You are correct. Why not? The answer is obvious…because humans can’t procreate that way…by having sterile sex (with a same sex partner). So, where did they get the idea that it’s okay to have this kidn of sterile sex…sex that is void of a procreative nature?Gay people do not need to use contraception.
You are proving my point for me. Yes, a heterosexual will use contraceptives with the opposite sex. No, a homosexual does not need contraception with a same sex partner. WHY will they use contraception? Or WHY will a homosexual “couple” have sex knowing that their act cannot be ordered toward procreation?
Show me where it is popularly accepted in places that don’t have wide access to contraception. The stand I am taking has nothing to do with the “existence” of homosexuality. I’m discussing the popular acceptance of homosexual acts. This is the 7th time I’ve clarified this. If you can’t distinguish between the two very different topics, we will be at an impasse.You tell me why it exists in cultures that don’t have wide access to contraception then.
Fine. I would LOVE to hear the argument as to how the contraception mentality affects the amount of people who exit their mother’s womb as homosexuals. Homosexuality is caused by a combination of genetics and the environment inside the womb. How, exactly, would you prove that a societal mentality impacts how a fetus develops? I am dying to know.
From the Church, of course. My wife’s aunt is sterile, and yet the Church has no problem with her having sex, even though there is a 0% chance of her getting pregnant. Since a sterile heterosexual couple can have sex, a sterile homosexual couple should be able to have sex as well.
Contraceptives have allowed us to no longer see the need for the true purpose of marriage. It is no longer about being responsible with your sexuality by willfully committing to the other in marriage that you will be engaging in heterosexual activity with. With children now seen as optional and a separate and more willful choice than its ever been before, we tend to now marry more for our own self fulfillment than out of a sense of responsibility. While there can be great joys in marriage, and a happy and healthy marriage should be pursued, if the entire reason for being and staying married is your mutual personal gratifications there is less motivation to work through problems. It is far easier to move on and find someone who it is easier to love and who it is easier to feel loved by.
I don’t think they promote homosexual behavior, but they do promote the idea that there is no significant distinquition between homosexual relationships and heterosexual relationships because we have removed their distinctions. Gay marriage gets more and more support because heterosexual marriages loses more and more of its meaning in purpose as it is practiced by heterosexuals.
Contraceptives seperate sex and procreation in the mind. The link however remains there regardless of what measures we take. There are always failure rates. The contraceptive mentality gives us the sense of entitlement to be able to have sex without having babies. As such abortions because the necessary fail safe for the reality of contraceptive failures.
Modern-day Kenya?
Did you actually that article for your example of Modern Day Kenya? It says the women don’t engage in sexual relations, and that the woman with the more feminine role will have sex with a MAN from the clan of the woman she has partnered with. The purpose of the woman to woman union is so the odler woman who is now unable to bear children can be honored with children by another female who has sex solely with men. And the two women sleep in separate huts. And even if the DID have homosexual relations, homosexuality is NOT accepted in Kenya…it’s illegal…and you have no stats to prove they dont’ have access to contraceptives either.Modern-day Kenya?
bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-16871435
Ancient Rome?
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_ancient_Rome
This is the 3rd time I’ve said this.
But it is still a same-sex marriage/relationship. So my point is proven.
Contraception is available however women rarely have access due to widespread pressure to not take it. It’s not culturally acceptable. doublex.com/section/health-science/kenyan-women-go-pill%E2%80%94behind-their-husbands%E2%80%99-backs
They didn’t have ‘contraception’ so much as abortion. So your assertion that contraception = homosexuality is not proven in Rome.
twoangels, thanks for this very thoughtful post (the whole thing…I only did the “…” abbreviation to keep this reply short).
No, because I’m talking about when it becomes widely acceptable for homosexual couples to engage in homosexual sex. In Kenya, it is not acceptable, it is taboo, and illegal. AND, in the example you gave, the “couple” isn’t having sex at all anyway, so they aren’t engaging in homosexual activity to begin with. In fact, the worst thing that is happening in that situation is that *a woman is having sex with a man *to whom she is not married in order to procreate. And as homosexuality is not acceptable in Kenya, contraception is also not acceptable. Neither are acceptable there, though there are some who go against the norm. The Kenya example could just as easily be used to defend my point because both contraception and homosexuality are popularly frowned upon, not accepted.
First of all, show me the stats to show they did not have contraception. Second of all, what is abortion for? Is it not to prevent a baby being born? What is contraception for? Is it not to prevent a baby being born? They stem from the same mindset…a contraceptive (contra + ception = against a beginning) mentality.
No one is claiming this, not in the slightest.
Well, that leaves ALOT to be assumed about this woman. But to keep from getting too deep about her: The Church has no problem with her having sex if her sex-having is had in the natural manner…ordered toward procreation, even if procreation is impossible. (And this assumes much that we probably don’t need to know in this thread.) In having natural sex, the act is only sterile in-so-much as a body part that is naturally ordered toward procreation is not functioning, for whatever reason. But the fullness of each spouse is still presented to the other and the openess to fertility is there in-so-much as the couple would be otherwise open to conception should God intervene on their behalf.
huffingtonpost.com/vicki-larson/are-childfree-couples-doo_b_913051.html
Homosexual men have been molested as children at much higher rates than heterosexual men (35% versus 4% in one study).
Women went to work: ilo.org/public/english/standards/relm/ilc/ilc87/rep-v-1.htm#Figure 1
First documented abortion was 1500BC: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_abortion
The argument is really quite simple, but unfortunately you missed it. We are reasonable creatures. We want to be reasonable. The argument is that a person cannot be reasonable and hold the position that contraception is ok, but homosexual acts are not. Once a person accepts that contraception is ok, they are bound to accept that homosexual acts are ok. The only thing that might stop them from doing so is the Bible. There would be no practical reason to stand on from which to say contraception is wrong though.
I fear you’re wasting your time. ahs is not here to be corrected or debated with, but to have his opinion agreed with (of course, it doesn’t even need saying!) and then for you to help him prove his point, as they stated in their OP.