Daughter dating boy with "two dads"

[ThyKingdomCome]

Seems odd. If I invited you to dinner…having not known you…why in the world would I show you my bedroom? You would use the hall bath…not the master bath.

In my neighborhood there are 4 sets of gay men. When my daugher was selling Girl Scout cookies she and I were invited to come in. My daughter was about 10 at the time. She knew (Tom and Rick) (not their real names) were our neighbors…that is it. They bought cookies from her. She is now 24 and knows all about Tom and Rick.

They pay their taxes, keep up their home and the floors in their house sparkle. The hetero couple down the street looks like something out of the Adams Family. Weeds everywhere…cats all around house. The police have been visiting. It seems they don’t know what a lawnmower is used for. Our neighbor asked them why don’t they spay the cats…her answer “Because it goes against God’s law”. And yes, they are Catholic…go figure.

Our gay neighbors were great neighbors too, and very nice people. Dh was friendly with them because he and they were always out in the yards working. Our house is small, and the bathroom that our guests use is in the bedroom area of the house. With kids in the house, doors that should be closed, often end up open, and people can see in. I’ve been on house tours of aquaintances - often my dh and the people whose house we are at get into home-renovation discussions, and then they want to show you the work they’ve done. I woudn’t expect my kids to see the bedroom, but I wouldn’t assume it’s not going to happen either. It’s the idea that the closer you get into a person’s life, the more you learn about them in unexpected ways. That’s why with young children, I keep a distance, because I can’t predict what unexpected information will come their way.

 

[joandarc2008]

Our gay neighbors were great neighbors too, and very nice people. Dh was friendly with them because he and they were always out in the yards working. Our house is small, and the bathroom that our guests use is in the bedroom area of the house. With kids in the house, doors that should be closed, often end up open, and people can see in. I’ve been on house tours of aquaintances - often my dh and the people whose house we are at get into home-renovation discussions, and then they want to show you the work they’ve done. I woudn’t expect my kids to see the bedroom, but I wouldn’t assume it’s not going to happen either. It’s the idea that the closer you get into a person’s life, the more you learn about them in unexpected ways. That’s why with young children, I keep a distance, because I can’t predict what unexpected information will come their way.

I think this a good point as children somehow seem to always pick up on things we don’t always expect them too. Their ever increasing knowledge just astounds me at times.

 

[c_vet]

I have no idea why I post to this in defense of homo’s because I am a redneck at heart but the fear is too thick. mabe they’re having the same conversation on “homo’s vs. catholics.com” who care’s!!! my kid is dating a catholic…what do I do???
talk, drink wine, laugh, rumenisce about childhood, find common ground. and if things go crazy…stand up to ashley and leslie and tell them this doesn’t work for you…game over.

 

[shondrea]

I just wanna make a comment on the comment about the boy supposedly celebrating and reveling in his parent’s sin…

HE’S 17 YEARS OLD. He’s not rolling around in a big pile of sin, running it all over his body. It’s his FATHER, for crying out loud, whom he loves and is required to obey, and has most likely not been given a Catholic education about homosexuality. I SERIOUSLY think it’s more than offensive to be condemning the boy for reveling in his father’s sin.

 

[Laughing_Crow]

Ok I may not be the best guy to give advice in this situation (not a catholic and only 19) but from what youve told us the guy seems nice. He seems to respect your daughter and show willingness to listen and learn your faith.

Firstly you do not know how long his father has been with his partner, for all you know it may have happened a year ago which will change many things (his opinion on homosexuality biggest of all). Also, it should not matter what his opinion of gays are because he is dating your DAUGHTER. He is not gay himself, no matter what choice his father made, he still loves your daughter.

About the dinner, you shouldnt be to worried, gays i know are actually pretty reserved about their relationships in public. That said, in my personal opinion, dinner is something you do with, what was it 'people you wish to establish a closer relationship with). your first meeting should not be over dinner, go with a less formal meeting.

