Could Muhammad of been a prophet?

  • Thread starter Thread starter YosefYosep
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YosefYosep said:
Hmmm… God doesn’t make mistakes, but man, given his free will, does make many.
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Are you saying that the birth of a child with spina bifida or a child without arms is not God’s mistake? How about a child born blind?
 
YosefYosep said:
Yes, the utterly complete destruction of sin.

Isaiah 53:10
Yet it was the LORD’s will to crush him and cause him to suffer, and though the LORD makes his life an offering for sin, he will see his offspring and prolong his days, and the will of the LORD will prosper in his hand.
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This is a quote from the Old Testament. I wanted a quote from the New Testament.
 
FireFromHeaven said:
Exactly. All I am saying is that in its early days Islam spread like any imperial power of the time.
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Actually it was the spread of the Islamic Empire, not the spread of the Islamic Religion. The motivation for building the Islamic Empire was mainly political.
 
TheSufi said:
God’s Justice is based on complete knowledge of everything, past, present and future. While our (man’s) justice would be based on limited knowledge.
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With all respect I see a flaw in Islamic understanding of Justice.

Allah forgives sin without the appropriate atonement demanded by his honour.

In other words when man sins against God, God by his very nature being just requires atonement to compensate for the sinful offence. Nothing man can do can suffice the atonement required. It was an infinite offence, hence an infinite atonement is needed and this is the good news, the gospel:

JESUS PAID THE DEBT WE COULDN’T, ALLELUIA! :extrahappy:
 
I think we need to be careful when we speak about God’s wrath. It’s not the human kind…like the out of control kind for instance.

MJ
 
nmgauss said:
I see threats. What I am looking for are actual deeds.
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Jesus predicted the fall of Jerusalem. An estimated 1.1 million Jews died. Josephus describes it as the most horrific disaster sent by God ever to befall the sons of Jacob (I’m paraphrasing).
 
Augustine3 said:
Jesus predicted the fall of Jerusalem. An estimated 1.1 million Jews died. Josephus describes it as the most horrific disaster sent by God ever to befall the sons of Jacob (I’m paraphrasing).
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But this does not appear in the Bible. The pagan Romans destroyed Jerusalem. How does God figure into this? In your interpretation, God visited disaster upon the Jews, but not the Gentiles? That would indicate that the Jewish God was more vengeful than the Christian God. Or maybe the Christian God was angry at the Jews and destroyed their city. At least he was not angry at Christians. What would be the reason for God’s role in destroying Jerusalem?

I don’t think that any city in Palestine in at era could support over a million people. I doubt that there were even a million people in Judea. The area was and still is semi-arid.
 
nmgauss said:
But this does not appear in the Bible. The pagan Romans destroyed Jerusalem. How does God figure into this? In your interpretation, God visited disaster upon the Jews, but not the Gentiles? That would indicate that the Jewish God was more vengeful than the Christian God. Or maybe the Christian God was angry at the Jews and destroyed their city. At least he was not angry at Christians. What would be the reason for God’s role in destroying Jerusalem?

I don’t think that any city in Palestine in at era could support over a million people. I doubt that there were even a million people in Judea. The area was and still is semi-arid.
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I’ve already mentioned Jesus predicted this disaster.

Check out Mark chapter 13.
 
nmgauss said:
In your interpretation, God visited disaster upon the Jews, but not the Gentiles? That would indicate that the Jewish God was more vengeful than the Christian God.
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Please don’t put words into my mouth, I never said such a thing. Many disasters have come upon gentiles. So what if it’s not in the bible? Is there a single thing that happens without God knowing about it? God doesn’t just sit back and watch. He allows things to happen for specific purposes in accordance with his will.
nmgauss said:
Or maybe the Christian God was angry at the Jews and destroyed their city.
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Actually there’s a very strong parallel of vengeance between the OT and NT. Jonah preached to the Assyrians. The Assyrians repented for a short while and were spared for about 40 years, then God used them to conquer Judah. St’s Peter and Paul preached in Rome. The Romans repented for a short while and were spared for about 40 years, then God used them to conquer Jerusalem.
nmgauss said:
At least he was not angry at Christians.
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Who said God has not punished the Christians? Christians have been persecuted for centuries in all sorts of forms – whether it be military means or worse yet schisms within the Church which is pretty where you are sitting my non-denomination friend.
nmgauss said:
I don’t think that any city in Palestine in at era could support over a million people. I doubt that there were even a million people in Judea. The area was and still is semi-arid.
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I would rather go with a well trusted and respected historian like Josephus than your contention (no offence).
 
MartinJordan said:
The article starts about Mussolini and the CC. I found that odd but I don’t agree with it.🤷

MJ
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Cool – no worries 😉

Anyway we’ve obviously gone off topic in this thread. Muhammed cannot be a prophet because he contradicts the gospel – end of story.
 
nmgauss said:
Actually it was the spread of the Islamic Empire, not the spread of the Islamic Religion. The motivation for building the Islamic Empire was mainly political.
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True. But this empire was a theocracy led for a while by the companions of Muhammad. That’s like te apostles leading an army to overthrow the roman empire.
 
FireFromHeaven said:
True. But this empire was a theocracy led for a while by the companions of Muhammad. That’s like te apostles leading an army to overthrow the roman empire.
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You’re assuming that the primary purpose was to spread Islam. The evidence points to the initial main purpose of uniting the warring tribes of Arabia into one nation (ummah). The goal was less to spread the word of Al-Lah than to create a spirit of respect and cooperation among all the tribes to form an ummah. When Jews and Christians became part of the Islamic Empire they became part of the ummah but remained Jews and Christians if they so choosed. The only ones persecuted were those that opposed the polity of the empire.

Non-Muslims were viewed as brothers and sisters in terms of all being children of Adam. The Muslim Ummah is responsible for upholding the religion and therefore benefiting the community regardless whether the community is Muslim or non-Muslim.
 
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