsel, or of obtaining the assistance of their prayers; and this latter reason is suggested by St. James, “pray one for another,” &c. This practice of acknowledging their faults within due limits is observed in religious communities, with great spiritual advantage. The practice of mutually confessing their sins is followed by the priest and the people at the beginning of Mass. “Confitcor Deo et tibi, pater et vobis fratres.” By others, the passage is understood of the confession of sins to a priest, in the sacrament of penance; and then, “one to another” is to be understood (as the Greek corresponding word, αλληλοις, frequently is), in accommodation to the subject matter of the precept, of such as are empowered to hear confession and bestow absolution. These are alone the priests and bishops, “whose sins you shall forgive, shall be forgiven, and whose sins you shall retain,” &c. “One to another,” has the restricted meaning assigned to it here in several passages of Scripture, thus: (Romans 15:7), “receive one another,” though it only refers to the strong supporting the weak; (1 Thes. 5:11), “comfort one another”; (Ephes. 5), “be subject to one another.” And St. James says, “confess to one another.” in order to remove the shame of confessing our sins, by showing that it is not to angels or beings of a higher nature we are confessing; but to weak mortal men like ourselves, and perhaps also to show that the priests too are bound by this precept. At all events- whether this latter interpretation be the true one or not matters but very little, as far as the warrant for absolving from sins, on the part of the priests is concerned. It is from the words of Christ to his Apostles, “receive you the Holy Ghost, whose sins you shall forgive,” &c., and from the constant tradition of the Church, that the existence of this power is clearly demonstrated. “And pray one for another.” This is specially to be understood of the just praying for sinners. “That you may be saved,” that is, obtain converts on to God, and the great gift of final perseverance. “For the continual prayer of the just,” &c. The Greek word for " continual," ενεργουμενη, means, fervent, earnest. " Availes much" with God; because, he is his favorite and friend.
The words may mean, acknowledge your offences against one another, and mutually beg pardon of each other. Similar is the precept in the Gospel (Matt, 5), “if your brother shall sin against thee,” &c. Others understand the words to have reference to the confession of our faults to our brethren, for the purpose of seeking counsel, or of obtaining the assistance of their prayers; and this latter reason is suggested by St. James, “pray one for another,” &c. This practice of acknowledging their faults within due limits is observed in religious communities, with great spiritual advantage. The practice of mutually confessing their sins is followed by the priest and the people at the beginning of Mass. “Confitcor Deo et tibi, pater et vobis fratres.” By others, the passage is understood of the confession of sins to a priest, in the sacrament of penance; and then, “one to another” is to be understood (as the Greek corresponding word, αλληλοις, frequently is), in accommodation to the subject matter of the precept, of such as are empowered to hear confession and bestow absolution. These are alone the priests and bishops, “whose sins you shall forgive, shall be forgiven, and whose sins you shall retain,” &c. “One to another,” has the restricted meaning assigned to it here in several passages of Scripture, thus: (Romans 15:7), “receive one another,” though it only refers to the strong supporting the weak; (1 Thes. 5:11), “comfort one another”; (Ephes. 5), “be subject to one another.” And St. James says, “confess to one another.” in order to remove the shame of confessing our sins, by showing that it is not to angels or beings of a higher nature we are confessing; but to weak mortal men like ourselves, and perhaps also to show that the priests too are bound by this precept. At all events- whether this latter interpretation be the true one or not matters but very little, as far as the warrant for absolving from sins, on the part of the priests is concerned. It is from the words of Christ to his Apostles, “receive you the Holy Ghost, whose sins you shall forgive,” &c., and from the constant tradition of the Church, that the existence of this power is clearly demonstrated. “And pray one for another.” This is specially to be understood of the just praying for sinners. “That you may be saved,” that is, obtain converts on to God, and the great gift of final perseverance. “For the continual prayer of the just,” &c. The Greek word for " continual," ενεργουμενη, means, fervent, earnest. " Availes much" with God; because, he is his favorite and friend.
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COPLAND_3
Guest
St. Thomas Aquinas in the Summa Says this
James speaks on the presupposition of the Divine institutions: and since confession had already been prescribed by God to be made to a priest, in that He empowered them, in the person of the apostles, to forgive sins, as related in Jn. 20:23, we must take the words of James as conveying an admonishment to confess to priests.