Also, get to know the boy, your focusing to much on his parents. Look at me, I come from 2 atheist parents and brother yet i follow Buddhist teachings. Will you really judge a person from where they come from instead of who they are?

 

[Adeodatus]

A lot of people are missing the point, Original Poster. The big deal is, if this young man does not consider his father to be living in grave sin, he has no business dating your daughter.

You owe a debt of parental responsibility to your daughter, and you owe a debt of charity to the young man, his father and his father’s gay buddy. You pay the debt to your daughter by restricting her to dating only those young men who profess correct moral values. Otherwise, don’t come crying here when she throws away her virginity because of the company she keeps… it will be partly your fault, because if she’s kept herself pure thus far it has been only with most holy and heroic effort, contra all the forces of the Western (fornicating) World, the flesh and the devil, our mortal enemies. Please don’t pull the rug out from under her by allowing her to go with a fellow who does not follow an upright path.

You pay your debt to the young man, his dad and Mr. Pink by showing them civility, fraternal correction and a holy example. You love them not by excusing any immorality but by showing them the glory of Jesus Christ in the way you behave toward them and toward your own daughter.

Now it may be that the young man does indeed acknowledge and confess that his father is living in grave sin. And that this young man rejects sodomy, fornication and the morbid culture of lust which is practically everywhere. If that’s the case then he’s an admirable fellow indeed, because he lives in the most difficult of circumstances, threading the needle between loving and respecting his father on the one hand, and rejecting sin on the other.

If the latter is the case then I see no obstacle to the meeting, as long as neither you nor your daughter suggest that a homosexual lifestyle is morally acceptable. Might I suggest that you ask for intercession from St. Monica, the mother of St. Augustine of Hippo? She was a virtuous woman, and her husband was a Roman pagan. Through her tireless example and prayers she helped to convert her son, the great saint, and also Patricius, her pagan husband. The situation in Carthage of those days is not really so different from our own.

 

[Mayita30]

Please respond to my points about sin spreading. The usage of “you” is impersonal in that it applies to you and everyone in this situation. The kid is celebrating sin; has he renounced his gay “parent’s” lifestyle? It applies. Try to respond to the CCC. That is, if you would follow the teaching of the Catholic Church.

I do agree with some of the points that Nec5 has posted here. I would worry if I have a child with this situation however,I don’t believe in condeming the boy, he has no fault that he grew up with same sex parents but going out and having dinner with them (MEETING THE PARENTS) seems a bit too much. It is sort of approving of their lifestyle.

Sometines strong decisions should be made and not all moral decision are applauded by people. I am not sayin that we should disrespect the gay couple. We just have to put our Faith into Actions. There are no shades of grey.It’s either Wrong or Right…anywhere in the middle is the doings of the devil.

 

[Mayita30]

Jesus never went along with everything he was invited to do by others. He used his own discernment.
Jesus sat down to eat with many sinners but only when they were repentant

sure and the bible also says:

Proverbs 13:20 He who walks with wise men will be wise, but the companion of fools will suffer harm

in other words:
Tell me who your friends are and I’ll tell you who you are
Birds of the same feather flock together

I’m not judging anyone here…just some thoughts…

 

[sanctamaria17]

I do agree with some of the points that Nec5 has posted here. I would worry if I have a child with this situation however,I don’t believe in condeming the boy, he has no fault that he grew up with same sex parents but going out and having dinner with them (MEETING THE PARENTS) seems a bit too much. It is sort of approving of their lifestyle.

Sometines strong decisions should be made and not all moral decision are applauded by people. I am not sayin that we should disrespect the gay couple. We just have to put our Faith into Actions. There are no shades of grey.It’s either Wrong or Right…anywhere in the middle is the doings of the devil.

Having dinner with people does not mean you approve their lifestyle. I’d rather know the parents of whom my kid was dating.

Honestly, some people don’t want to evangelize unless the person has already mended their lifestyle and changed their ways…everything falling short of converting themselves…What’s the point?

