DADT blocked at congress

[Charlotte408]

news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_gays_military

WASHINGTON – Senate Republicans on Tuesday blocked legislation that would have repealed the law banning gays from serving openly in the military.
The partisan vote was a defeat for Senate Democrats and gay rights advocates, who saw the bill as their last chance before November’s elections to overturn the law known as “don’t ask, don’t tell.”
With the 56-43 vote, Democrats fell short of the 60 votes needed to advance the legislation. It also would have authorized $726 billion in defense spending including a pay raise for troops.

 

[Charlotte408]

Socarides said President Barack Obama “badly miscalculated” the Pentagon’s support for repeal, while Democrats made only a “token effort” to advance the bill.
“If it was a priority for the Democratic leadership, they would get a clean vote on this,” he said.
Democratic Sens. Blanche Lincoln and Mark Pryor of Arkansas sided with Republicans to block the bill. Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., also voted against the measure as a procedural tactic. Under Senate rules, casting his vote with the majority of the Senate enables him to revive the bill at a later date if he wants.

I feel like my Raiders just scored a touchdown…

 

[Charlotte1776]

From what I have heard, most military people do NOT want gays serving alongside them. Overturning this would have been a serious blow to morale and cause so many problems in the name of “tolerance” and “diversity.” Not everyone is allowed to join the military. Some are too short, some have physical disabilities, women aren’t allowed to do certain things…gays aren’t the only ones “descriminated against” but they’re the only ones complaining…

 

[Charlotte408]

From what I have heard, most military people do NOT want gays serving openly alongside them. Overturning this would have been a serious blow to morale and cause so many problems in the name of “tolerance” and “diversity.” Not everyone is allowed to join the military. Some are too short, some have physical disabilities, women aren’t allowed to do certain things…gays aren’t the only ones “descriminated against” but they’re the only ones complaining…

AMEN Charlotte and didn’t mean to interject my wording but I know that’s what you meant

 

[Charlotte1776]

AMEN Charlotte and didn’t mean to interject my wording but I know that’s what you meant

The word you added was important! There are gays in the military now, but they keep it quiet and don’t throw it around in everyone’s faces to make them uncomfortable. That’s an important distinction.

 

[EmperorNapoleon]

From what I have heard, most military people do NOT want gays serving alongside them.

They already are. Today’s vote was a minor setback. We’ll be back and DADT WILL be repealed. Count on it.

Overturning this would have been a serious blow to morale and cause so many problems in the name of “tolerance” and “diversity.”

Tell my why it is that the United States is the only nation in the Western world that seems to believe that the military would experience a morale appocolypse if gays served openly. Gays serve openly in Australia, Austria, Belgium, Canada, Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Finland, France, Germany, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, Slovenia, South Africa, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, United Kingdom, Uruguay and they don’t have morale issues.

 

[bbarrick8383]

Was listening to Tom Sullivan not long ago, one person brough up an insteresting point. There are certain places that our military goes that a homosexual could not openly express his sexual preference in public without facing harsh penalties.

Then a former Army Ranger called in and said exactly what I and many others I served with said. I don’t want to know whose gay for the same reason I can not shower with women.

 

[Charlotte1776]

Tell my why it is that the United States is the only nation in the Western world that seems to believe that the military would experience a morale appocolypse if gays served openly. Gays serve openly in Australia, Austria, Belgium, Canada, Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Finland, France, Germany, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, Slovenia, South Africa, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, United Kingdom, Uruguay and they don’t have morale issues.

Those countries are not as religious or as conservative as the Unites States is, and the military typically leans even more right than the general population. If these other countries do not have an issue with gays serving openly in their military it is because their populations do not care about the issue. Ours does, though.

The world is not heading on an unstoppable, one-way track towards a liberal utopia where gays can marry and adopt kids, women can abort any child at any time during pregnancy, and religion has been banned from every corner of society. The downward slide can be reversed and I pray it will.

 

[Charlotte408]

Today’s vote was a minor setback. We’ll be back and DADT WILL be repealed. Count on it…

youtube.com/watch?v=igXWtUMmTOw

 

[TMC]

They already are. Today’s vote was a minor setback. We’ll be back and DADT WILL be repealed. Count on it.

Tell my why it is that the United States is the only nation in the Western world that seems to believe that the military would experience a morale appocolypse if gays served openly. Gays serve openly in Australia, Austria, Belgium, Canada, Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Finland, France, Germany, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, Slovenia, South Africa, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, United Kingdom, Uruguay and they don’t have morale issues.

They have the votes, sounds like Reid fumbled it by overreaching and trying to add in other measures that the moderate Republicans couldn’t support. If the Dems really want to get this done in this Congress they can do it - but a lot of Dems have been long on talk and short on action when it comes to gay issues. This is one with pretty overwhelming public support, so you would think they would put it through before the election. We’ll see.

 

[cyberwolf001]

So once again are homosexual citizens are reminded they are just second class Americans at best.

 

[Luigi_Daniele]

So once again are homosexual citizens are reminded they are just second class Americans at best.

That’s a stretch.

I never have understood this. Why does one’s sexuality have to be public? Why can’t they just serve?

 

[bbarrick8383]

So once again are homosexual citizens are reminded they are just second class Americans at best.

