Dealing with Husband's Past

[Mamanurse]

I don’t know you but my blood boils just by reading your post.
Your husband has disrespected you in the vilest of ways, both through his unfaithfulness and his hiding of the fact.
He was not marriage material when you met him (no addict is), and you possibly wouldn’t have married him had you known that he was daily having virtual sex with other women.
That means that your marriage is probably invalid. Its worth looking into that.
Your husband was caught… he didn’t confess and change out of love.
Sorry, but what a disgusting thing he has done to you.

I think that by saying he is not marriage material is a bit harsh. You know nothing about this man, except for his sexual sins. I don’t think that your statement is a very kind one. Every one of us deal with our own personal temptations and sins. Who are you to base his entire person on his temptation and sin? Marriage is a commitment and she made that for better or worse…right now, its for worse. Change takes time and prayer. As I suggested, she needs to delve into daily prayer for strength to forgive and for his soul. Yes, while her husband has offended her, think of how he has offended God. Are you that perfect that you are willing to cast the first stone? I think not. These are hard things for people to post and your post is not a kind one with support and love, but rather condescending to her judgement and telling her that her marriage is invalid. I guess I don’t see the benefit of your post.

 

[GraceDK]

I think that by saying he is not marriage material is a bit harsh. You know nothing about this man, except for his sexual sins. I don’t think that your statement is a very kind one. Every one of us deal with our own personal temptations and sins. Who are you to base his entire person on his temptation and sin? Marriage is a commitment and she made that for better or worse…right now, its for worse. Change takes time and prayer. As I suggested, she needs to delve into daily prayer for strength to forgive and for his soul. Yes, while her husband has offended her, think of how he has offended God. Are you that perfect that you are willing to cast the first stone? I think not. These are hard things for people to post and your post is not a kind one with support and love, but rather condescending to her judgement and telling her that her marriage is invalid. I guess I don’t see the benefit of your post.

The husband was cheating already at the time of their engagement and marriage, as far as I understand.
This is not about casting stones. This is about realising that this man is destroying the happiness and self image of his wife, while she thought she married a faithful Catholic.

Hidden addictions at the time of the marriage is a reason for invalidity. I am hardly condescending for pointing that out, which is part of the canon law.
Faced with living with a man who has, so early on, betrayed ones trust in the most intimate areas, and who had to get caught, and now doesn’t even seem to repent, it seems rather helpful to point out that she is not doomed to live in such an unacceptable situation.

I might have sympathy for addicted people. But those who drag other people into their messed up lives while hiding it are acting very selfishly.
And indeed, I feel more sorry for the OP than for her husband.

 

[Mamanurse]

The husband was cheating already at the time of their engagement and marriage, as far as I understand.
This is not about casting stones.* This is about realising that this man is destroying the happiness and self image of his wife, while she thought she married a faithful Catholic.*

Hidden addictions at the time of the marriage is a reason for invalidity. I am hardly condescending for pointing that out, which is part of the canon law.
Faced with living with a man who has, so early on, betrayed ones trust in the most intimate areas, and who had to get caught, and now doesn’t even seem to repent, it seems rather helpful to point out that she is not doomed to live in such an unacceptable situation.

I might have sympathy for addicted people. But those who drag other people into their messed up lives while hiding it are acting very selfishly.
And indeed, I feel more sorry for the OP than for her husband.

Aren’t we taught to not place our entire happiness on a person? Aren’t we supposed to place our happiness completely in the Lords Hands? IF this is so, then shouldn’t we be encouraging her to place her happiness and trust in the Lord instead of a person?

Betrayal sucks, it hurts and destroys relationships of all kinds. But I think that every person deserves a chance to reform and change. Like I said before, change takes time and prayer.

 

[KostyaJMJ]

I don’t know you but my blood boils just by reading your post.
Your husband has disrespected you in the vilest of ways, both through his unfaithfulness and his hiding of the fact.
He was not marriage material when you met him (no addict is), and you possibly wouldn’t have married him had you known that he was daily having virtual sex with other women.
That means that your marriage is probably invalid. Its worth looking into that.
Your husband was caught… he didn’t confess and change out of love.
Sorry, but what a disgusting thing he has done to you.

It took 19 posts before someone suggested a divorce and an annulment. I was wagering it would be before then but people seem more restrained than usual today.

 

[Jesus_123]

+RTRT88 . . . perhaps . . . along with contacting your priest for help and counsel . . . it might be helpful for you personally to contact an **Al-Anon **group . . . these groups are formed as part of the Alcoholic’s Anonymous program . . . they help family members understand and formulate a strategy to handle addictive behavior . . . the type of addiction for the most part is somewhat irrelevant . . . most of the same tools can be adapted to any form of compulsive addictive behavior . . . and I don’t believe they charge anything for individuals to become a part of their educational and supportive groups . . . so far as I know they are free . . . but to be on the safe side just ask about this . . .

