Dating and marrying noncatholics

[jmcrae]

I believe that people get to know each other while on a date. Isn’t that the point?

Not precisely. The point of dating is to see whether you should take it to the next step and become engaged to be married.

But if you don’t know the person well enough to know whether you are even interested in pursuing that next step, then you need to do the step that comes before dating, which is to become friends who know each other well enough to take the step of seeing whether they are compatible for marriage (which is what dating is).

 

[reed987]

heres my predicament:

On one hand I know some great, intelligent, nice, attractive young ladies who I feel I got chemistry with but happen to be noncatholic

On the other hand I know some ladies who I really got nothing in common with and no chemistry with but they happen to be catholic.

I wonder, am I throwing the baby out with the bath water if I automatically weed out anyone who isn’t catholic?

 

[masuwerte]

I wonder, am I throwing the baby out with the bath water if I automatically weed out anyone who isn’t catholic?

I would say yes.

 

[Kit15]

You’ve missed the point.

Religion is not something that can be compromised on. The Catholic teaching is either true or it isn’t. The other denomination’s teaching is either true or it isn’t. It cannot be both at the same time. It can’t be compromised.

What color you paint the bedroom, which job you take, what city you live in… certainly these things can be compromised on because there is no issue of objective truth in these things.

I didn’t say it was a bad thing. I said it was a compromise.

I think in turn you have missed mine.

I’m not talking about whether Catholicism is true or not and whether it can be compromised. Of course it’s not.

I’m talking about whether or not a non-Catholic spouse can willingly participate (as much as they are able) in certain Catholic practices and whether this is a positive thing.

You said:

It is very unwise to seek out a partner with whom you will not share the most fundamental and important aspect of who you are. It will inevitably cause friction, compromise, and can lead to the breakdown of a marriage. There are many people on this board and elsewhere who will tell you that it can “work,” but at what price? One party will always have to “give.”

Then when someone talked about a marriage where the unbeliever fully and willingly supported the believer as much as she was able, you replied:

Yes, it is inevitable.

Your mother compromised.

She let your dad raise you Catholic, she went to Mass, and she “went along with” Church teaching on contraception. Those are all compromises.

:without clarifying whether or not this was a positive.

Can you honestly blame me for thinking that you considered “compromise” in a marriage to be a negative given your first statement (hence the “What marriage doesn’t have compromise” sentiment)? THAT is what I took issue with. Giving into Catholic practices begrudgingly isn’t good. I’ll agree with you on that. But in the case of someone giving in willingly? This doesn’t necessarily lead to the breakdown of a marriage…

 

[sixofseven]

heres my predicament:

On one hand I know some great, intelligent, nice, attractive young ladies who I feel I got chemistry with but happen to be noncatholic

On the other hand I know some ladies who I really got nothing in common with and no chemistry with but they happen to be catholic.

I wonder, am I throwing the baby out with the bath water if I automatically weed out anyone who isn’t catholic?

In my case, knowing my now future husband wasn’t Catholic was something that I was concerned about and secondly I really wasn’t attracted to him when we met! I liked him, he is a nice guy but for goodness sake leave me alone!! So on my part we didn’t really start out well. But he is funny, intelligent, he persisted with me and broke down a lot of the barriers I had put up becasue of a previous relationship, he cares about what I think, he supports and encourages my Catholicism and even challenges it - I have learnt so much more about my faith because of him. The difference with H2B is that I fell in love with the person on the inside and to me he is the most beautiful thing, and even though it might have been easier to marry a Catholic - I don’t want to live without him.

I guess my advice is a) don’t count on attraction to help pick a partner, and b) no, don’t throw the baby out with the bath water. You just don’t know what God has in mind for you.
You can choose whether to only look for a potential partner within the Catholic community, or you can choose to be open to let God pick someone for you. Who knows what could come of it? You might just bring them home!

Also, make sure you acknowledge their feelings about dating you - they might feel uncomfortable about dating a Catholic so it is tough road but if you include God it’s a little less rocky.

And last of all, I would say goodbye to any girl who wants you to choose them over your faith. That is not a good sign and only predicts what kind of marriage you would have.

I hope that helps…

 

[McCabe76]

I find this a really interesting topic because I was a non-Catholic whan I married my Catholic husband, and it’s always interesting to hear about what other Catholics think about that!

My husband had fallen away from the Church before he met me, and so when we married we had a civil ceremony. I had agreed to raise our children as Catholic, as I wasn’t raised in any religion, so I felt it made no difference to me. As time went on, I started going to Church with my husband, and eventually became a Catholic myself shortly after our first child was born, at which time we were also married in the Church. Now, I’m the driving Catholic force in our family. I’m the one making sure we get to Mass on time, with the money in the envelope, making sure my children pray everyday, volunteering at Church, etc.