The military should not have any outside influence from its citizens on the way it is structured or behaves. It is designed to do something and do it well, if the leaders of the military say that DADT should not be repealed then the American people should shut up and leave the military alone.

 

[Wowbagger]

I’ve read a lot about DADT, and talked to quite a few (very conservative) servicemen, and I really don’t think it’s a just or wise policy. There is good evidence that DADT damages unit cohesion compared to open service, and it drives out and drives away some fantastically skilled servicemen. Military support for its repeal is widespread and growing, and – perhaps more interestingly – the plurality of soldiers don’t care one way or another.

Yes, homosexuality is immoral, but, unless we’re also going to prosecute fornication and masturbation in the military too, this policy is simply – I can’t believe I’m writing these words – homophobic discrimination.

I’m disappointed that the GOP does not yet agree. It would be nice for ONE good thing to come out of this Democratic Congress.

Alright, fellow Catholics. Fire away. I don’t expect to escape criticism for saying it.

 

[Rich_Olszewski]

The military should not have any outside influence from its citizens on the way it is structured or behaves. It is designed to do something and do it well, if the leaders of the military say that DADT should not be repealed then the American people should shut up and leave the military alone.

Not all the military leaders say that it should not be repealed. They may change their minds eventually. I agree with you 100% about the American people shutting up and leaving the military alone in this matter, whether it keeps DADT or changes it.

What bugs me tremendously is the utter nerve of those Americans who never wore a uniform, never carried a gun in defense of their country, never put their lives on line for our nation, never served our country in the Armed Forces, telling the Armed Forces that they shouldn’t overturn DADT. I personally am not at all interested in the opinions of civilians who never wore dogtags, not even in the Reserves, regarding DADT.

 

[cyberwolf001]

That’s a stretch.

I never have understood this. Why does one’s sexuality have to be public? Why can’t they just serve?

But why should they have to hide it? If say you ask a gay soldier what he did over the weekend or ask why they never seems to have a girlfriend should the soldier have to lie?

An for that matter why must a member of our military have to NOT practice their rights to freedom of speech and assembly? I’ve had a few homosexual friends kicked out under DADT for shopping in a gay bookstore and attending gay rights rallies.

They are being shot at for our freedoms and yet your telling me they cannot practice them out of uniform on leave!?

Just imagine if the same happened to a member of the military on leave that had gone to an Irish bar and a comic book shop.

The military should not have any outside influence from its citizens on the way it is structured or behaves. It is designed to do something and do it well, if the leaders of the military say that DADT should not be repealed then the American people should shut up and leave the military alone.

I believe this was the argument about integrating blacks and other minorities into the service.

I speak as one that is getting in shape to enlist btw.

 

[Charlotte408]

What bugs me tremendously is the utter nerve of those Americans who never wore a uniform, never carried a gun in defense of their country, never put their lives on line for our nation, never served our country in the Armed Forces, telling the Armed Forces that they shouldn’t overturn DADT. I personally am not at all interested in the opinions of civilians who never wore dogtags, not even in the Reserves, regarding DADT.

Because none of the people who believe DADT should be repealed couldn’t have possibly been in the military…or have any loved ones in the family…or friends…

 

[He_Man]

Was listening to Tom Sullivan not long ago, one person brough up an insteresting point. There are certain places that our military goes that a homosexual could not openly express his sexual preference in public without facing harsh penalties.

Then a former Army Ranger called in and said exactly what I and many others I served with said. I don’t want to know whose gay for the same reason I can not shower with women.

That has long been a question of mine. Why, if men who have an attraction towards members of the male gender are allowed to serve, room, sleep, and shower with other men, are not women, who also have an attraction towards males, allowed to do the same thing.

What is the argument against unisex showers, and bunking shared between men and women?

 

[He_Man]

Not all the military leaders say that it should not be repealed. They may change their minds eventually. I agree with you 100% about the American people shutting up and leaving the military alone in this matter, whether it keeps DADT or changes it.

What bugs me tremendously is the utter nerve of those Americans who never wore a uniform, never carried a gun in defense of their country, never put their lives on line for our nation, never served our country in the Armed Forces, telling the Armed Forces that they shouldn’t overturn DADT. I personally am not at all interested in the opinions of civilians who never wore dogtags, not even in the Reserves, regarding DADT.

I agree. For some reason, people seemed to have an unreasonable interest in managing the affairs of the military, esp. when never having served or experienced military life themselves.

Other institutions don’t seem to have nearly the uneducated invasive opinions, for whatever reasons.

 

[Rich_Olszewski]

Because none of the people who believe DADT should be repealed couldn’t have possibly been in the military…or have any loved ones in the family…or friends…

Stan Kolbe is an Army Retiree, and I have had 16 years in the Air Force. We both strongly favor overturning DADT. A number of other veterans on the Forum agree with us. Yes, there are people like NotSoCrazy Dan who is a veteran and who is against repeal. I may disagree with him, but he has the bona fides to complain as far as I’m concerned.

I know many veterans personally, and the vast majority say - if the gay or lesbian can do the job, serving patriotically and honorably, they should be allow to do so.

I’m heterosexual - do you think I checked out the bosom, backside, and legs of every woman I knew in the Air Force??? Not at all. I did my job, they did theirs. So, why then presume that a lesbian would do that or that a gay would do that to his fellow servicemen??