Learning how not to “enable” a compulsive addicted person is incredibly important . . . Al-Anon can give you some tools to help personally to cope with this new knowledge and the reality of what you are living with . . . and how to perhaps deal with it wisely . . . also learning how not to allow a **co-dependent **unhealthy relationship . . . which enables the sin to continue . . . to replace the holy reciprocity of a healthy honest and loving . . . give and take . . . marriage relationship . . .

If you just type in Al-Anon in your computer . . . *I checked *. . . and there actually is even a site to find a group in your area . . . and you could also just check out your phone book . . . calling the local Alcoholics Anonymous group for information on your local Al-Anon group if an Al-Anon group isn’t listed . . . I’m hesitant to recommend a worldly support group related to your husband’s particular sin . . . people’s morals . . . ***or lack thereof ***. . . can be very disturbing in such a group . . . and destructive of the Godly innocence and health of a soul . . . Adam and Eve ate of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil . . . but their loving God in no way intended nor wanted his beloved children to be afflicted by the knowledge of evil . . . nowadays as God’s children . . .as Christians we need to exercise good judgment and limit our contact with such to a “need-to-know” basis . . .

The only thing to be watchful about is that an Al-Anon group will probably be a mixed bag of people . . . only some of whom may be Christian . . . *and many of whom are not *. . . be sure to filter you understandings with your Catholic Christian perspective . . . a Catholic’s faith and morals are often radically different from the peoples of the world around us . . .

Your situation is very like unto discovering a malignancy . . . the malignancy needs to be removed and therapeutic treatment needs to follow to ensure no reoccurence will happen . . . this takes some very real work and time . . . your husband may . . . or may not . . . be committed and willing to change . . . as you call down the graces of God through prayer and learn how to deal with him appropriately now that the situation has come to a crisis and is out in the open . . . but at this stage of the game . . . just take control of your life personally . . . and recognizing that there is a grave illness afflicting your marriage . . . prayerfully take every step you can to find an intelligent loving way to deal with it without being destroyed by it yourself . . . and using a password or a series of passwords . . . absolutely put strict filters in place so that he cannot use your home computer to continue indulging in his sin . . . “lead him not into temptation” . . . call a computer expert if you don’t know how to do this yourself . . .

Just continue to be honest with yourself . . . remembering every day that this sin is your husband’s personal sin . . . you are not in anyway responsible for his decisions to indulge in this grave mortal sin . . . if the situation is simply too much for you to handle . . . a separation may very well become necessary . . . while this opportunity to deal with this sinful horribly destructive addictive behavior is dealt with by your husband . . . or is not dealt with by your husband . . . tough love is sometimes the only route to victory . . . and survival for those innocently caught in the contaminated life of such an individual . . . God loves him . . . and you have loved him . . . but God doesn’t love or accept his sin . . . so please . . . don’t let his sin destroy you or your life any further . . .

May God love, bless and guide you during this trial of faith and devastatingly changed life circumstance . . .

*In dedication to the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart . . . *

. . . all for Jesus+
. . . Sweet Spirit of our Holy God+
. . . open up the Holy Healing Pathways of God+
. . . for both this deeply wounded wife+
. . . and her afflicted husband+​

 

[GraceDK]

It took 19 posts before someone suggested a divorce and an annulment. I was wagering it would be before then but people seem more restrained than usual today.

Excuse me, I don’t believe in divorce.
Do you remember a little while back there was a man here whose wife lied to him before they married, saying she was a virgin when she in fact wasn’t. He asked whether their marriage was valid at all since it would have been a deal breaker for him if she had told him back then that she was not a virgin.
That was a serious question, and he got quite a few answers confirming his fear that he was living in an invalid marriage and he probably needed to validate it somehow.

This OP might have gone and married her husband anyway, if she had known he was addicted to porn. In that case the marriage is valid.
But frankly, I am surprised you all think this should somehow not be pointed out although the OP has clearly been on the verge of depression due to the betrayal of her husband, a man who seemes surprised at what damage he has done to his marriage and wife and who doesn’t seem particularly repentant.

 

[GraceDK]

+. . . if the situation is simply too much for you to handle . . . a separation may very well become necessary . . . while this opportunity to deal with this sinful horribly destructive addictive behavior is dealt with by your husband . . . or is not dealt with by your husband . . . tough love is sometimes the only route to victory . . . and survival for those innocently caught in the contaminated life of such an individual . . . God loves him . . . and you have loved him . . . but God doesn’t love or accept his sin . . . so please . . . don’t let his sin destroy you or your life any further . . .