Bishop Richard Challoner says this
Confess therefore your sins one to another: That is, to the priests of the church, whom (ver. 14) he had ordered to be called for, and brought in to the sick; moreover, to confess to persons who had no power to forgive sins, would be useless. Hence the precept here means, that we must confess to men whom God hath appointed, and who, by their ordination and jurisdiction, have received the power of remitting sins in his name.
The Haydock Bible says
Confess, therefore, your sins, &c. Divers interpreters expound this of sacramental confession, though, as the authors of the annotations on the Rheims Testament observe, this is not certain. The words one to another, may signify that it is not enough to confess to God, but that we must also confess to men, and not to every man, but to those whom God appointed, and to whom he hath given the power of remitting sins in his name. I cannot but observe that no mention at all is made, “in the visitation and communion of the sick,” in the Protestant common prayer book, of this comfortable passage out of St. James, of calling in the priests of the Church, of their anointing him with oil…and that his sins shall be forgiven him. Perhaps having laid aside that sacrament, it seemed to them better to say nothing of those words. But such a confession as is practised by all Catholics, is at least there advised. “The sick person,” saith the book of common prayer, "here shall be moved to make a special confession of his sins…After which confession, the priest shall absolve him after this sort. Our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath left power to his Church to absolve all sinners, who truly repent, forgive thee…and by his authority committed to me, I absolve thee from all thy sins, in the name of the Father, " &c. Here is a special confession, or a confession of particular sins; here is a power of forgiving sins in God’s name, acknowledged to be given to the Church, and to priests; here are the very same words used by every Catholic priest in the sacrament of penance. This is clearly ordained in their liturgy: how far it is complied with, I know not. (Witham) — One to another. That is, to the priests of the Church, whom (ver. 14.) he had ordered to be called for, and brought in to the sick: moreover, to confess to persons who had no power to forgive sins, would be useless. Hence the precept here means that we must confess to men whom God hath appointed, and who, by their ordination and jurisdiction, have received the power of remitting sins in his name. (Challoner) — Pray for one another. Here is recommended prayer in general, as a most necessary Christian duty. He encourages them to it by the example of Elias[Elijah]. (Witham)
James speaks on the presupposition of the Divine institutions: and since confession had already been prescribed by God to be made to a priest, in that He empowered them, in the person of the apostles, to forgive sins, as related in Jn. 20:23, we must take the words of James as conveying an admonishment to confess to priests.
Bishop Richard Challoner says this
Confess therefore your sins one to another: That is, to the priests of the church, whom (ver. 14) he had ordered to be called for, and brought in to the sick; moreover, to confess to persons who had no power to forgive sins, would be useless. Hence the precept here means, that we must confess to men whom God hath appointed, and who, by their ordination and jurisdiction, have received the power of remitting sins in his name.
The Haydock Bible says
Confess, therefore, your sins, &c. Divers interpreters expound this of sacramental confession, though, as the authors of the annotations on the Rheims Testament observe, this is not certain. The words one to another, may signify that it is not enough to confess to God, but that we must also confess to men, and not to every man, but to those whom God appointed, and to whom he hath given the power of remitting sins in his name. I cannot but observe that no mention at all is made, “in the visitation and communion of the sick,” in the Protestant common prayer book, of this comfortable passage out of St. James, of calling in the priests of the Church, of their anointing him with oil…and that his sins shall be forgiven him. Perhaps having laid aside that sacrament, it seemed to them better to say nothing of those words. But such a confession as is practised by all Catholics, is at least there advised. “The sick person,” saith the book of common prayer, "here shall be moved to make a special confession of his sins…After which confession, the priest shall absolve him after this sort. Our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath left power to his Church to absolve all sinners, who truly repent, forgive thee…and by his authority committed to me, I absolve thee from all thy sins, in the name of the Father, " &c. Here is a special confession, or a confession of particular sins; here is a power of forgiving sins in God’s name, acknowledged to be given to the Church, and to priests; here are the very same words used by every Catholic priest in the sacrament of penance. This is clearly ordained in their liturgy: how far it is complied with, I know not. (Witham) — One to another. That is, to the priests of the Church, whom (ver. 14.) he had ordered to be called for, and brought in to the sick: moreover, to confess to persons who had no power to forgive sins, would be useless. Hence the precept here means that we must confess to men whom God hath appointed, and who, by their ordination and jurisdiction, have received the power of remitting sins in his name. (Challoner) — Pray for one another. Here is recommended prayer in general, as a most necessary Christian duty. He encourages them to it by the example of Elias[Elijah]. (Witham)
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Fragile
Guest
None of you believe this passage also encourages us to confess our sins to one another and pray for each other, meaning other than just the ordained priests, don’t we do just that here in the forums?