I’ll make sure everyone I dare eat with is a practicing Catholic only, from now on…

 

[Mayita30]

Having dinner with people does not mean you approve their lifestyle. I’d rather know the parents of whom my kid was dating.

Honestly, some people don’t want to evangelize unless the person has already mended their lifestyle and changed their ways…everything falling short of converting themselves…What’s the point?

I’ll make sure everyone I dare eat with is a practicing Catholic only, from now on…

========================================================

Evangelization is GOOD. No doubt about that.
When you choose to go out for dinner with a Gay Couple, for sure you think you are not sinning because you have not done anything wrong BUT you are putting yourself in an OCCASION OF SIN! and that is a sin itself !

There are lots of opportunites in evangelization but this is not the right situation.

example of OCCASION OF SIN:
–I am going to bring my family(including the kids) to the movies to watch BRoke Back Mountain (this film highly promotes gay marraige). Although I dont approve of this lifestyle ,I just want to watch it 'cause everybody is talking about it…

Note: YOu as a parent , you are exposing your children to indecent movies,compromising their beliefs and values!

 

[AnthonytheGreat]

I would politely decline to go to the dinner and would discuss the issue with my daughter about my decision.

 

[Mayita30]

========================================================

Evangelization is GOOD. No doubt about that.
When you choose to go out for dinner with a Gay Couple, for sure you think you are not sinning because you have not done anything wrong BUT you are putting yourself in an OCCASION OF SIN! and that is a sin itself !

There are lots of opportunites in evangelization but this is not the right situation.

example of OCCASION OF SIN:
–I am going to bring my family(including the kids) to the movies to watch BRoke Back Mountain (this film highly promotes gay marraige). Although I dont approve of this lifestyle ,I just want to watch it 'cause everybody is talking about it…

Note: YOu as a parent , you are exposing your children to indecent movies,compromising their beliefs and values!

Another example of OCCASIONS OF SIN :

– I am not having an AFFAIR. I am not having sex with my ex-Girlfriend. I am simply having lunch with her.My wife has no right to be upset…

Note: Sure he is not having any relationns (physical) with his ex-GF but the fact that he is meeting up with her is an OCCASION OF SIN which will eventually lead him to sin. The occasion of sin which he just placed himself in is already a sin…

 

[RHC]

I have an ex-uncle with a life partner (who by all accounts is a very nice man) and two cousins who have a difficult burden to bear. Not only did their father leave their mother after a long marriage, but he is now living this lifestyle. It’s a difficult road for them. As Laughing Crow said, when the father developed this relationship will have a deep impact on what the boy’s feelings are about the situation. He may be very uncomfortable but forced to live with it.

Second, I agree with Laughing Crow on another point. Most gay couples are rather reserved in public - and, by “public,” I mean with others in general. So I don’t think you’re going to have to worry about them engaging in significant PDA.

OP, if you feel uncomfortable in their home, perhaps a change of venue is in order?

This seems to be the situation: your daughter is dating this boy, who seems to be open to the Catholic faith and attends Mass with her. He has gay parents, which is not his fault. You’ve posted nothing about HIM that is detrimental; if your daughter were considering marrying him, I would be concerned about his not being Catholic. But they are a bit young yet for that, and he seems open to the faith, anyway. Your family is his link to the Church, and the Church has the answers he needs (as we all need the Church).

Someone’s post wondered about his views on sexuality, given his background. I’m going to be frank, here: I wouldn’t let my daughter spend much time alone with any boy, good Catholic or not. I know too many good kids, Catholic or other Christian, who have had their hormones run away with their heads. And they knew the truth. So, it’s best to minimize alone time for unmarried people of the opposite sex in general, in my opinion. By “alone,” I mean in a not-public place. They are less likely to get into shenanigans at a restaurant or ballpark, for example.

So, barring any objectionable issues with him, my guess is you are uncomfortable with having dinner at his father’s house. I can understand. So why not be “busy” that day, but invite his family to your home for a BBQ or something the next weekend? Of course they want to meet you; their son is dating your daughter. But, if it’s at your house, you won’t need to worry about seeing their bedroom or pictures or whatever. You’re on “your turf,” as it were. Or meet them at a restaurant, which would be neutral ground.

