Could the sin of homosexuality be less grave for someone of the next generation

[pepipop]

due to the continuing and growing acceptance of homosexuality by society in general? I am thinking of today’s kids growing up and seeing SS couples marrying, getting homosexual education in school, the total acceptance of SS couples, and so on. Obviously, this will ‘dilute’ the sinfulness of such acts, whether the children are catholic/christian/muslim/jewish, as without doubt society can and does influence young people growing up.

For example, in 20 yrs time, there will be a good chance that your best friend at school will have two fathers/mothers, rather than the normal family.

 

[gubernova]

Uh, the Church believes in absolutism. Homosexuality is not a sin in itself, only if the person commits a homosexual act. Natural law pretty much dictates homosexuality is not correct. It is “abnormal” because it is not conducive to the survival of a species. People may become more indifferent, but it will always be a sinful act.

 

[joclucsylv]

due to the continuing and growing acceptance of homosexuality by society in general? I am thinking of today’s kids growing up and seeing SS couples marrying, getting homosexual education in school, the total acceptance of SS couples, and so on. Obviously, this will ‘dilute’ the sinfulness of such acts, whether the children are catholic/christian/muslim/jewish, as without doubt society can and does influence young people growing up.

For example, in 20 yrs time, there will be a good chance that your best friend at school will have two fathers/mothers, rather than the normal family.

Forget 20 years time. It’s here now my friend. My 8 year old second grader came home the other day asking what gay meant. She then told me that there are 2 boys in her class who’s mothers want to get married. These are things my parents never had to deal with when they were raising their family. Families were whole. Divorce and gays getting married wasn’t heard of. It stresses me out that I have to explain these things to my children.

My heard my daughter ask her friend in her class if her mom and dad were married. When the little boy said, “no” she innocently looked at him and asked how they made him.

I pray for my children and for the Blessed Mother to give me guidance!!

 

[pepipop]

Uh, the Church believes in absolutism. Homosexuality is not a sin in itself, only if the person commits a homosexual act. Natural law pretty much dictates homosexuality is not correct. It is “abnormal” because it is not conducive to the survival of a species. People may become more indifferent, but it will always be a sinful act.

Yes, it will always be a sinful act until the end of time. However, will the graveness of the sin be diluted due to the full acceptance (if that happens) throughout governments, society. Kids are being taught about it at school, their next door neighbours, in future, may be a SS couple with kids, and so on.

 

[michelleds]

Yes, it will always be a sinful act until the end of time. However, will the graveness of the sin be diluted due to the full acceptance (if that happens) throughout governments, society. Kids are being taught about it at school, their next door neighbours, in future, may be a SS couple with kids, and so on.

The graveness of sin is not mitigated by the number of people doing something. wrong is wrong even if everyone is doing it and right is right even if no one is doing it.

As Sister Mariam said on the radio the other day, (paraphrasing) you can’t rely on schools to teach your children about Catholic morals.

 

[floresco]

Yes, it will always be a sinful act until the end of time. However, will the graveness of the sin be diluted due to the full acceptance (if that happens) throughout governments, society. Kids are being taught about it at school, their next door neighbours, in future, may be a SS couple with kids, and so on.

The objective gravity of the sin is not affected by these things. However, the culpability of the individuals committing the sin can be affected by factors of this sort.

 

[funion987]

Right. I guess it’s just up to parents to ground their children in the truth, especially when it comes to sex. Homosexual behavior is one element, but there are many others that are also especially promenant. In movies, it seems that if there is a male and female who like each other, it’s a given that they fornicate.

I think also that it would be good for children to go to frequent confession. If they have sexual sins, the priest is usually really good at explaining the meaning behind the Catholic doctrines and why these sins are serious.

 

[MtnDwellar]

The objective gravity of the sin is not affected by these things. However, the culpability of the individuals committing the sin can be affected by factors of this sort.

I didn’t know that culpability could be lessened by these sort of factors.

That’s good to know.

If enough people are doing something, could culpability become fully mitigated and then an act that was once a sin would no longer be sinful?

 

[floresco]

I didn’t know that culpability could be lessened by these sort of factors.

That’s good to know.

If enough people are doing something, could culpability become fully mitigated and then an act that was once a sin would no longer be sinful?

When were are talking about culpability, we are talking about something subjective that depends on specific individuals in specific situations. It is theoretically possible for an objectively sinful action not to result in any culpability under some circumstances. One of the factors that affects culpability is ignorance for which they are not responsible. If a person is taught from childhood that a sin is a good thing, it is possible that they are not responsible for their ignorance of what is right. The number of people committing a sin would probably not affect culpability directly, but it could contribute to ignorance.

