Cutting people out

[TEPO]

…and you can’t cut me out either -I’m part of your CAF family.

(For the record, I’ve never put anyone on my ignore list)

 

[DeniseNY]

There are NO good reasons to avoid family. As the italians of the East would say: Family is Family, so feget-abot-it…

I just saw an episode of Dr Phil this morning, in which they discussed a grandfather sexually abusing his six year old granddaughter. I think that would qualify as a “good reason”.

 

[TEPO]

I just saw an episode of Dr Phil this morning, in which they discussed a grandfather sexually abusing his six year old granddaughter. I think that would qualify as a “good reason”.

Okay. You got me there.

In that case, the grandfather should be thrown out of the family entirely by everyone. He has sinned against his whole family and has shamed them by his ignorance. He should spend the rest of his life in solitude as penance IMHO.

…I suppose acts of physical violence might make all the difference here. I hadn’t thought of this before. But if it’s just feelings being hurt, then forgiveness should always be an option.

 

[kittyplant]

I disagree. There are some people who have people in their lives that are so poisonous that they have to keep seperate from them permanently, in order to protect themselves physically and mentally. These are rather extreme situation and are pretty rare, however, if you say “It’s NEVER okay”, they you’ve probably never been involved in such a situation. Sometimes it’s not only “okay”, it’s necessary.

i kept trying to write details last night but it kept not working. it’s my father’s wife. this is someone who i think wants to mean well yet has some fundamental dishonesty within herself. she had done terrible things in the past and never admitted or apologized but acts like everyone should brush it under the rug… so i did. but being around her is draining and i always have to brush off the casual dishonesties that regularly come out of her. she also claims to be psychic… i have mental illness but she will never admit to possibly having something and always emphasizes that there is something wrong with me… she talks down about other people including my family members and often assumes that other people are going to do conniving treacherous things. i do not need to be stressed out or listening to negativity now, i am pregnant. the thing is that my father is enmeshed with her and if i have a problem with her then he gets upset (without ever hearing me out). they are not married in thr church. this is also someone who has gripes against the church.

 

[TEPO]

@ Denise Slovaks don’t do that kind of stuff though.

 

[kittyplant]

If it was my father, I would go visit. If he offended me I would walk out immediately and try again next year. I’d do it forever. I would do it for any annoying or abusive family member, for as long as I lived.

this is what i have been doing for years and i am tired of it. from what i remember, they both seemed normal when they first met but over the years have made each other weak and twisted. maybe it’s the living in sin. i am so tired right now. they dont change.

 

[kittyplant]

Kitty,
If you talk to someone in person about this it would be better. A wise priest may also be able to give you hints on handling the stress, or help you figure out a good plan. But talking with people on the internet is not all that helpful because the conversation is too limited to be helpful.

thank you, thats true… i guess i brought it up here because i felt bothered.

 

[kittyplant]

ok, so Easter isnt the time to be cutting people off. But she really upset me the other day . How can I better pray for or help this situation? Need encouragement. Happy Easter.

 

[Anglewannabe]

Why not tell his brother that until he became clean too, that he could never see him again? Why cut family out permanently and forever ? That’s evil and cold -it’s of the devil.

Give an option at least…

If the brother made it clear by his behaviour he had no intention to change and saw nothing wrong with what he was doing, then it would be too risky to be around him. He would fall back into drugs.

In my case the person is so abusive any time he has tried to initiate contact with me it has always started with ‘You cutting me off for no reason is cruel but I will be the better person and forgive you. Let’s get back in contact’

I don’t fall for that kind of manipulation anymore. If this guy really did change his ways and proved after a few years he has repented and ask for forgiveness, I would weight the situation for what it was worth and if I could trust him, I might change my mind.

But as long as he sees nothing wrong with what he did and scoff when I tell him to treat me with respect, he is out of my life.

 

[EasterJoy]

What consequences did the prodigal son experience on his return?

He was the son with the place of a son in the family, but no remaining inheritance. His father did tell his older brother, “everything I have is yours.”

Also, note that the father did not go out looking for him while he was prodigal. He watched for his return and accepted him back in joy when he was repentant. He did not come back acting as if he had done nothing wrong and nothing had changed. The Lord did not tell the story that way.

