Controversial saints should they be emulated

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He was just providing his testimony. Seven years does seem like an awfully long time to fast.

Saint Catherine of Siena, as a doctor of the Church, holds one of the highest honors of distinction in the Catholic Church, being shared by only 35 other saints, like Saint Therese of the Child Jesus and Teresa of Avila.
 
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JamalChristophr said:
Her fasting did not affect her energy, however. She maintained a very active life during those seven years.
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This.

Usually with anorexia or starvation, the person loses energy, becomes lethargic and sluggish and develops a whole host of health symptoms along the way.

Also, these were the days before vaccines, of poor nutrition and sanitation, and life expectancy was much lower across the board.

But I will say this–that our mental health is highly affected by the times in which we live, and the outward manifestations of disorder look different in different times and places.

Here’s an example. In the early 1900s, there was a phenomenon called the “fugue state”, where a person would simply vanish, then years later be found in a city far, far away, under a different name, with a whole new life, and seemingly no recollection of how they got there.

When was the last time you met a person in a fugue state?

Were Catherine of Sienna and Maria Goretti suffering from undiagnosed and untreated mental illness? We have no way to measure that by our 20the century standards. But mental illness doesn’t prevent a person from achieving holiness.
 
I take such scholarly writing as an attempt to describe the actions of the holy saints in a materialist standpoint, to attempt to remove their holiness or undermine our view of what is good.

Those saints who underwent severe mortification has men and women, and I doubt that sitting in a cave whipping yourself all day is gaining power politically (I am describing a certain saint known for striking himself upon reading the psalms).

And, it’s not like all these holy women did were mortification, it included much work and good deeds.

And I highly doubt St Teresa of Avila didn’t have a special gift in the Eucharist to survive 7 years while doing work. The longest recorded fasting is a little over a year, with a group of medical attendants, for a GROSSLY obese man.

And Neumann was watched for a very long period by a group of doctors all day.

Perhaps you’d be good in acting as the devils advocate when it comes to canonization…
 
We are called to do the penance we are called to do. If you are not called to do severe penance, then don’t do severe penance. That does not make you less holy, but moreso than if you did extra, as it means you are following God’s Will.
 
Here is a funny anecdote for everyone:

Father Solanus Casey, a Cappuchin Franciscan , who is now a Blessed, was known to pour, every morning, his orange juice, coffe, and cereal all into one bowl! How is that for a refined taste! (I’m hoping there was milk in there, somewhere.) Anyways, I think it was everyday at the friary, I’m not 100% certain. Likely not on Sundays and feast days, at least.

It’s a mortification we could all do, but I don’t feel so inspired at the moment, sorry.

http://www.themichigancatholic.org/...ique-breakfast-penance-shows-childlike-faith/
 
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JamalChristophr said:
Saint Catherine of Siena, as a doctor of the Church, holds one of the highest honors of distinction in the Catholic Church, being shared by only 35 other saints, like Saint Therese of the Child Jesus and Teresa of Avila.
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This has nothing to do with her eating and self-mortification habits, in my mind. The Church is certainly not suggesting that we emulate those when we choose virtues of hers to emulate, any more than they want us to physically punish mentally challenged individuals who yell out during the Mass, as St. Thomas More misguidedly did.

Some saints’ habits translate very well across the eras to modern times. It’s not hard to relate to a St. Benedict or a St. Teresa of Avila. Other saints are more difficult or just more “out there”. It doesn’t make them less saintly, but it requires more work and research to understand why they did what they did, and it needs to be understood within the context of their time.

Nevertheless, this sort of cultural debate is one reason why, with a few exceptions, I tend to prefer the more modern saints. If I am looking for somebody to emulate in my daily life today, then somebody at least within a couple hundred years of my era is likely to be more relatable than someone from hundreds of years ago.
 
Of course there’s one saint I wonder about: St. Simeon the Stylite, who lived on the platform of a pillar for 37 years.

I read that he had gangrene from wearing his belt too tightly. Worms fell out of his sores.
 
It’s good to think about different types of mortification.

Fasting is a form of mortification.

St Josemaria referred to mortification as the “prayer of the senses”.

For example, when we fast we should take advantage of the pangs of hunger in order to remind us to “talk with God more”.

One priest I know said “never fast alone…fast with God”.

Fasting is a form of active mortification…deliberately doing something difficult in order to
  • strengthen the will (to help us when we have cases where we have no choice but to put up with pain, discomfort (passive mortification).
  • offer penance for our own sins
  • offer sacrifices for others that we know (or don’t know)
  • set a good example of living with a sporting Christian spirit, confident in our Father God’s care over us.
etc.

There are the very dramatic mortifications (the discipline, the cilice)…then there are the “little ones”.

If we “lived” a spirit of constant mortification (highly recommended, properly understood) we’d never run out of “little mortifications”…we’d “squeeze” out of the day a whole lot of grace.

Waking up more vigorously/deliberately/resolutely
Smiling more.
Tackling the hard task first, not stopping until it’s completed
Serving others quietly and cheerfully
Going to bed on time, according to our determined plan.
Sitting up more straight.
Adding a bit of order to our home as we walk around it.

Most of us aren’t living celibate lives or a very demanding schedule that some priests and religious have to live, so we don’t need anything more than little passive mortifications, and perhaps a few well chosen voluntary or active ones (shorter showers, cold water rinse at the end of the shower).
 
Maria Goretti’s hatred for sin, love of purity, and spirit of forgiveness is quite admirable. Mortifications are really good, but the extreme ones are only allowed with permission from a spiritual director.Of course they are not really necessary (the extreme mortifications) but the simple lifestyle and sublime interior life is an important aspect of Catholism.
 
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