However, only God can know if, or to what extent, circumstances which reduce culpability have occurred. It is not possible for us to judge whether any given individual is culpable of a sin. What we know about is objective sin. Through reason and through Church teaching we can know that certain actions are objectively sinful. We cannot know about the subjective spiritual state of the sinner.

 

[pepipop]

The objective gravity of the sin is not affected by these things. However, the culpability of the individuals committing the sin can be affected by factors of this sort.

Yes, that was I was referring to, I did not use the correct terminology. Thanks.

 

[edwest2]

due to the continuing and growing acceptance of homosexuality by society in general? I am thinking of today’s kids growing up and seeing SS couples marrying, getting homosexual education in school, the total acceptance of SS couples, and so on. Obviously, this will ‘dilute’ the sinfulness of such acts, whether the children are catholic/christian/muslim/jewish, as without doubt society can and does influence young people growing up.

For example, in 20 yrs time, there will be a good chance that your best friend at school will have two fathers/mothers, rather than the normal family.

What society does will not change Church teaching. Right now, the media is leading the charge with movies, computer games and even comic books that portray gay sexual relationships as normal.

Society, in the context you speak of, is the media, not the Church. As long as we reject such media and give the next generation clear Church teaching, it won’t dilute or change anything. In the United States, it was not the will of the people at the voting booth but individual politicians and judges that ‘changed’ things.

Some of our Jewish neighbors are very clear about this:

jewishworldreview.com/jeff/jacoby_gay_marriage.php3

It is simply time to clearly present the truth with charity:

vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20030731_homosexual-unions_en.html

Do this and there will be less confusion 20 years from now and today.

Peace,
Ed

 

[edwest2]

Yes, it will always be a sinful act until the end of time. However, will the graveness of the sin be diluted due to the full acceptance (if that happens) throughout governments, society. Kids are being taught about it at school, their next door neighbours, in future, may be a SS couple with kids, and so on.

Then mom and dad need to set them straight. Kids are not stupid, in a basic sense, but they do not instinctively know about certain things. Do not let the media educate kids. And I could care less if my next door neighbor today is a same-sex couple with kids. It is not up to me to judge them or give them a hard time. It is up to every Catholic to understand Church teaching and especially about what marriage really is, and to teach it to the next generation.

Peace,
Ed

 

[pepipop]

Then mom and dad need to set them straight. Kids are not stupid, in a basic sense, but they do not instinctively know about certain things. Do not let the media educate kids. And I could care less if my next door neighbor today is a same-sex couple with kids. It is not up to me to judge them or give them a hard time. It is up to every Catholic to understand Church teaching and especially about what marriage really is, and to teach it to the next generation.

Peace,
Ed

Well that’s all well and good for those children lucky enough to be born into good, responsible catholic families. Kids also go to school and listen, interact with their peers, teachers. Why judge the SS couple next door, the point was made in reference to their acceptance in society, i.e. it will be seen as a ‘norm’ and hence ‘influence’ children?

I would also include children brought up in families with no religious beliefs and/or into SS relationships, i.e. that committing the sin of homosexuality may make those comitting the sin less culpable, than in previous generations, due to the increasing acceptance of the behaviour.

 

[Nate13]

IV. ERRONEOUS JUDGMENT

1790 A human being must always obey the certain judgment of his conscience. If he were deliberately to act against it, he would condemn himself. Yet it can happen that moral conscience remains in ignorance and makes erroneous judgments about acts to be performed or already committed.

1791 This ignorance can often be imputed to personal responsibility. This is the case when a man "takes little trouble to find out what is true and good, or when conscience is by degrees almost blinded through the habit of committing sin."59 In such cases, the person is culpable for the evil he commits.

1792 Ignorance of Christ and his Gospel, bad example given by others, enslavement to one’s passions, assertion of a mistaken notion of autonomy of conscience, rejection of the Church’s authority and her teaching, lack of conversion and of charity: these can be at the source of errors of judgment in moral conduct.

1793 If - on the contrary - the ignorance is invincible, or the moral subject is not responsible for his erroneous judgment, the evil committed by the person cannot be imputed to him. It remains no less an evil, a privation, a disorder. One must therefore work to correct the errors of moral conscience.

1794 A good and pure conscience is enlightened by true faith, for charity proceeds at the same time "from a pure heart and a good conscience and sincere faith."60

The above applies to all sins regardless. Because of the change in culture, the immorality of homosexual acts may become less well known just like the sin of fornication has become. Knowing whether someone was personally responsible for their ignorance in such matters is something only God can judge, although we do know it will be taken into account in his judgment if that answers your question.

 

[edwest2]

Well that’s all well and good for those children lucky enough to be born into good, responsible catholic families. Kids also go to school and listen, interact with their peers, teachers. Why judge the SS couple next door, the point was made in reference to their acceptance in society, i.e. it will be seen as a ‘norm’ and hence ‘influence’ children?

