Demanding proof of God

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CarloMagnus

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So, an atheist came up to me the other and demanded that I show the Atheist proof of God’s existence. I told him that the efforts of cause and effect were relevant to the circumstances that require the necessity of a being that would will something from nothing. Yet the atheist states,“This is not proof.”

I’m sure this doesn’t belong here, I’ll be content to know where it does so that I can post these sorts of questions there.

I simply didn’t know what more to say.

Can someone help me? I just don’t know what to say. And I would rather deal with this now before it causes me unnecessary apprehension.

-Karl
 
CarloMagnus said:
So, an atheist came up to me the other and demanded that I show the Atheist proof of God’s existence. I told him that the efforts of cause and effect were relevant to the circumstances that require the necessity of a being that would will something from nothing. Yet the atheist states,“This is not proof.”

I’m sure this doesn’t belong here, I’ll be content to know where it does so that I can post these sorts of questions there.

I simply didn’t know what more to say.

Can someone help me? I just don’t know what to say. And I would rather deal with this now before it causes me unnecessary apprehension.

-Karl
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Lucky person!
 
In one of his talks, Fr. Larry Richards says his proof is that he spends time with God and knows Him. That might not convince an atheist but it sounds good to me.
 
You could read up on miracles, especially ones that have been examined by scientists that haven’t been able to explain it in any other ways (eucharistic miracles, stigmata, cloak of Juan Diego, etc.) However, their idea of “proof” might not be reasonable or possible. If that’s the case, it is their fault, not yours or God’s.
 
CarloMagnus said:
So, an atheist came up to me the other and demanded that I show the Atheist proof of God’s existence. I told him that the efforts of cause and effect were relevant to the circumstances that require the necessity of a being that would will something from nothing. Yet the atheist states,“This is not proof.”

I’m sure this doesn’t belong here, I’ll be content to know where it does so that I can post these sorts of questions there.

I simply didn’t know what more to say.

Can someone help me? I just don’t know what to say. And I would rather deal with this now before it causes me unnecessary apprehension.

-Karl
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Ask the atheist, “What kind of proof?”

Also, ask the atheist if he has proof of his own existence.
 
Atheists don’t want knowledge, or truth. They want certainty. Well, nobody can have that, so pity him and pray for him.

My suspicion is that he’s trying to get you to lose your faith. If he wanted faith, he would say “teach me”. Instead, he’s saying “prove it to me,”, hoping you’ll stumble and then begin to have your own doubts.

Trust me, I’ve gone through my doubting phase(s), and I go through it often. But I keep coming back to Him, no matter what.

Those are my thoughts, anyway.
 
CarloMagnus said:
So, an atheist came up to me the other and demanded that I show the Atheist proof of God’s existence. I told him that the efforts of cause and effect were relevant to the circumstances that require the necessity of a being that would will something from nothing. Yet the atheist states,“This is not proof.”

I’m sure this doesn’t belong here, I’ll be content to know where it does so that I can post these sorts of questions there.

I simply didn’t know what more to say.

Can someone help me? I just don’t know what to say. And I would rather deal with this now before it causes me unnecessary apprehension.

-Karl
Click to expand...
If there was real undeniable proof of God religion would be based on science and not faith. For something to require faith, the proof cannot be there.
 
ccmnxc said:
You could read up on miracles, especially ones that have been examined by scientists that haven’t been able to explain it in any other ways (eucharistic miracles, stigmata, cloak of Juan Diego, etc.) However, their idea of “proof” might not be reasonable or possible. If that’s the case, it is their fault, not yours or God’s.
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Well you could certainly say it is God’s fault for not letting himself be known. If God exists, he obviously has the ability to prove it in an undeniable fashion.
 
When non-believers demand that I show proof of God’s existence, I typically ignore it simply because with that attitude, probably nothing you show them will be proof enough to them and you’d just be wasting your time and your breath. They have to have a heart and mind open enough to receive what you are telling them. (In my opinion, LOL!)
 
