Controversy erupts over Campus Republicans bake sale plans

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Rich_Olszewski said:
Who gives a r.a. about what I believe? I’m a nobody when it comes to politics. What counts is that the policy is in place, it’s being implemented, and those who want to see it abolished will have a tough row to hoe to do that, and will do so to the peril of the GOP. Sorry, but I take a very practical view of such things.
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You lend your support for this unjust system, then wish to claim yourself as not responsible for this support because you do not believe you effect the outcome.

You are not being very logical.
 
vz71 said:
You lend your support for this unjust system, then wish to claim yourself as not responsible for this support because you do not believe you effect the outcome.
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I do not now, nor ever have considered AA unjust. That’s your take on it. And, yes, I do not affect the outcome, regardless of my being for or against it.
You are not being very logical.
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I am being honest.
 
vz71 said:
As has been indicated a number of times now, morality is not dictated by majority.
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You are one of those who considers AA immoral. I do not. Many Americans do not.
And you believe this absolves you of responsibility of your support?
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Nothing to be absolved. I consider AA to be a fine policy, allowing the disadvantaged a hand up.
 
ByzCath said:
So it appears that now we do not agree on the definition of two words, discussion and discrimination. I have asked you for your definition of discrimination but you do not seem to wish to supply that so that limits the discussion.
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Discrimination is the prejudicial treatment of an individual based on his or her membership in a certain group or category. It involves the actual behaviors towards groups such as excluding or restricting members of one group from opportunities that are available to another group.

That very well fits the situation that many black and hispanic people find themselves in. AA is an effort to correct that.
 
I would like to focus on AA at the College/University level. Now it would seem to me that education institutes like these can’t accept everyone that applies so choices would have to be made. I believe that every University can have academic factors (A’s or B’s) that can remove some of the applicants and I would say that is not discrimination in a bad sense. However even the C students should be allowed to enter some College’s or Universities in their respective area.

I would say that perhaps the way to effectively eliminate AA without it costing either party is to have more post secondary institutions because the underlying problem with it currently is not AA but that demand for post secondary education greatly exceeds supply. Is it not feasible for more Post secondary institutions to be opened?
 
JMJSHJ said:
I would like to focus on AA at the College/University level. Now it would seem to me that education institutes like these can’t accept everyone that applies so choices would have to be made. I believe that every University can have academic factors (A’s or B’s) that can remove some of the applicants and I would say that is not discrimination in a bad sense. However even the C students should be allowed to enter some College’s or Universities in their respective area.

I would say that perhaps the way to effectively eliminate AA without it costing either party is to have more post secondary institutions because the underlying problem with it currently is not AA but that demand for post secondary education greatly exceeds supply. Is it not feasible for more Post secondary institutions to be opened?
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Your argument that it is very much a matter of supply and demand and more supply would tend to alleviate the problem is a sound one in my opinion. Even junior college can be a stepping stone to a full college or a university for it allows the student, denied enrollment, to show how well he or she can do.
 
Rich_Olszewski said:
Discrimination is the prejudicial treatment of an individual based on his or her membership in a certain group or category. It involves the actual behaviors towards groups such as excluding or restricting members of one group from opportunities that are available to another group.

That very well fits the situation that many black and hispanic people find themselves in. AA is an effort to correct that.
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Just what exactly can black and hispanics not do that whites can, I mean, beside actually be caucasian?
 
Scott_Lafrance said:
Just what exactly can black and hispanics not do that whites can, I mean, beside actually be caucasian?
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Perhaps not get equal treatment in college entrance and in job placement and advancement?

I am certain of this - there will be argument over AA for years to come, and it will be with us that long. I cannot see how abolishing it will do any good.
 
vz71 said:
Wrong.
As this thread can attest to, AA has assured us that caucasians will be discriminated against.

That answer fails.
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Okay, fair opinion. If so, then when can we expect to see the policy abolished?
Try again?
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No. Yes, some Caucasians may be discriminated against. The benefits outweigh the negatives in my opinion and in the opinion of those who have promulgated the policy.

I would add that given the controversial nature of the policy, partisans of either side are most unlikely to switch sides.
 
Rich_Olszewski said:
Yes, some Caucasians may be discriminated against.
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Well, as Reagan said “There you go again…”

Race based discrimination is wrong.
Always has been, always will be.

I fail to understand why you would defend a system that you acknowledge is discriminatory.
 
vz71 said:
Well, as Reagan said “There you go again…”

Race based discrimination is wrong.
Always has been, always will be.

I fail to understand why you would defend a system that you acknowledge is discriminatory.
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:rolleyes:If AA is Ok for the Dayton police force and Supreme Court Judges, it is Ok for Colleges and Universities.:rolleyes:
 
Rich_Olszewski said:
Discrimination is the prejudicial treatment of an individual based on his or her membership in a certain group or category. It involves the actual behaviors towards groups such as excluding or restricting members of one group from opportunities that are available to another group.

That very well fits the situation that many black and hispanic people find themselves in. AA is an effort to correct that.
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So you are able to hold two contradicting positions within you mind.

AA grants preferences based on race which is prejudicial treatment of an individual due to his or her membership in a certain race yet you claim this is not discrimination.
 
vz71 said:
Well, as Reagan said “There you go again…”

Race based discrimination is wrong.
Always has been, always will be.

I fail to understand why you would defend a system that you acknowledge is discriminatory.
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Sorry you do. I see it as a policy that offers opportunities to those who have been denied them, most often on the basis of their race. To you “discriminatory” is a negative; I see beyond that, and weigh the benefits versus the negatives.

Affirmative action is the result of a presidential order created to increase the inclusion of historically excluded groups in the workplace and places of education. I am comfortable with that and with its implementation.
 
ByzCath said:
So you are able to hold two contradicting positions within you mind.

AA grants preferences based on race which is prejudicial treatment of an individual due to his or her membership in a certain race yet you claim this is not discrimination.
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How are the preferences given on the basis of race prejudicial treatment to the person receiving them?
 
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