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LilyM
Guest
Confession is good for the soul - if you want to talk to your best friend, your therapist or your dog about your sins, have at it.
But for mortal (serious) sins, for a Catholic, only confession to a priest can in normal circumstances procure God’s absolution for them.
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Fragile
Guest
You know very well that’s not what I meant.
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LilyM
Guest
Of course everything you mentioned helps greatly, and is all to be encouraged. I mean that sincerely.
The fact remains that it is nonetheless no substitute, for a Catholic, for sacramental confession to a priest. It does not and cannot achieve what sacramental confession does. Unfortunately too many Catholics seem to think that it is a complete substitute. There is a real difference between the two and we need to be clear on that.
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NotWorthy
Guest
Maybe so. But if any of my friends gets mad at me and refuses to forgive me, that is not detrimental to my soul.
If I go to a priest and ask his forgiveness because I’m shacking up with my girlfriend, and he refuses to forgive me, because I plan on continuing living with my girlfriend, then truly my soul is in jeopardy, for God has not forgiven me.
By the way, that was just a hypothetical case, I hope you all know!
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De_Maria
Guest
Not me.
Perhaps as we do in the confiteore. But St. James, in my opinion, seems to be describing an ancient form of the Mass.
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NotWorthy
Guest
Which is why we look at Scripture as a whole. John chapter 20 (20-22) supports the Catholic teaching on the Sacrament of Penance very adequately!
po18guy
Well-known member
As NotWorthy indicates, confession is good for the soul - yet the Catholic and Orthodox Churches have the Sacrament in which we are ministerially absolved of our sins and reconciled with the Lord. We hear the words of absolution in like manner as Jesus spoke them to sinners that He forgave (Matthew 9:2, Mark 2:5, Luke 5:20, Luke 7:48).
The problem that some bible Christians have with this concept is that they lack the oral Apostolic Tradition, and often the knowledge of the early Church. When the written Tradition (scripture) is separated from the oral Tradition, the believer is placed in the position of essentially reverse-engineering the faith, using the bible alone, to fill in the missing parts. In other words, what James wrote cannot be separated either from the oral apostolic Tradition, or from early Church practice. Neither can what James wrote be separated from what Paul wrote 2 Corinthians 2:10, in which Paul forgave sins in the person of Christ, just as each and every Catholic (and Eastern Orthodox) Priest and Bishop does.
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Ion
Guest
At the hospital, I remember, there was a volunteer for spiritual counseling (including confession), but strange thing, that person was not a christian…
Can you confess, in extraordinary circumstances, to that person?
Can you confess, in extraordinary circumstances, to that person?
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kkollwitz
Guest
James’ advice cannot limit or nullify Jesus’ statements in John 20.
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Fragile
Guest
Seems this passage, while not nullifying the sacrament of reconciliation, is speaking of brothers and sister doing life together, helping each other out on the journey. Something that also takes place in the 12-step groups, or most accountability groups.
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NotWorthy
Guest
Absolutely!
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57Bill
Guest
I think the understanding of the verse in the context of (James 5 13:20) as more of counseling and praying for someone in “error” rather than a lame reason against Catholic confession.
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NotWorthy
Guest
Good point.
I think its also important to point out that Confession for the forgiveness of sins was an established practice in the Kingdom of Israel.
***when someone is guilty in regard to any of these matters, that person shall confess the wrong committed, ***and make reparation to the LORD for the wrong committed: a female animal from the flock, a ewe lamb or a she-goat, as a purification offering. Thus the priest shall make atonement on the individual’s behalf for the wrong. (Lev. 5:5-6)
This, of course, pre-figured the Sacrament of Penance in the New Kingdom of God - The Church.
po18guy
Well-known member
Nehemiah 9:2
Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition (DRA)
And the seed of the children of Israel separated themselves from every stranger: and they stood, and confessed their sins, and the iniquities of their fathers.
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kentuckyliz
Guest
I am not confessing my sins to anyone but a priest.
EVERYONE ELSE GOSSIPS.
(We are so lucky, Catholics!!!)
- No authority to absolve.
- Even psychologists, doctors, counselors, can be compelled to testify in court (subpoena)
- The seal of the confessional is absolutely legally protected
- The priest who gossips about confession content is excommunicated and stripped of his priesthood
EVERYONE ELSE GOSSIPS.
(We are so lucky, Catholics!!!)
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