I don’t see how having dinner with them is “an occasion to sin,” as one poster suggested. What sin would that be, exactly? You’re not saying you like their lifestyle. If they know you are Catholic, they probably have guessed that you don’t approve. The Church is not secretive of her views on the homosexual lifestyle. And, if they ever ask, you can say something like, “We are Catholic, and we believe that everyone who is not in a marriage as defined by God should be celibate, regardless of their sexual persuasion.” But I would be VERY surprised if they ask you about it at all.

You’re meeting the parents of your daughter’s boyfriend. I doubt you’ll become close buddies with them; my parents were always cordial with my boyfriends’ parents (and are now with my in-laws), but they were not usually best of friends, except when the parents’ friendship existed first.

If you are worried about the effects of the boyfriend’s parents’ relationship on your daughter, you might reiterate to her what the Church teaches about sexuality. Its only place for valid expression is in a marriage as defined by God, which is between a man and a woman. Marriage is a sacrament, and we as humans are not authorized to redefine it to our wishes. In reality, the Church asks no more - and no less - of those with same-sex attraction than she does of those with opposite-sex attraction. The Church expects all unmarried (and, again, marriage as defined by God, not man) people to be celibate and chaste.

Prayers for wisdom for you in this matter.

 

[RHC]

Another example of OCCASIONS OF SIN :

– I am not having an AFFAIR. I am not having sex with my ex-Girlfriend. I am simply having lunch with her.My wife has no right to be upset…

Note: Sure he is not having any relationns (physical) with his ex-GF but the fact that he is meeting up with her is an OCCASION OF SIN which will eventually lead him to sin. The occasion of sin which he just placed himself in is already a sin…

I’m still confused. These examples aren’t in the same category as the OP’s situation. By going to see Brokeback Mountain, you’re showing your family fairly explicit gay sex and supporting the movie with your money, which supports what the movie stands for. By having lunch with your ex-GF while married, you are promoting scandal and possibly opening up the opportunity for an affair. Not to mention the hurt done to the wife’s feelings…

As I said above, I doubt that the OP will become great friends with these people. Having dinner is not the same as the examples you cited because no sin has been committed. What is the sin in having dinner with them, exactly? Especially if they are at a restaurant (so the OP won’t see their bed or pictures or whatever)? And don’t say it will cause scandal. Marching in a gay pride parade when people know you’re Catholic? Scandal, because people will think badly of the Church and your witness. Having dinner with someone at a restaurant, which is my suggestion to the OP? Hardly. Do you ever eat dinner with co-workers, clients, or business partners? Are they all living chaste, moral lives? Are you sure? Does this mean every business lunch is an “occasion to sin”?

 

[Mayita30]

I’m still confused. These examples aren’t in the same category as the OP’s situation. By going to see Brokeback Mountain, you’re showing your family fairly explicit gay sex and supporting the movie with your money, which supports what the movie stands for. By having lunch with your ex-GF while married, you are promoting scandal and possibly opening up the opportunity for an affair. Not to mention the hurt done to the wife’s feelings…

As I said above, I doubt that the OP will become great friends with these people. Having dinner is not the same as the examples you cited because no sin has been committed. What is the sin in having dinner with them, exactly? Especially if they are at a restaurant (so the OP won’t see their bed or pictures or whatever)? And don’t say it will cause scandal. Marching in a gay pride parade when people know you’re Catholic? Scandal, because people will think badly of the Church and your witness. Having dinner with someone at a restaurant, which is my suggestion to the OP? Hardly. Do you ever eat dinner with co-workers, clients, or business partners? Are they all living chaste, moral lives? Are you sure? Does this mean every business lunch is an “occasion to sin”?

Another example of Occasion of Sin

You accompany your friend to an abortion clinic. She gets an abortion while you wait for her. Now you are telling her you are against abortion but still you accompany her.