I would love for my husband to take the leadership role in our family when it comes to this, because I think that both parents have to set the example when raising their children in any religion. If you’re a non-Catholic, you shouldn’t agree to raise your children that way if you’re not going to support it 100%. As the Catholic in the relationship, it would be your job to make sure your partner understands the importance of this.

When I hear “Catholics should ONLY date/marry other Catholics!” It still annoys me, but I also understand how it can become a serious issue in a marriage IF IT’S NOT DEALT WITH BEFORE THE MARRIAGE. If you are setting the example of being a good Catholic, and your partner understands and respects your faith and loves you then of course it can work.

 

[McCabe76]

I just don’t understand how one can seriously date (with the intent of contemplating marriage) one who is so diametrically opposed to my core (and uncomprimisable) beliefes, such as;

• The real presence of Christ in the Blessed Sacrament
• The infallible Doctrines of Mother Church such as
• Ordination of Men only
• Immaculate Conception
• Mary’s Assumption into HeavenThe evil of abortion
• Christian Denominations that condone abortion
• Homosexualiy (active, not “tendancies”)
• Christian Denominations that condone active homosexuality
• Contraception
• Christian Denominations that condone contraception

This is not a complete list of concerns…

I understand your point, but also know that there are “Catholics” who support same-sex marriage and abortion, and who view The Eucharist as a symbol of Christ and not His real presence. These are, sadly, no longer Catholic/non-Catholic issues!

 

[rciadan]

I understand your point, but also know that there are “Catholics” who support same-sex marriage and abortion, and who view The Eucharist as a symbol of Christ and not His real presence. These are, sadly, no longer Catholic/non-Catholic issues!

These are Cinos, (Catholics in name only) I do not consider them to be Catholic any more than Paul considered Jews who did not follow Jesus to be real Jews. Bottom line is, if they don’t think Catholic, I would not marry or date. This does not mean I would not be friends and perhaps attempt to help them to understand my faith it they showed interest.

 

[1ke]

I understand your point, but also know that there are “Catholics” who support same-sex marriage and abortion, and who view The Eucharist as a symbol of Christ and not His real presence. These are, sadly, no longer Catholic/non-Catholic issues!

No one has advocated dating/marrying someone simply because they were baptized Catholic. A practicing Catholic should not marry a non-practicing, lukewarm, or dissenting Catholic either.

The topic at hand is marrying a non-Catholic.

 

[1ke]

I find this a really interesting topic because I was a non-Catholic whan I married my Catholic husband, and it’s always interesting to hear about what other Catholics think about that!

My husband had fallen away from the Church before he met me, and so when we married we had a civil ceremony. I had agreed to raise our children as Catholic, as I wasn’t raised in any religion, so I felt it made no difference to me. As time went on, I started going to Church with my husband, and eventually became a Catholic myself shortly after our first child was born, at which time we were also married in the Church. Now, I’m the driving Catholic force in our family. I’m the one making sure we get to Mass on time, with the money in the envelope, making sure my children pray everyday, volunteering at Church, etc.

I would love for my husband to take the leadership role in our family when it comes to this, because I think that both parents have to set the example when raising their children in any religion. If you’re a non-Catholic, you shouldn’t agree to raise your children that way if you’re not going to support it 100%. As the Catholic in the relationship, it would be your job to make sure your partner understands the importance of this.

When I hear “Catholics should ONLY date/marry other Catholics!” It still annoys me, but I also understand how it can become a serious issue in a marriage IF IT’S NOT DEALT WITH BEFORE THE MARRIAGE. If you are setting the example of being a good Catholic, and your partner understands and respects your faith and loves you then of course it can work.

I am very glad your marriage has worked out successfully. You married a non-practicing Catholic, you were not any particular religion, and you are now a Catholic.

When you see advice to people who come on here about not marrying a non-Catholic, they are usually in a different situation from the one you describe of your own experience. They are typically *practicing *Catholics who have a strong practice of their faith. Often times they are dating a non-Catholic who faithfully practices their *own *religion and have no intention/desire to convert. In some cases they are actively anti-Catholic or want to raise the children in the other religion (or worse, as “both”… an oxymoron).

Certainly there are success stories where the spouse becomes Catholic-- as you did-- or they remain non-Catholic but actively participate in the Church, help in the raising of the children as Catholics, and/or in no way undermine the Catholic faith.

