Cradle catholics: why do you think other cradle catholics aren't well catechized?

[Ardent_Fire]

That is possible. I think in my case, the actual curriculum given to the teachers to go over with us was just not particularly substantial. Most of the teachers were old enough and were the same age as my parents and likely had catechesis prior to the 60s. But its probably not likely we had one teacher or principal knowing what the other classes were going over but going with what they were given. I remember my 8th grade teacher becoming very upset with us and yelling at us because we didn’t remember most of the basic prayers. I didn’t think much of it at the time but in retrospect as an adult I can understand his surprise and frustration he must have felt at the time.

 

[LisaB]

I’ve had to deal with that, too. NOBODY - and I mean NOBODY - in my youth group that I have talked to knows that you have to be in a state of grace to receive communion. One of the adult team members even tried to ARGUE with me about it. I am serious.

Wow. So with that, maybe we should define what constitutes poorly catechized. What’s the minimum an average lay person should know about their faith as a “practicing Catholic”?

 

[jeannetherese]

That makes sense. Fluffy curricula abound to this day.

My preferred combination for a new era of catechesis would include the Bible, the Baltimore catechism, Ignatius Press’s Faith and Life series, frequent reception of the sacraments of Holy Communion and Confession, adoration and benediction, the study of sacred art, and lots of daily prayer.

 

[Larquetta]

It’s probably because a lot of Catholic parents don’t value their faith and don’t make it a priority to raise their children to be practicing Catholics. Many people are “cafeteria Catholics” and view their faith as a “nice concept” or a “starter kit” for the way they should act rather than as an important part of their lives. Other parents are Catholic merely because it is in their family tradition and not because they believe in God.

 

[Roguish]

Is it better to learn how to love, trust and hope than to learn the theological virtues? How can we teach both?

No need to teach both. Just teach the theological virtues. And the cardinal virtues. And the cardinal sins. The Creed. Dogma. Doctrine. Liturgy. Prayers. Customs. Rites. Lore. Memorize, memorize, memorize. Don’t even check whether they understand any of it – hardly any of them will initially, but that’s not the goal anyway. As for love, trust, charity and all kinds of other touchy-feely aspects of religion, never mind those. They’re all meaningless feel-good terms as long as one is not a well-formed Christian, and for most that comes long, very long after their formation period. Proper catechesis is a matter of bestowing kids or converts with vocabulary, concepts, routines, etc. There’s no way to “make them understand” so there’s no point in trying, or even checking. The heart will connect with the underlying substance of things in its own time.

 

[frettr00]

My experience as a cradle Catholic was going to church and CCD from an early age. I didn’t pay much attention in CCD and just goofed off mostly. For confirmation I picked St. Michael because he was “cool”. Uh, after that I just kept going to church because I decided I believed and then learned the rest about the faith from the internet over the years as well as occasional info from my dad. I’ve read the Bible on my own and have never read the catechism.

 

[GladTidings]

It could be because they ain’t pickin’ up what the holy Spirit is layin’ down. Also, some people have to have something bad happen before they turn to God on a more personal level and start to learn as much as they can about their faith.

 

[Crocus]

I had a Catholic in one class say that they’d never heard Jesus was God.

What a moment of grace!
I hope you seized on that opening. I can just imagine the child looking up, waiting for the explanation.

 

[JimG]

There was a period of time when fluffy and insubstantial texts were not only in vogue but preferred. I was teaching CCD one year when the administration passed out sample texts asking for comments by the teachers. I recommended the Faith and Life series. But they chose a different series–with the most insubstantial and confusing texts of the lot.

 

[jeannetherese]

Unfortunately,
once those fluffy texts are purchased, replacing them is costly and we’re looking at another generation with limited catechesis.
Having read many of your posts, I trust that you provided a great deal of clarification and supplemental materials.

 

[Crocus]

Just teach the theological virtues. And the cardinal virtues. And the cardinal sins. The Creed. Dogma. Doctrine. Liturgy. Prayers. Customs. Rites. Lore. Memorize, memorize, memorize. Don’t even check whether they understand any of it – hardly any of them will initially, but that’s not the goal anyway. As for love, trust, charity and all kinds of other touchy-feely aspects of religion, never mind those. They’re all meaningless feel-good terms as long as one is not a well-formed Christian, and for most that comes long, very long after their formation period. Proper catechesis is a matter of bestowing kids or converts with vocabulary, concepts, routines, etc. There’s no way to “make them understand” so there’s no point in trying, or even checking. The heart will connect with the underlying substance of things in its own time.

I think you’ve got something here. Certainly one way to lay a foundation, that the Holy Spirit can work with at any opportune time. May be my own experience.

For my parents and grandparents, I think they did not have a lot of formal teaching, next to nothing likely, but they faithfully practiced the basics, Mass and rosary. They lived and died as strong, simple Catholics.

 

[Chicken_Pigeon]

Because there typically was never that “aha” moment about how great we have it compared to other faiths or lack of faith. I think many Catholics that aren’t well catechized just want to “get by” while also living up to worldly standards so as to not push the envelope too much

Bokbok

 

[Cjbhoward]

I consider myself a cradle Catholic. I was baptized as a baby, but my parents split up before my first communion & going to Mass every Sunday got pretty complicated.

My kids were baptized as babies, I married a cradle Catholic. I didn’t know what to teach. My wife doesn’t know what to teach. But, my wife & i have tried to set a good example. If I think about it, my mom & my wife’s parents set good examples.