Forgiveness is not the same thing as excusing bad behavior. That is not to say we ought never excuse misbehavior. I mean we should not come to believe that forgiving and excusing are the same thing.

Our Lord said that those who would not turn from seriously bad behavior after fraternal correction were to be treated “as you would a Gentile or a tax collector.” There is a time for “cutting people off” in terms of having the same contact as you would with a non-believer. You never have an excuse to be unkind or unjust, but there is a reason to cease to consider someone worthy of a position of trust.

 

[EasterJoy]

Let us look at the spiritual works of mercy:

To instruct the ignorant ;
To counsel the doubtful ;
To admonish sinners ;
To bear wrongs patiently;
To forgive offences willingly;
To comfort the afflicted;
To pray for the living and the dead.

The thing to do is to look at how your behavior will or will not help to save this other person’s soul. “Bearing wrongs” concerns those things that are not repented of, while “forgiving offenses” speaks to accepting repentance and allowing someone to access to regaining a position of trust.

You have heard that it was said, “An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.” But I say to you, offer no resistance to one who is evil. When someone strikes you on (your) right cheek, turn the other one to him as well. If anyone wants to go to law with you over your tunic, hand him your cloak as well. Should anyone press you into service for one mile, go with him for two miles. Give to the one who asks of you, and do not turn your back on one who wants to borrow.* Matt. 5:39-42

Notice that this person that Jesus is talking about is making a point of being loving by “going the extra mile” and choosing a third way that is neither giving in to intimidation nor returning hurt for hurt.

He also bid us not to toss our pearls before swine, lest the pearls be trampled and we be torn to pieces. Christianity is not masochistic. Allowing people to abuse us is probably more often giving them a near occasion of sin than it is an opportunity to turn from their evil. Before the Lord went through his Passion, he sometimes walked through the midst of those who wanted to tear him up, and walked away. It depends on the situation.

It is very much OK to cut people off from situations where they sin, even if the sin is against you. If your sister cannot be around you without sinning against you, of course it is OK to deny her opportunities to do that. It is also good to bear patiently with the deep-seated faults of others when it is necessary, just because we know we are forgiven our deep-seated faults, too.

The idea is to consider the situation and draw boundaries for everyone’s welfare. That can include keeping distance from those who have entrenched habits of abuse when we do no more for them than to provoke them to fall to their faults.

If you do avoid them, do not forget to pray that they will be forgiven their wrongs and shown mercy, that they will be given the joy of repentance and amendment.

 

[holyrood]

So many great responses here, I find myself wanting to quote them all, which would ultimately defeat the point of quoting!

So I’ll stick to saying, although there was never any formal announcement, I do stay clear of my family. Just the other day again, I read a comment or quote about ‘making peace with people.’ These kinds of things have always left me feeling as if I’m somehow guilty, but at the time I made the decision to back away from family, I understood that I had been doing everything in my power to ‘make peace’ for years. I’d been turning the other cheek. I’d been quick to forgive. I’d held my tongue. But I slowly came to see the damage it was doing to me, and to see that maybe we as a family appeared to be ‘at peace.’ But *my *peace was being eaten away and destroyed. I was sinking deeper into a place of self-loathing and hatred.

I look at it this way. I’ve been accused of ‘burning bridges.’ But I would now say, I’m guilty of burning bridges only the sense that I finally got tired of running for water and buckets and hoses to douse the fires on my end, while they continually piled kindling and poured on gasoline and lit matches on theirs. Yes, I finally let the bridge burn.

 

[kittyplant]

Let us look at the spiritual works of mercy:

To instruct the ignorant ;
To counsel the doubtful ;
To admonish sinners ;
To bear wrongs patiently;
To forgive offences willingly;
To comfort the afflicted;
To pray for the living and the dead.

The thing to do is to look at how your behavior will or will not help to save this other person’s soul. “Bearing wrongs” concerns those things that are not repented of, while “forgiving offenses” speaks to accepting repentance and allowing someone to access to regaining a position of trust.