]

Thats what I am trying to say… but now someone might also give this poster fire for pointing out the possibility of seperation.
Lets remember that the OP is the victim here.

 

[GraceDK]

Aren’t we taught to not place our entire happiness on a person?

No, but we are not living in monasteries where we cannot choose our company. Marriage is for life and its about children, their education, its about union of spouses, exclusive sexual life, indissoluble faithfulness and chastity. You can apply spriritual principles to many things, but you can’t tell other people to let their lives and dreams go down the drain by passively accepting cuntinued infidelity and being treated like a door mat.

Aren’t we supposed to place our happiness completely in the Lords Hands? IF this is so, then shouldn’t we be encouraging her to place her happiness and trust in the Lord instead of a person?

Actually, you are called to use your free will wisely. That doesn’t mean you just sail on towards the crecipe because “God will take care of turning the boat in time”. No, God gives you responsibility, and He calls us to happiness and good things. I think its important that the OP takes a serious look at her husbands sincerity or lack thereof, before she starts having children with him.

Betrayal sucks, it hurts and destroys relationships of all kinds. But I think that every person deserves a chance to reform and change. Like I said before, change takes time and prayer.

Actually he doesn’t deserve anything. He has frauded his girlfriend into marrying him, hidden his infidelity and impurity. The OP can be genereous and give him a second chance, and we all agree its a good thing if the husband is extremely sorry for his adultery and working actively to restore the trust he has detroyed, but he doesn’t deserve it…
Such severe break of trust at the early stage in marriage is not something you can just “spiritualize” your way around.

 

[KostyaJMJ]

Excuse me, I don’t believe in divorce.
Do you remember a little while back there was a man here whose wife lied to him before they married, saying she was a virgin when she in fact wasn’t. He asked whether their marriage was valid at all since it would have been a deal breaker for him if she had told him back then that she was not a virgin.
That was a serious question, and he got quite a few answers confirming his fear that he was living in an invalid marriage and he probably needed to validate it somehow.

I saw that and I thought that people were way off base to make him question the validity of his marriage. If there is a doubt the presumption is always towards validity (Canon 1060). People in an unhappy marriage can easily imagine grounds for an annulment to reclaim their freedom and they don’t need encouragement.

 

[whm]

The husband was cheating already at the time of their engagement and marriage, as far as I understand.
This is not about casting stones. This is about realising that this man is destroying the happiness and self image of his wife, while she thought she married a faithful Catholic.

Hidden addictions at the time of the marriage is a reason for invalidity. I am hardly condescending for pointing that out, which is part of the canon law.
Faced with living with a man who has, so early on, betrayed ones trust in the most intimate areas, and who had to get caught, and now doesn’t even seem to repent, it seems rather helpful to point out that she is not doomed to live in such an unacceptable situation.

I might have sympathy for addicted people. But those who drag other people into their messed up lives while hiding it are acting very selfishly.
And indeed, I feel more sorry for the OP than for her husband.

While I agree with the level of your outrage, I think it is over the top to be making such judgments (on marriage validity) in this case. All we know is that she caught him, he agreed to stop and there is no evidence that he did not stop(correct me if I’m wrong but I didn’t see a second incident). We don’t know if they are faithful Catholics or not, there is a ton that we do not know. For example the working separate shifts creates a very challenging situation, no excuse to sin, but I am sure it didn’t help the situation. She understandably is having a very difficult time dealing with this. I have a lot of respect for efforts of trying to deal with this. Rubbing her face in it is not going to help her, it actually can make the situation worse. I think it would be better to simple suggest that it is important that she discuss this in detail with her priest including the apparent fact that this was going on at the time of the marriage. The priest can give her much better, fact based, unbiased advice.

Also she said “He has mentioned going to counseling” but she didn’t think they can afford it. So it appears that he is at least willing to work on things. To the OP, yes Catholic Charities does provide counseling at reduced or no cost. As far as being able to afford it, I would cancel the TV and internet and make a few other sacrifices for this. Working on this issue is as important as eating an breathing, put it way up on the priority list!

 

[Jesus_123]

"For me prayer is a surge of the heart, it is a simple look towards Heaven,
it is a cry of recognition and of love, embracing both trial and joy."