Proof of God is all around us. The beauty and the magnificence of the world that we live in is the work of a Supreme creator. All one has to do is be open to His world.

DGB
 
interestedman said:
Well you could certainly say it is God’s fault for not letting himself be known. If God exists, he obviously has the ability to prove it in an undeniable fashion.
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Personally, I believe that God shows his existence every moment of my day. If we choose to ignore those signs, well, then we are like those in Plato’s cave, seeing shadows on the wall from a false light, thinking that it’s reality.

Anyway, just my thoughts.
 
Ask him to prove to you that Uranus, after all, he’s never been there has he? So what if a few scientists say they’ve determined its existence. Maybe they’re just crazy and have faked the pictures. :eek: Likewise, so what if a lot of saints, plus a whole extra portion of un-canonized people have claimed to have visions of God and his angels. Maybe they just pretended to and then staged the miracles. 😃
 
My response:

Sorry I can’t do that. My God does not impose his will upon any of his creation. He allows us the choice to have a relationship with him. If there were to be undeniable proof of his existance then we would have no choice and the relationship would be forced upon us.

If someone chooses to have a relationship with him and that relationship grows and that is a wonderful thing for that individual.
Conversely if someone had the foundation of the relationship without being able to ever chose… Well it would be akin to constantly holding a gun to your head and demanding that we be friends.
 
If he is sincere about wanting to know, you might want to give him CS Lewis’ Mere Christianity". Good common sense Christianity. I find that most atheists you see on the forum here have an extremely rigid faith in atheism and are not really interested in learning anything about Christianity.
 
It is true, that isn’t a “proof” in the strict sense like a mathematical proof. What you put forward was good evidence. And frankly, the atheist doesn’t have “proof” of the non-existence of God either, all he has is evidence as well.

But commonly all the evidence they have to put forward is “the absence of evidence” for God. Which is not evidence at all, because the absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence. For example, we have no evidence that there is gold on the planet Pluto, but does that mean there is no gold on Pluto? of course not.

And frankly, this argument is null to begin with because there IS evidence for the existence of God. There are too many arguments to list here on a forum, just go to www.reasonablefaith.org

In addition, the question is not “Is there proof?” it is “Who has better evidence?”

What your friend did was common among atheists, he tried to shift the burden of evidence to you without responding to your argument. Don’t fall for that. Atheism is NOT an absence of belief. If this was true then you could label animals and infants as atheists. It is an ASSERTION that God does not exist, and worldview that requires arguments just like Christianity.

I really hope this clears some things up.
 
Well you could certainly say it is God’s fault for not letting himself be known. If God exists, he obviously has the ability to prove it in an undeniable fashion.
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I guess you could blame God for not giving undeniable proof. It is my belief, however, that he gives reasonable proof. I like the way Catholic apologist Peter Kreeft puts it. He says that God whispers in your ear then runs away. He wants you to come after Him. We, as humans, need to make an effort to find Him. It speaks of our true love and desire for Him. God doesn’t just want us to “be right.” He wants us to love and desire Him as well. I believe that if God gives undeniable proof to the entire world, many people would feel coerced into “loving” Him. That isn’t what He wants, however. There are also the few who still wouldn’t believe. Then it truly is only their fault.

To the OP, you could also explain how his belief that there is no God requires more faith than yours. If he believes in the Big Bang, then it shows how it is so impossibly unlikely that the universe came together so perfectly for us to live, and more specifically, for him to live, that the chances of it being random chance may as well be zero. If he believes in things like the multiverse theory, well, it has little or no evidence to support it, and it probably never wil have any. That still requires much faith.

Just a heads up, threads on atheism are currently banned. Feel free to continue, but don’t be surprised if the thread is shut down. Feel free to PM me or others on here if you have any more questions.
 
interestedman said:
Well you could certainly say it is God’s fault for not letting himself be known. If God exists, he obviously has the ability to prove it in an undeniable fashion.
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And he does. For millions of Catholics around the world. 👍
 
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