*One cannot go into a marriage **hoping *for one of these things to happen. It’s just unwise. That’s why we advise against it.

If someone who was away from the Church returns to it and has married a non-Catholic, of course they are going to have to find a way to sustain their marriage and their faith. It can be very difficult. I am glad that yours is a success story.

 

[caelie]

i put a question to all catholics and non catholics.

I have known my fiance for 4 years and engaged a year. We are now discssing wedding planns.

My fiance is from a large practising catholic family, he had been baptised confirmed and went to catholic school. however he has not been to church since he left school, besides important days ie advent, lent, weddings occassionally. However his family all go without fail.

I was baptised in a Church of ENGLAND Church however did not attend church every Sunday due to school/sporting commitments. I now have recently been attending A High Church and go to mass at least once a week, i have not been confirmed yet so i just go up for a blessing at eucharist.

I have attended mass at a catholic church before and It is exactly the same as mass in my church. However i have recently learnt that if i was to get married in a catholic church my family cannot recieve communion even though they have been confirmed. however in the high church which is anglo-catholic all christians are welcome.

Can some one tell me why christians are not welcome in the house of god in a catholic church, unless they are catholic.

which made me think i will have to have a first holy communion in a catholic church even though i am 20 years old and all the other peple will be 7/8. just to be able to recieve communion on my wedding day in a catholic church. as apparently it is a sin to recieve communion if you have not had a first holy communion. however in the church of england this does not excist has we just get confirmed. Which is why i have not been confirmed yet as i am cautious i may be doing something wrong.

however why should i convert to catholicism just because my fiancess family are practising catholic, when he doesnt even go to mass regularly himself.

I dont see many differences between my beliefs and theirs besides the fact my family are not welcome to recieve communion in his church, which offended them.

what should one do?

 

[Thomas63116]

i put a question to all catholics and non catholics.

I have known my fiance for 4 years and engaged a year. We are now discssing wedding planns.

My fiance is from a large practising catholic family, he had been baptised confirmed and went to catholic school. however he has not been to church since he left school, besides important days ie advent, lent, weddings occassionally. However his family all go without fail.

I was baptised in a Church of ENGLAND Church however did not attend church every Sunday due to school/sporting commitments. I now have recently been attending A High Church and go to mass at least once a week, i have not been confirmed yet so i just go up for a blessing at eucharist.

I have attended mass at a catholic church before and It is exactly the same as mass in my church. However i have recently learnt that if i was to get married in a catholic church my family cannot recieve communion even though they have been confirmed. however in the high church which is anglo-catholic all christians are welcome.

Can some one tell me why christians are not welcome in the house of god in a catholic church, unless they are catholic.

which made me think i will have to have a first holy communion in a catholic church even though i am 20 years old and all the other peple will be 7/8. just to be able to recieve communion on my wedding day in a catholic church. as apparently it is a sin to recieve communion if you have not had a first holy communion. however in the church of england this does not excist has we just get confirmed. Which is why i have not been confirmed yet as i am cautious i may be doing something wrong.

however why should i convert to catholicism just because my fiancess family are practising catholic, when he doesnt even go to mass regularly himself.

I dont see many differences between my beliefs and theirs besides the fact my family are not welcome to recieve communion in his church, which offended them.

what should one do?

Hi Caeli, welcome to the forums.

Non-Catholics certainly are welcome in a Catholic church. However, they are not invited to take part in communion. The Catholic Church sees Communion as not only a sharing in the Body and Blood of Christ among Christians, but also as a sign of the full unity within the Church. Unfortunately, we do not share this full unity with the Church of England or other non-Catholic denominations, for a variety of complex historical and theological reasons.

Your post suggests a number of misunderstandings about the reasons for the Church’s practice in this regard. For example, the issue of whether or not you (or your family) would be able to receive the Eucharist if you married in the Catholic Church is not really about whether or not you have made a first holy communion. The issue is whether or not you are a member of the Catholic Church.

I cannot speak to the practice in your particular parish or disocese, but here in the United States an adult being received into full communion with the Catholic Church would typically make a profession of faith, be confirmed, and receive communion with a group of other adults who have also undertaken a course of study to join the catholic Church. This is referred to as RCIA (Rite of Christian Initiation for Adults). It would be very unusual to have an adult receive their first communion with 7 or 8 year olds.

We would certainly love for you to decide to join the Catholic Church. However, you should not do so just becaise your fiances family are Catholic. You should do so only if after thoughtful, prayerful consideration of the Church and its teachings you have determined that this is what God is calling you to do. The RCIA process is intended to help people with this discernment.