• Saint Therese of Lisieux
  The
  Our
  Father

Our Father,
Who art in heaven,
Hallowed be Thy Name.
Thy Kingdom come.
Thy Will be done,
on earth as it is in Heaven.
Give us this day our daily bread.
And forgive us our trespasses,
as we forgive those who trespass against us.
And lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from evil.
Amen.
- Jesus

Link: ewtn.com/Devotionals/prayers/pater2.htm

* The Hail Mary

Hail Mary . . . full of grace . . . the Lord is with thee . . . blessed art thou among women . . . and blessed is the Fruit of thy womb . . . Jesus . . . Holy Mary . . . Mother of God . . . pray for us sinners . . . now and at the hour of our death . . . Amen . . .

. . . all for Jesus​

+
. . . thank You Dear Jesus+
. . . thank you Blessed Holy Mother+
​

*

 

[RTRT88]

Again, thank you everyone for your posts and advice. At this time, I am still keeping divorce and annulment on the “NOT an option” list. I took my vows, and I sincerely meant them. I truly believe he did as well. Even his parents were shocked when he told them what was going on. His mother broke down in tears because she had reassured me when we met that he “is not a liar. He could never lie to anyone.” I think she felt betrayed just as I did. To clear things up, my husband is and WAS a good man when I married him. He is the best man I have ever met, and him and my dad quickly became best friends. He holds a very respectable job in town, and people always tell me how wonderful he is.

That aside, he did cause me some serious pain that is obviously very difficult to overcome. I think it’s partially because he is such a great guy that this moral oversight struck me so off-guard. I don’t think this situation causes our marriage to be invalid, but I am worried about the adultery issue. I told him that is how I felt. That it seemed like he was lusting after all these women who obviously aren’t me, and that I would feel the same had I caught him in bed with someone. He says this is unfair, and not at all what was going on.

 

[whm]

I told him that is how I felt. That it seemed like he was lusting after all these women who obviously aren’t me, and that I would feel the same had I caught him in bed with someone. He says this is unfair, and not at all what was going on.

I am certain he didn’t think he was cheating in this way, he would be a monster if he did. I would say to him it doesn’t matter if he thinks it is unfair, it still feels that way to you. If he can start to understand this, it will help you to deal with your feelings. On the other hand the fact that he talked about whats going on with his parents is encouraging, that shows some acceptance of responsibility.

 

[GraceDK]

I saw that and I thought that people were way off base to make him question the validity of his marriage. If there is a doubt the presumption is always towards validity (Canon 1060). People in an unhappy marriage can easily imagine grounds for an annulment to reclaim their freedom and they don’t need encouragement.

This is interesting. I have noticed many times at CAF where invalidity is pointed out to some poster. But now, because its about pornography I am not allowed to say it or what?
I think you misuse the presumption clause a bit here. At least the canon lawyer I took classes from on canon law said that validity doesn’t depend on intention or feelings. Something is valid or invalid based on the freedom of consent etc. at the time of the wedding.
Grounds for nullity as far as I remember, which might apply in this case:

• No intention to be faithful at the time of the marriage ceremony. (OP said the porn history on the computer goes way back)
• Fraud. The person is being lied to (or hidden things from) about important things which, if they had been known, would have made the person no want to marry the other.
• Hidden addictions. (what I find very disturbing in this case is not only did the husband hide his porn-use but he also made clear before marriage that he didn’t need such things etc… he tangled himself into his own lie to an unnessesary degree…

 

[GraceDK]

. I told him that is how I felt. That it seemed like he was lusting after all these women who obviously aren’t me, and that I would feel the same had I caught him in bed with someone. He says this is unfair, and not at all what was going on.

Unfair? A bit audacious to speak about what is unfair, isn’t it?
Well, did he say what it is then, if its not lust after these women and the perverse acts they perform? It should seem obvious that he was lusting, and the denial doesn’t seem right… would he perhaps also deny that he masturbated all these times when he was looking at them? I think he should better admit what it was to show that he is ready to take responsibility and clean up his act.

 

[whm]

This is interesting. I have noticed many times at CAF where invalidity is pointed out to some poster. But now, because its about pornography I am not allowed to say it or what?.

I would say it should not be discussed by amateurs (ie all of us) based on limited information (whether is porn addiction or whatever). Especially when the couple is not divorced and separated. I recommend you ask your professor or priest if it is wise for you to be pointing these things out on the internet. At a minimum I think you should always advise that they discuss this with their priest if you think there is a validity concern.

 

[Jesus_123]

+Denial of the harm to themselves and to others as to their destructive behavior’s consequences is a hallmark of sinful addictive behavior . . . he’s continuing to lie to himself and to you about this reality . . . he really needs to go to a priest both for confession and counseling . . .