Just like most Catholics know the bible but couldn’t quote chapters & verses… I think we were catechized, more or less.

So when I started really considering what the Church was teaching I came to understand what I already knew in a deeper way. If that makes sense.

Like God’s mercy, dependence on God, & the belief that it is God who will transform me… I just need to let him. I used to wonder why don’t they just say it. In the Mass & in the homily. Then I realized they do. I just wasn’t hearing. It’s all in the hymns, the Psalms, the devotions. I just wasn’t ready I guess.

So I’m thinking, even if I continued my formation as a kid, I wouldn’t have “learned” anything until I was ready to start applying it.

If that makes sense.

 

[Crocus]

So when I started really considering what the Church was teaching I came to understand what I already knew in a deeper way. If that makes sense.

Like God’s mercy, dependence on God, & the belief that it is God who will transform me… I just need to let him. I used to wonder why don’t they just say it. In the Mass & in the homily. Then I realized they do. I just wasn’t hearing. It’s all in the hymns, the Psalms, the devotions.

It does make sense. It is God who calls us, and works with us, from where we are in our journey.

(Happy CAF anniversary! )

 

[RomanChristian]

Bingo you have hit the ball out of the park and landed a homerun…

 

[Roguish]

So when I started really considering what the Church was teaching I came to understand what I already knew in a deeper way. If that makes sense.

Makes perfect sense. Nevertheless, bad catechesis can lead to a situation where uninformed cradle Catholics at some point in their lives discover a need for authentic spirituality and don’t realize that their own religion offers it. Whereas if you were properly catechized, that “click” is much more likely to happen: the recognition of what your religion has been about all along even though you didn’t understand it up to that point.

 

[kgmlg]

I can only speak for myself. Yes cradle catholic, yes religious schools from start till end of high-school, yes a lot of (very strict) catechism while at school.

And yes, very frustrated with myself as I do not remember half of the things we took up in school!

So I think it is not a lack of catechism for us cradle catholics, I think it is more we learn it so young and kinda forget things as we grow older. Same with other things I have learned throughout my life, I tend to retain more if I learned it as an adult…rather than when I was a kid.

A nice refresher course for us old fogies with faulty memory, anyone?

 

[Dovekin]

The primary and essential object of catechesis is, to use an expression dear to St. Paul and also to contemporary theology, “the mystery of Christ.” Catechizing is in a way to lead a person to study this mystery in all its dimensions: “to make all men see what is the plan of the mystery…comprehend with all the saints what is the breadth and length and height and depth …know the love of Christ which surpasses knowledge…(and be filled) with all the fullness of God.” It is therefore to reveal in the Person of Christ the whole of God’s eternal design reaching fulfillment in that Person. It is to seek to understand the meaning of Christ’s actions and words and of the signs worked by Him, for they simultaneously hide and reveal His mystery. Accordingly, the definitive aim of catechesis is to put people not only in touch but in communion, in intimacy, with Jesus Christ: only He can lead us to the love of the Father in the Spirit and make us share in the life of the Holy Trinity. Catechesi Tradendae 5

Teaching philosophical ideals in arcane language is not a good substitute for catechesis. Someday someone might find it useful, but more often people will just be alienated from the content.

It is obvious why you consider most modern catechesis inadequate: you are judging by your own standard while those whom you judge deficient catechists are going by different standards, those proposed by Ss Paul VI and John Paul II. “This teaching is not a body of abstract truths.” CT 7. I doubt that you will ever find any adequate catechesis.

 

[Cjbhoward]

Makes perfect sense. Nevertheless, bad catechesis can lead to a situation where uninformed cradle Catholics at some point in their lives discover a need for authentic spirituality and don’t realize that their own religion offers it . Whereas if you were properly catechized, that “click” is much more likely to happen: the recognition of what your religion has been about all along even though you didn’t understand it up to that point.

I see what you’re saying. & I’m not arguing. I think you’re correct & many are leaving the Church in search of something they already possess.

I was thinking about this & it seems to me we’ve let others define what spirituality is. This “personal relationship with Christ.” “Accept Jesus into your heart.” & now we have Catholics talking like that.

I mean you read the saints & they have a way of talking about a relationship with the holy trinity, which leads to a nuptial union… similar, but different than the “personal relationship” we speak of today, which in comparison seems superficial.

 

[ColorMomma]

This is a complex question, one I have thought about considerably. I am a cradle Catholic, raised on the “liberal” west coast, and the last practicing Catholic in my extended family. My grandparents raised 12 children in The Church, prayed the rosary every Friday as a family, and yet none of my aunts and uncles practice today, including my parent. It is disheartening to say the least. My best guess is that they learned the rules without the reasons. They were made to memorize the Baltimore Catechism, but they didn’t internalize or understand what they were learning. Today, they ridicule “The Rules” of Catholicism. Another factor for them may be that I have a wonderful, loving uncle who is gay. I think they feel that the church doesn’t welcome or accept gay people and they don’t want to be part of a group that excludes. I am just parroting what I have heard as their perceptions.

I think I chose a different path early on, because I decided to investigate the faith. I have done a lot of work to find out why The Church teaches what it does. I have learned about saints and miracles as well as our divine rich history. I am trying to encourage my children to take the same path. I encourage them to ask their questions, provide solid sources, and take an active role in their faith building. At some point, children have to carry the mantle of faith for themselves. They should be given opportunities to do this before Confirmation. Children must buy-in so that it will stick. We need to evangelize starting in our own families. As a side note, I am public school educated K-12. One of my parents was never Catholic. My siblings do not practice now either.