In the meantime, another option to consider would be having a Catholic wedding ceremony without a Mass. This avoids the issue of people feeling left out by not sharing in communion, and at least in the United States it is the most common type of ceremony when a Catholic and non-Catholic marry. You and your fiance should meet with the pastor of his church to discuss this and other options for your wedding ceremony.

 

[BiologyBrain]

Even with proper pre-Cana & discussion prior to the wedding, what happens afterwards can be drastically different from what you thought - whether you’re a Catholic married to another Catholic or non-Catholic. As others have said, its just as possible for a Catholic (cino) to cause just as many marital conflicts as a non-Catholic (perhaps even more) when it comes down to the bare bones of it. However, theoretically, a non-Catholic is assumed to disagree w/ some aspects of the Church. Be cautious!

I married a non-Catholic/non-baptized man. At the time of our wedding, he was attending RCIA and going to Mass with me every Sunday/Saturday. After the wedding, he quit RCIA & soon quit attending Mass. The non-Catholic that I married was showing signs of agreement w/ the Church & his intention to become a member. That he didn’t actually become a member of the Church disappointed me. However, that was not a condition of our marriage. Since he’s basically agnostic (he can’t decide if he believes or not), he doesn’t present all that much of a conflict to my faith. He knew 1st thing when we began dating that my faith was very important to me (probably why he attended Mass with me weekly from the very beginning). I was very up-front w/ him about the restrictions that my faith could put on our relationship (no birth control, no pre-marital sex, no shacking-up, etc) as well as the benefits of knowing exactly where I stook on the issues at hand. There are times that I resent him b/c he lead me to believe that he was converting and would be a full member of my faith as well as a full/equal partner in the moral up-bringing of our child(ren). There are other times that I have to remind myself that I married a non-Catholic knowing what the pitfalls were. He is a good man and he supports most of my decisions within the faith. The things he questions generally cause me to research and become stronger in my beliefs with the intent (and usually the outcome) of persuading him. In a way I have become a stronger Catholic b/c I’m trying to lead by example. He has become a better man (I think) b/c of my example and persistence. Will he convert? Maybe… Maybe not. At this point, I don’t think it really matters as long as I remain strong and faithful to my Catholicism.

My family has a strong history of converting husbands. My dad converted on his wedding day (received Communion for the 1st time). My grandfather on my mom’s side converted shortly after the wedding. My uncle converted just prior to the wedding. However, the faith of those concerned (both the converts & their spouses) are not equal. There is going to be (most likely) a disparity in strength of faith (unless you’re really picky). Many times, like w/ my mom & dad, eventually both parties reach the same strength of faith. However, sometimes both parties back-slide or become lazy.

**The reality of marriage is that nothing is certain & everything changes. Its best to be up-front, honest, open, faithful, and honorable in your dealings w/ the other sex prior to marriage & to continue after the wedding. Pray always and try to remain utterly faithful to the one that never leaves you - God. **

Good luck!

 

[caelie]

Hi thanks for you reply guys. I didnt realise its slightly different in england to usa.

basically in the reign of Henry VIII, the pope would not allow him to divorce his wife catherine of aragon. because of the rules of the church. So he decided to set up his own church the church of england.

There are many speculations as to whether this is protestant or catholic. I wouldnt say it was protestant as they are a bit more lenient than my church. Plus also in the order or service there is one part where we say
‘i bleieve in one holy catholic and apostilistic faith’

The high church of england is and anglo-catholic church. not roman catholic as the conection with rome was broken in 1539.

Mass is exactly the same, however the differences i have learnt so far are:

• In our church we are celebrating st peter and st pauls day on sunday, however dont have as much to do with studying the other saints as catholics do.

*Catholics have thir first holy communion generally at age 7-8 or after. im not sure about an adult who has not had holy communion and later wishes to recieve it?
*Then at age 16 they get confirmed

*In the church of england we only have one confirmation from age 11+

*We believe jesus is present during eucharist(isnt he always present in church)-im not sure whether he has transubsided into the bread and wine at the time as i havent learnt about that yet as i havent been confirmed or going to church long enough to give an educated answer.

*any one from any church who is chistian and had been confirmed can reiceve communion

*we dont have a confession box in church (not sure why as im still learning)

*there is a very big enphysis on the holy trinity

*Divorse - Although the church does not believe in divorce. They will accept an aditional reason for divorce which is if the couple have irreconsilable differences which could harm one another or child then they can get divorced. i.e - if the couple really dont get on as a married couple and they would get on better and raise the children better if they were divorced then thats ok.