I would also include children brought up in families with no religious beliefs and/or into SS relationships, i.e. that committing the sin of homosexuality may make those comitting the sin less culpable, than in previous generations, due to the increasing acceptance of the behaviour.

Did you read the Vatican teaching I posted a link to? You are assuming a society where the Church, both priests and laity, become silent about this matter. The point I’m making is, who is advancing their acceptance into society? Not the Church, not practicing Catholics, not priests and religious schools.

Yes, kids brought up without religious beliefs or in SS families will be confused but they will not hear silence from those who understand clear Church teaching. Only silence will make them less culpable if they become confused and act out homosexual behavior.

I think the broader issue is this: if you look at the major problems facing Western society today, especially in developed countries, it mostly revolves around deviant (atypical) sexual behavior. Legalizing such behavior will not change the nature of the behavior and publicizing it more will not change Church teaching.

Peace,
Ed

 

[MtnDwellar]

When were are talking about culpability, we are talking about something subjective that depends on specific individuals in specific situations. It is theoretically possible for an objectively sinful action not to result in any culpability under some circumstances. One of the factors that affects culpability is ignorance for which they are not responsible. If a person is taught from childhood that a sin is a good thing, it is possible that they are not responsible for their ignorance of what is right. The number of people committing a sin would probably not affect culpability directly, but it could contribute to ignorance.

However, only God can know if, or to what extent, circumstances which reduce culpability have occurred. It is not possible for us to judge whether any given individual is culpable of a sin. What we know about is objective sin. Through reason and through Church teaching we can know that certain actions are objectively sinful. We cannot know about the subjective spiritual state of the sinner.

I am not clear about what you are saying. Are you saying that if enough people are committing the sin, then reason and Church teaching are overridden? If an objectively sinful act becomes common place, a person can become invincibly ignorant?

That probably applies, in many cases, to contraception and will also apply to homosexual acts.

 

[thistle]

due to the continuing and growing acceptance of homosexuality by society in general? I am thinking of today’s kids growing up and seeing SS couples marrying, getting homosexual education in school, the total acceptance of SS couples, and so on. Obviously, this will ‘dilute’ the sinfulness of such acts, whether the children are catholic/christian/muslim/jewish, as without doubt society can and does influence young people growing up.

For example, in 20 yrs time, there will be a good chance that your best friend at school will have two fathers/mothers, rather than the normal family.

Sexual acts between same sexes was, is and always will be a sin of grave matter. It is an infallible teaching and can never be changed.

 

[LJH_80]

Homosexuality is becoming more socially accepted.

But then, so are protestantism, wicca, pre-maritial sex, Islam, and many other things. If you really want to, we can make a timeline of the last several millenia saying what you would be publicly executed for doing.

So we don’t burn witches at the stake any more, and in fact your co-worker at the office may be a lovely, personable Wiccan, who is great fun to talk to.
She’ll still burn in hell.*

You may have another friend who thinks it’s okay for him to have sex with his fiance before they get married. Most of his peers won’t think anything of it, in fact it is to be expected.
He’ll still burn in hell.*

So in 20 years your best friend from kindergarten may decide in the 10th grade that he’s going to date men. By this time it may be completely accepted, and he’ll be able to bring his boyfriend to Prom.
And he’ll still burn in hell*

*:assuming they don’t repent for this before death

So yes, it will be more socially accepted because with the Cap-and-Trade laws in effect, we can’t pay for the CO2 emissions that burning people at the stake creates, but that doesn’t make anything less sinful.

 

[Chochy]

Uh, the Church believes in absolutism. Homosexuality is not a sin in itself, only if the person commits a homosexual act. Natural law pretty much dictates homosexuality is not correct. It is “abnormal” because it is not conducive to the survival of a species. People may become more indifferent, but it will always be a sinful act.

Exactly. And as far as same sex marriage goes, as a wife, I can’t have a wife. As a husband, I can’t have a husband, anymore than I can be someone’s brother, if I am a woman.

Blessings - Chochy

 

[pepipop]

Sexual acts between same sexes was, is and always will be a sin of grave matter. It is an infallible teaching and can never be changed.

I totally and fully understand that. I am talking about a young male/female born today whereby, in 20 yrs time, he/she may have been taught homosexual sex education at school, that SS couples may legally marry and so on. Obviously, the CC’s teaching will never, ever change on this issue - my query was in relation to the ‘level of culpability’ for the person committing the sin in 20 yrs time, due to the full acceptance of the acts by society, which will obviously influence those with SS attraction. Those especially affected would have no religious upbringing and/or SS parents, who would IMO be the least culpable as SS activity would have been seen to be ‘a normal family’ to such children from birth.