Definition of a "Catholic"

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An infant is accepted into the Catholic Church. They are rightly called a Catholic. Yet they are also still a catechumen awaiting two other Sacraments of initiation.

Why are the other Sacraments referred to as initiation, if Infant Baptism is considered complete?

I reject the notion that free will is not necessary for a person of the age of reason to be considered initiated into the Catholic Church.

The Catechism makes a distinct condition regarding Infant Baptism.
 
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All of this is your opinion of what makes a person Catholic.

The church teachings are clear. You are Catholic if you are baptized Catholic or if you were baptized outside the church and make a profession of faith. That’s it.

Are there other rites? Yes. Those rites occur after one becomes Catholic.

Why do you insist on claiming the Church teaches what she does not?
 
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At baptism Jesus welcomes us into the Church. He Mark’s our soul with a sign that can not be taken away. We are then Catholic. Confirmation is the sacrament where those born again in baptism receive the Holy Spirit again to give them new strength to be witnesses of Christ and His Church.
 
Because CCC #1231 recognizes a distinction regarding Infant Baptism. It is a preparatory stage of initiation.

So one who, at the age of reason, never accepts the grace of Baptism, is not fully initiated into the Church.

This is not irrelavant.

No matter how much the Church receives someone into the Church, if they always have willfully refused, then they are not a Catholic.
 
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rcwitness said:
No matter how much the Church receives someone into the Church, if they willfully refuse, then they are not a Catholic.
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Please stop trying to turn your opinions into church teaching. You are confusing those non-Catholics/lapsed Catholics who are asking for the teachings of the church. This is not an effective apologetics strategy.
 
CCC1231 “Not only is there a need for instruction after Baptism, but also for the necessary flowering of baptismal grace”. ? What comes after baptism is growth.
 
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rcwitness said:
An infant is accepted into the Catholic Church. They are rightly called a Catholic. Yet they are also still a catechumen awaiting two other Sacraments of initiation.
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No. You completely misunderstand what the catechism is saying. The catechumenate with a small “c” simply means religious instruction.

The Catechumenate with a capital “C” is referring to a specific time during the RCIA for unbaptized people.

Anyone baptized into the Church is a Catholic, Whether they complete their sacraments of initiation or not.
 
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mrsdizzyd said:
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rcwitness:
No matter how much the Church receives someone into the Church, if they willfully refuse, then they are not a Catholic.
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Please stop trying to turn your opinions into church teaching. You are confusing those non-Catholics/lapsed Catholics who are asking for the teachings of the church. This is not an effective apologetics strategy.
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How could my answer possibly be negative to anyone seeking Church Teaching?

What benefit is calling a non believer a Catholic?

Do they want to be called Catholic, while rejecting to accept their Baptismal grace?
 
The grace of Baptism is offered on God’s part, and it is an indelible Mark on their soul. But this grace can and often is rejected by the catechumen.
 
CCC # 837
Fully incorporated into the society of the Church are those who, possessing the Spirit of Christ, accept all the means of salvation given to the Church together with her entire organization, and who - by the bonds constituted by the profession of faith, the sacraments, ecclesiastical government, and communion are joined in the visible structure of the Church of Christ, who rules her through the Supreme Pontiff and the bishops. Even though incorporated into the Church, one who does not however persevere in charity is not saved. He remains indeed in the bosom of the Church, but ‘in body’ not 'in heart.’"
 
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Now you have gone completely off topic to salvation!

The OP ask two specific questions:
KevinK said:
What entitles a person to identify as a “Catholic”? What are the prerequisites to identify as such?
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He did not ask about salvation. He did not ask about confirmation. He did not ask whether or not we agreed.

You are confusing things.
 
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No, I’m referencing what it means to be in the bosom of the Church.

This is under the section heading

THE CHURCH IS CATHOLIC
What does “catholic” mean?

You guys are suggesting Infant Baptism alone constitutes “in the bosom of the Catholic Church”

You may be right. But I think you need more evidence of how the Church defines that. As it stands, I have a valid point.

I’m NOT claiming to be free from misunderatanding.
 
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1267 Baptism makes us members of the Body of Christ: “Therefore . . . we are members one of another.”[71] Baptism incorporates us into the Church. From the baptismal fonts is born the one People of God of the New Covenant, which transcends all the natural or human limits of nations, cultures, races, and sexes: “For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body.”[72]
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1269 Having become a member of the Church, the person baptized belongs no longer to himself, but to him who died and rose for us.[75] From now on, he is called to be subject to others, to serve them in the communion of the Church, and to “obey and submit” to the Church’s leaders,[76] [77] Just as Baptism is the source of responsibilities and duties, the baptized person also enjoys rights within the Church: to receive the sacraments, to be nourished with the Word of God and to be sustained by the other spiritual helps of the Church.
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1273 Incorporated into the Church by Baptism, the faithful have received the sacramental character that consecrates them for Christian religious worship.83 The baptismal seal enables and commits Christians to serve God by a vital participation in the holy liturgy of the Church and to exercise their baptismal priesthood by the witness of holy lives and practical charity.84
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Baptism makes you a member. Everything else you have pointed to occurs after one is already a member.
 
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My point is in regard to Infant Baptism alone. I see a distinction being made in the Catechism regarding Infant Baptism in itself.

You guys may be right. I’m not claiming to be absolutely correct.

I brought my children to be Baptized. And I believe grace was given, and an indelible mark left on them.

But without their hearing and understanding, and then accepting that grace, I would not consider them Catholic.
 
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No. There is no distinction. You wish there to be one.

Canon law also repeats what I have quoted above:
Can. 849 Baptism, the gateway to the sacraments and necessary for salvation by actual reception or at least by desire, is validly conferred only by a washing of true water with the proper form of words. Through baptism men and women are freed from sin, are reborn as children of God, and, configured to Christ by an indelible character, are incorporated into the Church.
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Truly, you are Catholic by your Baptism if you were baptized in the Church or you are Catholic by profession of faith if you were baptized outside the Church.

You will continue to learn and be admitted to the sacraments as you grow in faith, but this occurs after your Catholic baptism and after you are already Catholic.
 
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A person above the age of reason is treated differently. For instance, they generally go through the RCIA process before they are baptized, but they still are not Catholic until they are baptized. It is still the baptism that makes them Catholic.
 
I agree. And I’m not trying to make a mountain out of a silly debate.

You may be correct.

My point, is that until a child can understand and receive/profess the faith, they are incorporated into the Church. After they are made known, they’re met with the Spirit of their Baptism and make a choice of free will to accept or reject that grace. And that grace is always pressing on them, calling and beckoning them to receive.

I see the Catechism as recognizing a necessity to learn the Gospel in order to benefit from it once of the age of reason.

It’s not Magic, yet God does act in the Sacrament.

Its preparatory initiation.

My children are received, but also have the free will to reject when they understand. My daughter has been fully initiated.
 
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