You have heard that it was said, “An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.” But I say to you, offer no resistance to one who is evil. When someone strikes you on (your) right cheek, turn the other one to him as well. If anyone wants to go to law with you over your tunic, hand him your cloak as well. Should anyone press you into service for one mile, go with him for two miles. Give to the one who asks of you, and do not turn your back on one who wants to borrow.* Matt. 5:39-42

Notice that this person that Jesus is talking about is making a point of being loving by “going the extra mile” and choosing a third way that is neither giving in to intimidation nor returning hurt for hurt.

He also bid us not to toss our pearls before swine, lest the pearls be trampled and we be torn to pieces. Christianity is not masochistic. Allowing people to abuse us is probably more often giving them a near occasion of sin than it is an opportunity to turn from their evil. Before the Lord went through his Passion, he sometimes walked through the midst of those who wanted to tear him up, and walked away. It depends on the situation.

It is very much OK to cut people off from situations where they sin, even if the sin is against you. If your sister cannot be around you without sinning against you, of course it is OK to deny her opportunities to do that. It is also good to bear patiently with the deep-seated faults of others when it is necessary, just because we know we are forgiven our deep-seated faults, too.

The idea is to consider the situation and draw boundaries for everyone’s welfare. That can include keeping distance from those who have entrenched habits of abuse when we do no more for them than to provoke them to fall to their faults.

If you do avoid them, do not forget to pray that they will be forgiven their wrongs and shown mercy, that they will be given the joy of repentance and amendment.

i think the spiritual works of mercy are the right answer. i want space too though

 

[Allegra]

i think the spiritual works of mercy are the right answer. i want space too though

I think I would start with setting boundaries in your situation. Try that first, before cutting your father out completely. Also, I agree with the other poster that you should not do anything too rash while you are pregnant.

 

[Contra_Mundum_1]

The worst thing about cutting family members out too often people take the aggressor’s point of view and ignore the abusive the victim has suffered

This has been my experience as well. The OP must be prepared to be blamed by well meaning people who think that one must never cut out family, no matter what. As Angel said, if cutting people out is necessary, then do it. But there are consequences.

 

[TEPO]

People who cut family members out are typically arrogant people who never lend a helping hand to anyone but themselves. They’re selfish and greedy, overprotective and sensitive. They have a lack of love and understanding and do not act like Jesus.

Jesus is mercy, forgiveness and selflessness. Until we can be all these things we cannot understand why cutting family out is wrong.

…it’s the same people who would cut God out of their lives if their lot in life was reduced to something less than desireable. Like a spoiled child does.

 

[holyrood]

People who cut family members out are typically arrogant people who never lend a helping hand to anyone but themselves. They’re selfish and greedy, overprotective and sensitive. They have a lack of love and understanding and do not act like Jesus.

Jesus is mercy, forgiveness and selflessness. Until we can be all these things we cannot understand why cutting family out is wrong.

…it’s the same people who would cut God out of their lives if their lot in life was reduced to something less than desireable. Like a spoiled child does.

Moreover, they’re people who make sweeping generalizations about entire categories without ever bothering to learn details. Because darn it, they just KNOW!

 

[holyrood]

Jesus is mercy, forgiveness and selflessness. Until we can be all these things we cannot understand why cutting family out is wrong.

But if people continue with behavior offensive to Jesus, with no remorse, no intention of changing, no desire to stop what hurts Him…they will not be in Paradise with Him, eventually. He doesn’t just open the gates wide and tell everyone to come on in. There ARE some minimum standards of behavior.

 

[TEPO]

Moreover, they’re people who make sweeping generalizations about entire categories without ever bothering to learn details. Because darn it, they just KNOW!

The only details unlearned here are the selfish ideals of those who posess a lack of respect for others -which is obvious by an unwillingness to express these feelings since the posters know they will prove selfish. Selfish!

 

[TEPO]

But if people continue with behavior offensive to Jesus, with no remorse, no intention of changing, no desire to stop what hurts Him…they will not be in Paradise with Him, eventually. He doesn’t just open the gates wide and tell everyone to come on in. There ARE some minimum standards of behavior.

Jesus does not condemn us until death. What gives us the right to justify our hatred?

…pick up your cross and carry it!