It’s the same with this situation.You are telling your kids that Gay marriage is unnatural and immoral yet you dine with a gay couple…

 

[Mayita30]

I’m still confused. These examples aren’t in the same category as the OP’s situation. By going to see Brokeback Mountain, you’re showing your family fairly explicit gay sex and supporting the movie with your money, which supports what the movie stands for. By having lunch with your ex-GF while married, you are promoting scandal and possibly opening up the opportunity for an affair. Not to mention the hurt done to the wife’s feelings…

Yes ! so by going to the movie you already placed yourself in an occasion of sin because you have compromise the beliefs and values of your family. You have not stood up for what you believe in.You supported the movie.

Having lunch with the ex-GF Opens up the opportunity of an affair that itself is the occasion TO sin which is a sin itself, that is what I was taught by the priests

 

[Julianna]

A lot of people are missing the point, Original Poster. The big deal is, if this young man does not consider his father to be living in grave sin, he has no business dating your daughter.

You owe a debt of parental responsibility to your daughter, and you owe a debt of charity to the young man, his father and 5. his father’s gay buddy**. 1. You pay the debt to your daughter by restricting her to dating only those young men who profess correct moral values.** Otherwise, don’t come crying here 2. when she throws away her virginity because of the company she keeps.… it will be partly 3. your fault, because if she’s kept herself pure thus far it has been only with most holy and heroic effort, contra all the forces of the Western (fornicating) World, the flesh and the devil, our mortal enemies. 4. Please don’t pull the rug out from under her by allowing her to go with a fellow who does not follow an upright path.
You pay your debt to the young man, his dad and **5a. Mr. Pink **by showing them civility, fraternal correction and a holy example. You love them not by excusing any immorality but by showing them the glory of Jesus Christ in the way you behave toward them and toward your own daughter.

Now it may be that the young man does indeed acknowledge and confess that his father is living in grave sin. And that this young man rejects sodomy, fornication and the morbid culture of lust which is practically everywhere. If that’s the case then he’s an admirable fellow indeed, because he lives in the most difficult of circumstances, threading the needle between loving and respecting his father on the one hand, and rejecting sin on the other.

If the latter is the case then I see no obstacle to the meeting, as long as neither you nor your daughter suggest that a homosexual lifestyle is morally acceptable. Might I suggest that you ask for intercession from St. Monica, the mother of St. Augustine of Hippo? She was a virtuous woman, and her husband was a Roman pagan. Through her tireless example and prayers she helped to convert her son, the great saint, and also Patricius, her pagan husband. The situation in Carthage of those days is not really so different from our own.

1. Really? Catholic teenage boys are not lustful? Wow! I didn’t think of that!:bigyikes:
2. A girl can only throw her virginity away to a teenage boy who’s dad is gay. Wow! A mighty strong crystal ball you have there.:hypno:
3. So when and “if” she loses her virginity to this boy…it’s the parents fault. Really?
4. All Catholic teenage boys are virtous. :aok: I’ve learned something new.
5. and 5a. “his father’s gay buddy” and “Mr. Pink”…I bet that was worth a confession.

Going to dinner at someone’s home and start preaching to them.

 

[Adeodatus]

1. Really? Catholic teenage boys are not lustful? Wow! I didn’t think of that!:bigyikes:
2. A girl can only throw her virginity away to a teenage boy who’s dad is gay. Wow! A mighty strong crystal ball you have there.:hypno:
3. So when and “if” she loses her virginity to this boy…it’s the parents fault. Really?
4. All Catholic teenage boys are virtous. :aok: I’ve learned something new.
5. and 5a. “his father’s gay buddy” and “Mr. Pink”…I bet that was worth a confession.

Going to dinner at someone’s home and start preaching to them.

If you think that saying:
Someone who holds incorrect moral values is unfit to date your daughter
is the logical equivalent of saying:
Everyone who says he holds correct moral values is fit to date your daughter

… then we have a breakdown in logic so severe that there’s pretty much no excuse for you to hide behind if you’re an adult. Hopefully you’re not so morally irresponsible as to go around giving people advice if you are that bad at formulating logically valid propositions.