Take our **Wonderful Saviour . . . Jesus . . . at His **word . . . your husband has been constantly indulging in adultery . . . you hold on to that truth . . . your feelings in this situation are sound and real and rooted in the Truth of God . . . stand your ground and don’t give in to his attempted rationalization of his sin . . . he’s caught in a bad trap he probably doesn’t want to acknowledge at this point . . . and probably doesn’t know how to get out of . . . regular humble confession, partaking of the Holy Eucharist, and counseling will help guide him to the pathway out that will work for him . . .

:bible1: EPHESIANS 6:12
For our wrestling is not against flesh and blood; but against principalities and power, against the rulers of the world of this darkness, against the spirits of wickedness in the high places.​

. . . all for Jesus+
. . . thank you Holy Mother Church+
. . . praise God for holy priests+​

 

[GraceDK]

I would say it should not be discussed by amateurs (ie all of us) based on limited information (whether is porn addiction or whatever). Especially when the couple is not divorced and separated. I recommend you ask your professor or priest if it is wise for you to be pointing these things out on the internet. At a minimum I think you should always advise that they discuss this with their priest if you think there is a validity concern.

Amateurs, sure we are. I have had at least 16 classes about Marriage in Canon Law, dealing with precisely these things. Its never a comfortable theme, and I am quite sure that the OP is in contact with the Church very much and knows to go to the tribunal if she wants a real assessment.
Anyway, this is a internet forum. The OP came with a description of adultery and lying, writing a very sad and depressed post, and seems to imply that the husand doesn’t take responsibility for his actions and for what pain it has caused.
This is probably the only time on CAF where I have pointed out the the option of annullment because I get real sad and indignated when I see women being in such degrading situations.
Anyhow, the OP has now said that she is not interested in finding out about validity etc. so I will leave it at that, and apologize to you and anyone I might have offended. You are right, I should probably wait till asked.
Its clear that OP loves her husband, and thats great, but she needs to realise he is a man and a human being and not a saint… yet she also must know that love is proven in actions, not in sweet talk. And I hope she will let him prove his sincerety regardless of the fact that she is currently very in love.

 

[larsenl1]

Again, thank you everyone for your posts and advice. At this time, I am still keeping divorce and annulment on the “NOT an option” list. I took my vows, and I sincerely meant them. I truly believe he did as well. Even his parents were shocked when he told them what was going on. His mother broke down in tears because she had reassured me when we met that he “is not a liar. He could never lie to anyone.” I think she felt betrayed just as I did. To clear things up, my husband is and WAS a good man when I married him. He is the best man I have ever met, and him and my dad quickly became best friends. He holds a very respectable job in town, and people always tell me how wonderful he is.

That aside, he did cause me some serious pain that is obviously very difficult to overcome. I think it’s partially because he is such a great guy that this moral oversight struck me so off-guard. I don’t think this situation causes our marriage to be invalid, but I am worried about the adultery issue. I told him that is how I felt. That it seemed like he was lusting after all these women who obviously aren’t me, and that I would feel the same had I caught him in bed with someone. He says this is unfair, and not at all what was going on.

I have to add my thoughts. I support you in your decision to stay in the marriage. Just because there *may * be grounds for an annulment, the validity of the sacrament could be investigate, does not demand that there be an tribal investigation of the validity of the marriage. I believe a marriage in the church where there was not an altered state of mind and the couple intends to have children etc is valid.

I think your husband was probably in a deep state of denial about his need to view pornography. Thus his declarations that he did not need it.

Marriage is a job (vocation) and it is not easy.

Forgiveness will help you heal. Briefly, my daughters are adopted, they were adopted when they were in grade school. One of them was horribly abused by her biological mother. At first I hated her for the evil she did. It took me two years to find it in my heart to forgive her. Now I pray for her soul in purgatory at every instance when I receive Eucharist.

Truly, give this up to God. Let Him carry you. Listen to Tenth Avenue North, I’ll be by your side.

God Bless.

 

[RTRT88]

GraceDK - I appreciate your posts and I am not at all offended. I think you brought up a good point. Not that you are suggesting this, but I am not a fan of “taking the easy way out.” I know my husband is not a saint, and I know that sweet talk is not a good foundation for trust. However, he has proven himself in other areas of our marriage. He is very good at helping with the housework, and as I am in school right now, he is the sole provider for the two of us and makes no complaints about that. He constantly surprises me with dinner and small gifts. I think that the fact that he is so caring in other ways is what made this act such a blow.

I have written to our tribunal not for an annullment assessment, but to ask for help and guidance through the church. You are right, this is a very degrading situation and I don’t wish it on anyone. I hope that we never have to go through it again.

Everyone’s posts are very much appreciated. Thank you all so much! I can feel the healing already taking place just through this discussion.