 

[caelie]

i think im going to try to learn a bit more about the faiths before i decide. however i dont thik i should covert if my fiance himself hasnt been to church since he left school, unless its what i want to do. as both churches will expect me to raise my children the same faith.
And he wants them to be able to decide for them selves. As he felt as a child he had religion shoved down his throat, where as i didnt. And i have now decided that faith is very important to me and i would like to practise it seriously and be able to make educated choices.

I have thought about a wedding in one church and thn a blessing afterwards by the other preist. Or a beach wedding and then a blessing in the church.

i know a civil ceremony would solve conflicting families hoever i feels thats for people who dont believe or cant be bothered.

*can you go to bible classes at a church and then decide you dont/do agree, or are you in agreement that you must be that religion once you start learning.

*can i go to either anglican or catholic mass or is this not allowed. as i tend to go to church whenever i am not rotered into work that morning, and enjoy both catholic and anglican mass as they are the same, and i havent been confirmed so its not like i take communion i just go for a blessing by the preist. Or will it be frowned upon if i sometimes go to one church and other times go to another. As i work 8am-4.30pm or 12.30 - 9pm monday to sunday so which ever day i am not working i attend mass, but the church masses are at different times.

 

[jmcrae]

In the Catholic Church, you can join the RCIA, and in the Anglican Church, you can join Alpha.

Both of these are very good introductions to their respective faiths, and neither of them require that you have to become a member that religion at the end of it. (In fact, there are a lot of Catholics who join Alpha without ever intending to become Anglican, and they even have Alpha programs at their Catholic churches, which must be very confusing to the Anglicans.)

As a Catholic, I would say, the best thing is to learn as much as you can about it, and really, don’t join up until you are ready to sincerely practice and live the lifestyle of a Catholic.

 

[CHCatholic]

I’m sweet on this girl I work with…but I work in a restaurant, where in two years, I’m the only Catholic I know. So its tough. Usually I just let these girls pass by, knowing that not being Catholic, they’re going to have a hell of a time seeing where I’m coming from. But most girls I know from Church/school are not my type at allllllll, so I’m kind of considering going after this girl at work. I don’t really know a ton about her, but I know she’s one of those party girl types, just like 99% of teenagers these days. Which is too bad, but I pray God will lead me…and if I can show her the beauty of the Faith, then maybe, just maybe, I can show her. Of course I don’t go out specifically looking for a damsel in (spiritual) distress…but should I go for it? Or should I back off immediately.

 

[jmcrae]

I’m sweet on this girl I work with…but I work in a restaurant, where in two years, I’m the only Catholic I know. So its tough. Usually I just let these girls pass by, knowing that not being Catholic, they’re going to have a hell of a time seeing where I’m coming from. But most girls I know from Church/school are not my type at allllllll, so I’m kind of considering going after this girl at work. I don’t really know a ton about her, but I know she’s one of those party girl types, just like 99% of teenagers these days. Which is too bad, but I pray God will lead me…and if I can show her the beauty of the Faith, then maybe, just maybe, I can show her. Of course I don’t go out specifically looking for a damsel in (spiritual) distress…but should I go for it? Or should I back off immediately.

Either evangelize her, or date her, but don’t attempt both. We don’t go into relationships to “fix” people; we go into relationships in order to love them just as they are.

 

[BiologyBrain]

I’m sweet on this girl I work with…but I work in a restaurant, where in two years, I’m the only Catholic I know. So its tough. Usually I just let these girls pass by, knowing that not being Catholic, they’re going to have a hell of a time seeing where I’m coming from. But most girls I know from Church/school are not my type at allllllll, so I’m kind of considering going after this girl at work. I don’t really know a ton about her, but I know she’s one of those party girl types, just like 99% of teenagers these days. Which is too bad, but I pray God will lead me…and if I can show her the beauty of the Faith, then maybe, just maybe, I can show her. Of course I don’t go out specifically looking for a damsel in (spiritual) distress…but should I go for it? Or should I back off immediately.

I personally would step back a bit. I would be friends with her initially to get to know more about her, but without the intention of either evangelizing her or dating her. I’d kind of take a ‘wait and see’ approach. If she’s a party girl & you dislike that, you really don’t need to try to change her & date her. If you were a party guy looking for a party girl it would be one thing. However, that doesn’t preclude you from being friends with her. Don’t get in a hurry to find your ‘match’ at this stage in the game. Sometimes (most of the time) they fall into your lap much to your surprise!

 

[masuwerte]

Either evangelize her, or date her, but don’t attempt both. We don’t go into relationships to “fix” people; we go into relationships in order to love them just as they are.

Well said!