So you think I shouldn’t call that other fellow, who is wrecking the household of a young man with an imperiled soul, who is pulling himself and the boy’s father down with a mortal sin and showing this example to the boy… “gay”? You’re offended by a jocose quip like “Mr. Pink”?

Fine. Let’s just call him “the sodomite”. Or do you also lack the necessary charity for your fellow human beings to point out to them when they’re damning themselves to Hell?

No, we’re supposed to love our fellow human beings too much for that. The sodomite included. But hey, if it will make you feel better to tell yourself that while they’re burning in Hell, at least you didn’t embarrass yourself over dinner by bearing witness to the law of Jesus Christ… still no excuse.

If I was about to be run over by a bus, but I was in the middle of talking, I’d rather someone be rude and interrupt me and tell me about the bus, than to politely remain silent while I was flattened. The latter is not charity… it is vanity.

 

[Julianna]

If you think that saying:
Someone who holds incorrect moral values is unfit to date your daughter
is the logical equivalent of saying:
Everyone who says he holds correct moral values is fit to date your daughter

… then we have a breakdown in logic so severe that there’s pretty much no excuse for you to hide behind if you’re an adult.I am 52 yrs young. Hopefully you’re not so morally irresponsible as to go around giving people advice if you are that bad at formulating logically valid propositions.I see, you are a “letter of law” person. You have deduced that I am a “spirit of the law” person. While you banter on about “logic” and “law”, I look within and to the gifts of the spirit that teach me to “look to the heart” of the “human being”. I am not in the position of damning anyone to hell…in fact I give very little credence to evil. You, however look to “outer” covering and appearance and that speaks volumes to ones salvation. Hitler’s stormtroopers were among the best educated, dressed well, loyal to the fatherland and were butchers. So much for outward appearances.

So you think I shouldn’t call that other fellow, who is wrecking the household of a young man with an imperiled soul, who is pulling himself and the boy’s father down with a mortal sin and showing this example to the boy… “gay”? **By virtue of the boys father having a relationship with another man…you apparantly don’t believe his father is as culpable as the “fellow who is wrecking the household”.**You’re offended by a jocose quip like “Mr. Pink”? No more that I would call you a pompous, arrogant, self-righteous bigot.

Fine. Let’s just call him “the sodomite”. Or do you also lack the necessary charity for your fellow human beings to point out to them when they’re damning themselves to Hell?That is not for mere mortals, such as ourselves to decide. Or did you wake up one day to immortality?

No, we’re supposed to love our fellow human beings too much for that. The sodomite included. **“Love one another, as I have loved you.”**But hey, if it will make you feel better to tell yourself that while they’re burning in Hell, at least you didn’t embarrass yourself over dinner by bearing witness to the law of Jesus Christ… still no excuse. **“By their fruits, you shall know them.” The boys father and partner “know” he dating a Catholic girl and they “know” he going to Mass with her. Therefore, they “know” what the Church teaches about homosexuality. **

If I was about to be run over by a bus, but I was in the middle of talking, I’d rather someone be rude and interrupt me and tell me about the bus, than to politely remain silent while I was flattened. The latter is not charity… it is vanity.

An vain, you are. Seems that beam is stuck way beyond your eye.

Just a note: I do not run to the mods when someone insults me on a personal level. I am a big girl and can take care of myself. I just want the mods to know that an anonymous person on a message board has no control over my thoughts or feelings. Play on, McDuff…er uh Adeodatus.

 

[Mayita30]

An vain, you are. Seems that beam is stuck way beyond your eye.

Just a note: I do not run to the mods when someone insults me on a personal level. I am a big girl and can take care of myself. I just want the mods to know that an anonymous person on a message board has no control over my thoughts or feelings. Play on, McDuff…er uh Adeodatus.

Juliana, if a friend of yours ask you to company her to an Abortion Clinic? Would you do that knowing that our catholic faith is strongly against abortion?